This is page numbers 717 - 740 of the Hansard for the 14th Assembly, 5th Session. The original version can be accessed on the Legislative Assembly's website or by contacting the Legislative Assembly Library. The word of the day was policy.

Topics

Further Return To Question 241-14(5): Review Of The Business Incentive Policy
Question 241-14(5): Review Of The Business Incentive Policy
Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 728

Jim Antoine Nahendeh

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, our intention is to go ahead with the meeting with the Construction Association. We have not received any formal request not to have this meeting, so at this point in time, we are still going to have this meeting. The intention is to listen to them. We also would like to state to them clearly the reasons why we are doing what we are doing as a Cabinet in regard to waiving the BIP on the second phase of this project. Thank you.

Further Return To Question 241-14(5): Review Of The Business Incentive Policy
Question 241-14(5): Review Of The Business Incentive Policy
Item 6: Oral Questions

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The Speaker

The Speaker Tony Whitford

Thank you, Mr. Minister. Supplementary, Ms. Lee.

Supplementary To Question 241-14(5): Review Of The Business Incentive Policy
Question 241-14(5): Review Of The Business Incentive Policy
Item 6: Oral Questions

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Sandy Lee

Sandy Lee Range Lake

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, I am still not hearing from the Minister that the government representatives who will be at the meeting are open to alternative suggestions in a real way, and not a case where the government is going to tell them what they think and that is that and the meeting is over. In which case, why bother? Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

Supplementary To Question 241-14(5): Review Of The Business Incentive Policy
Question 241-14(5): Review Of The Business Incentive Policy
Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 729

The Speaker

The Speaker Tony Whitford

Thank you, Ms. Lee. The honourable Deputy Premier, Mr. Antoine.

Further Return To Question 241-14(5): Review Of The Business Incentive Policy
Question 241-14(5): Review Of The Business Incentive Policy
Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 729

Jim Antoine Nahendeh

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, I would like to meet with the Construction Association myself and hear direction from them, their concerns, and they could hear directly from us our concerns. The meeting is still going ahead, as far as I am concerned.

This is a Cabinet decision, so we have to stick by this decision. The bids are out. We will know by the end of this month what kind of response there is to these bids. We are talking close to the $20 million range. Not too many companies up here could operate at that level. There are very few. It is a 15 percent advantage we are talking about here. We would like to see what is available in the market.

I think the Ordinary Members would also like to see that. We talk about numbers and we are talking about deficits. We are talking about a lot of things here that are very important to us. We are talking about public money. We are trying to do the best we can here as a government, to see what kind of dollars we could get out of the process we are trying at this point in time. Thank you.

Further Return To Question 241-14(5): Review Of The Business Incentive Policy
Question 241-14(5): Review Of The Business Incentive Policy
Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 729

The Speaker

The Speaker Tony Whitford

Thank you, Mr. Minister. Final supplementary, Ms. Lee.

Supplementary To Question 241-14(5): Review Of The Business Incentive Policy
Question 241-14(5): Review Of The Business Incentive Policy
Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 729

Sandy Lee

Sandy Lee Range Lake

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, yesterday and today, the information we heard from the government is that there is really no proof or facts or evidence to show that the BIP is the problem. Would the Minister have any better information of what the impact of BIP is on this proposal that led them to cancel it for their own benefit? Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

Supplementary To Question 241-14(5): Review Of The Business Incentive Policy
Question 241-14(5): Review Of The Business Incentive Policy
Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 729

The Speaker

The Speaker Tony Whitford

Thank you, Ms. Lee. The Deputy Premier, Mr. Antoine.

Further Return To Question 241-14(5): Review Of The Business Incentive Policy
Question 241-14(5): Review Of The Business Incentive Policy
Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 729

Jim Antoine Nahendeh

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. The issue is dollars here, Mr. Speaker. As we all know, the history of this project, it started off as a $35.2 million project. We just came here to the House a couple of months ago for another $5.6 million for the first phase. We are told that the estimates for the second phase, we might have to come back here for another $4 million or $5 million. We knew it was very tough to do that last time, so we have to look at all the options.

One of the options is to try taking the BIP policy away for this one-time shot to see what kind of proposal, what kind of bids we receive, not only from the northern companies but from the southern. This does not preclude the northern companies to bid as well. They are available to bid if they want. Thank you.

Further Return To Question 241-14(5): Review Of The Business Incentive Policy
Question 241-14(5): Review Of The Business Incentive Policy
Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 729

The Speaker

The Speaker Tony Whitford

Thank you, Mr. Minister. Item 6, oral questions. The honourable Member for Hay River North, Mr. Delorey.

Question 242-14(5): Business Incentive Policy
Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 729

Paul Delorey

Paul Delorey Hay River North

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, in response to one of the questions asked by my colleague, Mrs. Groenewegen, on this BIP policy, I heard the Minister answer that this is a North Slave Corrections issue. I would tend to argue with that.

I would tend to argue that this is a BIP policy issue. You cannot take the BIP policy and just set it aside and make it a North Slave Corrections issue, no more than you can make it any other issue. There are other issues at stake right now with the BIP policy that nobody is wanting to look at because supposedly, our hands are tied by the BIP policy.

Now, either we have a BIP policy or we do not. If we do not have a BIP policy, then no BIP policy should be used in the contract, and just say it only applies to this one project because tbeadchat is very unfair to the whole of the Northwest Territories.

