Would the Minister not agree that his calculation on enforcement is not based on actual fact because he has no facts?

Thank you, Ms. Lee. The honourable Minister responsible for the Department of Finance, Mr. Handley.

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. I do not even think of having an enforcement budget here. As I have said before, we have business people who are professional out there. We do have money, an estimate of $100,000 for administration of the tax. For enforcement, no, I do not have a figure for that because I do not anticipate a big problem.

Mr. Speaker, this tax comes into effect next April. We have a number of months before that. We intend to consult widely, and we will certainly have specific information long before the tax is put into place. Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

Thank you, Mr. Handley. The time for oral questions is over. Item 7, written questions. Item 8, replies to written questions. Item 9, replies to opening address. Item 10, petitions. Item 11, reports of standing and special committees. Item 12, reports of committees on the review of bills. Item 13, tabling of documents. Item 14, notices of motion. Item 15, notices of motions for first reading of bills. Item 16, motions. Item 17, first reading of bills. The honourable Member for Hay River South, Mrs. Groenewegen.

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, I move, seconded by the honourable Member for Nahendeh, that Bill 10, An Act to Amend the Adoption Act, be read for the first time. Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

Thank you, Mrs. Groenewegen. The motion is in order. To the motion. All those in favour? Thank you. All those opposed? Thank you. The motion is carried. Bill 10 has had first reading. Item 17, first reading of bills. Item 18, second reading of bills. Item 19, consideration in committee of the whole of bills and other matters. Bill 1, Bill 4, Bill 5, Bill 6, Committee Report 1-14(3), Committee Report 2-14(3), and Committee Report 3-14(3), and by the authority given the Speaker by Motion 4-14(3), the House is resolved in committee of the whole to sit beyond the time of adjournment until the committee is prepared to report, with Mr. Delorey in the chair.

I would like to call the committee to order. We have a number of issues to consider. What is the wish of the committee? Mr. Dent.

Thank you, Mr. Chairman. I would like to recommend that the committee continue consideration of Bill 1 and Committee Reports 1 through 3 concurrently. Specifically, that we deal with the Department of Justice, followed by the Department of Health and Social Services.

Does the committee agree?

We will review the Department of Justice. Does the Minister have any opening comments?

Thank you, Mr. Antoine. Does the chairperson for the Standing Committee on Social Programs have any remarks on the review of the main estimates for the Department of Justice? Mr. Miltenberger.

Thank you, Mr. Chairman. The Standing Committee on Social Programs met on May 31st, 2000, to consider the 2000-2003 business plan and the draft 2000-2001 main estimates for the Department of Justice.

The Standing Committee on Social Programs believes strongly in the merits of the wilderness camps in meeting the needs of adult and young offenders. Members were pleased to hear that subsequent to discussions on the interim appropriation, the Department of Justice made the decision to increase the per diem rate by $6.00 per day per offender when out on the land.

From discussions with the Minister and his officials during the review of the business plans and main estimates it was made apparent that the decision to increase the per diem rate was part of an initial review of the Wilderness Camp Program. Committee members appreciated that this first step of increasing the per diem rate for on the land camp operators was made in advance of the finalization of the overall review of the Wilderness Camp Program.

Committee members are of the opinion that the Wilderness Camp Program must have clearly defined program standards that are effectively communicated to camp operators. This relates to a committee concern that the present system may not provide for a level playing field for all camp operators. Members hope that the department's review of the Wilderness Camp Program will provide for program standards and address the funding concerns that many operators have. This also relates to a concern on the part of committee members that the need for defined program standards, coupled with new camps coming on-line, results in inadequate capital funds dedicated to the Wilderness Camp Program.

Finally, the committee thinks that the review of the wilderness camps must include a rationalization component. Allowing competing camps to be set up in the same area does nothing more than ensure the failure of the two competing camps. It is clear that the limited number of inmates and programming dollars also dictates this rationalization of camp placement. Members of the Standing Committee on Social Programs look forward to reviewing the results of the second phase of the Wilderness Camp Program review in September.

Committee members are concerned that there have been no decisions as of yet on which camp operators will be receiving capital acquisition money from the department. It is recalled by committee members, that during the discussions on the interim appropriation, the capital requirements for the wilderness camps were included because decisions on disbursement were imminent.

In discussions with the Minister and his officials it became apparent a decision had not been made because there were two new operators who had not finalized their service contracts with the department within the expected time frame. This would be an acceptable explanation to committee members, if it did not appear to members that a decision had already been made. The committee was made aware of a camp operator in one Member's constituency who had already been refused capital funding for the 2000-2001 fiscal year. This confirms for committee members that it is necessary to establish program standards for the Wilderness Camp Program that provides for a "level playing field".

Committee members would like to thank the Minister and his officials for examining the reasons behind the under-utilization of the Deh Gah Gotie operated adult wilderness camp and providing a written explanation to the committee.

It is hoped that the department will make every effort to encourage suitable adult offenders to take advantage of the programming available through the Deh Gah Gotie Wilderness Camp.

Committee members had difficulty in accepting the "proposed" name for the new correctional facility in Yellowknife. Committee members thought that it was inappropriate to include a local geographic distinction in naming an institution that is territorial in nature.

The committee was pleased to hear from the Minister and his officials that the name "North Slave Correctional Centre" was only being used to identify the project. The standing committee looks forward to the recommendations of the departmental committee that is expected to report on prospective names for the new correctional facility in July 2000.

Members of the Standing Committee on Social Programs support the establishment of a stand-alone probation service for the Northwest Territories. The advantages are twofold. The separation of the probation task from the social service task will improve social service delivery at the local level and will also provide increased sentencing options for the judiciary and community justice committees.

In the opinion of the committee members, there is a need to make a decision on the placement of the probation officers in the near future. Even though committee members would like to see probation officers in as many communities in the Northwest Territories as possible, it is realized that this is not probable. Therefore, to ensure that our employees (probation officers) have stability in their lives, the department should make their decision on community placement and live with it in the interim. Committee members are of the opinion that opportunities to adjust the placement of probation officers will present themselves in the future through resignations and internal competitions.

Some members were concerned that the way departments presented information confused Northerners in that clear distinctions were not made between constituencies and administrative districts. Committee members would appreciate future business plans and main estimates establishing a distinction between constituencies and administrative districts.

The Standing Committee on Social Programs was pleased to hear the Minister's commitment to bring forward comprehensive Human Rights Legislation by November of this year. The committee looks forward to its initial review of a legislative proposal on new Human Rights Legislation in the near future.

As this is the only Canadian jurisdiction without Human Rights Legislation, the members of the Standing Committee on Social Programs view the passage and implementation of such legislation as one of the most important issues facing the Assembly.

Committee members believe that the department has started down the right track in developing relevant adult inmate programming. It is unfortunate, over the last decade, that the current physical condition of Northwest Territories correctional centres and inmate overcrowding has resulted in dedicated program delivery space having to be utilised for inmate bed space.

Committee members cannot accept the diminishment of the educational component, as part of a priority setting exercise, in the development of programming for inmates in the Northwest Territories correctional system. Inmate programming that focuses on behaviour modification is important, but committee members believe that a holistic approach must be taken.

Committee members believe that in order to have lasting success in lowering recidivism rates it is important to treat the full spectrum of inmate problems. Anger management and cognitive skills development programs are important treatments but do not deal with all of the underlying conditions that lead to the commission of crime in the Northwest Territories.

Chronic unemployment in the small communities coupled with a low literacy rate that severely limits resident mobility, creates a scenario that lends itself to despair. When we release an inmate back into his or her home community we are releasing them back into the same cycle that caused them to offend in the first place. In the minds of committee members, it is very important to offer offenders as many options and tools as possible, in order to give the offender a chance to make positive life choices.

Members of the committee are becoming more aware of the terrible toll that illiteracy causes in the Northwest Territories. Offenders who cannot find gainful employment upon release, because of poor literacy skills, are more likely to follow the same path and return as inmates of the Northwest Territories correctional service. If an inmate cannot function in the outside world the cycle of offending will repeat itself.

To take advantage of adult basic education programs that are offered by the college in some of our communities, a minimum literacy level is required. If the offender being released has acquired those basic literacy skills in a correctional facility they have another positive life choice they can make when released.

Members of the committee appreciated being supplied with further information on inmate programming. However, committee members still believe that an emphasis has to be placed on educational programming that targets basic literacy skills for offenders. There is some question in committee members' minds as to whether the level of educational programming available in territorial correctional facilities meets Corrections Canada requirements. If these standards are not met, the chances of federal offenders doing their time in our facilities are reduced. Members would appreciate the department investigating this concern.

Finally, the committee is pleased that the department has developed special programming for those inmates severely affected by FAS. It is apparent from discussions with corrections officials that this programming has minimised conflict between FAS inmates and other inmates and staff. This has reduced stress for all concerned within the institution.

Recommendation 1

The Standing Committee on Social Programs recommends that the Minister responsible for Justice instruct the department to place a greater emphasis on literacy in developing inmate programming.

Members of the Standing Committee on Social Programs anticipate being kept apprised on any further developments on a stand-alone courthouse. Mr. Chairman, my colleague, Mr. Bell, will now conclude the reading of the report.

Thank you, Mr. Miltenberger. Mr. Bell.

Thank you, Mr. Chairman. Mr. Chairman,

Committee members believe this is an area in which the department needs to concentrate more resources. The information on First Nations policing in the business plans and the main estimates was poorly presented. Members could not clearly establish linkages between the various pots of funding available to this activity. Members appreciated the explanations provided by the department and look forward to a better presentation of the information in the next business planning cycle, including a breakdown by community, as to where the funding was expended.

The discussions with the Minister and his officials left the impression that some funding from the federal Solicitor General was not available last fiscal year due to the inability of the two departments to come to a funding agreement. It is understood that negotiations are going better this year. The Standing Committee on Social Programs looks forward to being informed of the successful conclusion of a funding agreement with the Solicitor General.

Members were very concerned that the department could offer no explanation why there was a significant increase in the numbers of incarcerated young offenders last year.

Committee members understand that the information systems for offenders and the courts are being replaced this year. The department advised the committee that the previous information systems did not have the capacity to track any of the mitigating factors that may have lead to the sudden increase in young offenders in custody.

Members were disturbed that the department could not discount any of the scenarios that were offered as possible explanations because of the poor quality of information that the information systems provided. Committee members were pleased to hear that the department is planning to do a manual review of the documentation behind this sudden increase of young offenders in custody. The committee looks forward to being informed about the results of the review and being supplied with a copy of the report.

The inability of the information systems to provide relevant information on the reasons for the increase in young offenders in custody does not inspire confidence on the part of the committee. Members question the ability of the department to track adult offenders or to do long term operational planning. This emphasizes the need for quality information systems, which provide sufficient data for analysis. It is hoped that the new Corrections Offender Management System (COMS) and the new information system for the courts will meet this need. Committee members plan to monitor this situation.