We are expending taxpayers' dollars, and if we can justify spending extra money to keep the BIP policy in place in one area, we can do it in other areas. Is the BIP policy in place or is it not, Mr. Speaker?

-- Applause

Question 242-14(5): Business Incentive Policy
Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 729

The Speaker

The Speaker Tony Whitford

Since there was no direction as to where this was going to go, I will direct the question to the Deputy Premier, Mr. Antoine.

Return To Question 242-14(5): Business Incentive Policy
Question 242-14(5): Business Incentive Policy
Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 729

Jim Antoine Nahendeh

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, I take the honourable Member's point. I understand it very well. I have to stand by the Cabinet decision at this point in time, but yes, the BIP policy still applies. For this one part of the North Slave Correctional Centre, the phase two portion of it, we have waived the BIP. It was a Cabinet decision to do that to try to entertain what kinds of bids we would get. At the end of the day, we may not get what we had hoped to get. We still may have to come back here for a supplementary appropriation anyway, but we just wanted to try this on this one issue.

The Government of the Northwest Territories has been strongly demanding and encouraging companies doing business in the Northwest Territories to spend in the North and buy in the North, and we will continue to do so. We have always done that. We will continue to do so. The Government of the Northwest Territories has and will continue to promote northern business in its development.

However, these agreements are not intended or written to be applied at any cost. Is it applicable at any cost? We have to ask that very important question. If northern companies cannot or fail to be competitive with certain parameters, then Cabinet should have that authority and obligation to take necessary actions at that point in time.

At this moment, we have decided that the numbers are estimated to come high, so let's waive the BIP and see what kind of bids we will receive. The bids will be received at the end of the month, so at that point in time, we will know if what we are trying to do is going to work and save us some dollars here in the North. Thank you.

Return To Question 242-14(5): Business Incentive Policy
Question 242-14(5): Business Incentive Policy
Item 6: Oral Questions

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The Speaker

The Speaker Tony Whitford

Thank you, Mr. Deputy Premier. Supplementary, Mr. Delorey.

Supplementary To Question 242-14(5): Business Incentive Policy
Question 242-14(5): Business Incentive Policy
Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 730

Paul Delorey

Paul Delorey Hay River North

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, in the answers to these questions, we seem to be getting more confused. On one hand, we are saying we are doing this to try and save money, but on the other hand, we are going to review every project now to see whether we are saving money by using the BIP or not using the BIP. That is what I am hearing.

Right now, we are not willing to look at any other project except this one. There is a contradiction here. The public has to know, are we spending extra government money to keep this BIP in place? Why should this project be different than any other? If it is only a matter of spending extra money because we want to keep the BIP in place, then I guess that is our policy. However, if it is wrong for one project, it should be wrong for all of them, so let's do one or the other.

Supplementary To Question 242-14(5): Business Incentive Policy
Question 242-14(5): Business Incentive Policy
Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 730

The Speaker

The Speaker Tony Whitford

Thank you, Mr. Delorey. There was not a clear question there, but Mr. Deputy Premier, it is directed to you.

Further Return To Question 242-14(5): Business Incentive Policy
Question 242-14(5): Business Incentive Policy
Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 730

Jim Antoine Nahendeh

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, as I said earlier to the previous Member on the BIP policy review, because there is a review underway and there is a decision paper that is going to Cabinet at the end of the month with the changes with the revised Business Incentive Policy, I would ask for your patience in awaiting this new, revised BIP policy. There will be opportunity, if a Cabinet decision is made, that we will share this information with you on the other side of the House for your comments and perhaps some suggestions at this stage.

I agree. It is a BIP policy. It has been around for a number of years. The intent in the beginning of this Business Incentive Policy was to help, enhance and protect our companies that are in the North, but we have a booming economy here in Yellowknife and certain areas, like in Inuvik. We have to review it very carefully. Thank you.

Further Return To Question 242-14(5): Business Incentive Policy
Question 242-14(5): Business Incentive Policy
Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 730

The Speaker

The Speaker Tony Whitford

Thank you, Mr. Deputy Premier. Supplementary, Mr. Delorey.

Supplementary To Question 242-14(5): Business Incentive Policy
Question 242-14(5): Business Incentive Policy
Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 730

Paul Delorey

Paul Delorey Hay River North

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, as a Member of this government, I would gladly offer my patience to the Minister in waiting to try to get this thing addressed, but the people who are phoning me constantly on this issue do not like that answer when I say be patient with me, trust us, we will do a good job of it. It just does not work that way.

In another area of the BIP, I would like to have the Minister define what local means. Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

Supplementary To Question 242-14(5): Business Incentive Policy
Question 242-14(5): Business Incentive Policy
Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 730

The Speaker

The Speaker Tony Whitford

Thank you, Mr. Delorey. The honourable Deputy Premier, Mr. Antoine.

Further Return To Question 242-14(5): Business Incentive Policy
Question 242-14(5): Business Incentive Policy
Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 730

Jim Antoine Nahendeh

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, there is probably some real, more defined way of doing it someplace in the government's contracting policy, but for me, I would have to ask the appropriate Minister of Public Works and Services to provide me with the proper definition of what local means in terms of the BIP policy. I would like to get back to the Member on that. Thank you.

Further Return To Question 242-14(5): Business Incentive Policy
Question 242-14(5): Business Incentive Policy
Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 730

The Speaker

The Speaker Tony Whitford

Thank you, Mr. Minister. Final supplementary, Mr. Delorey.

Supplementary To Question 242-14(5): Business Incentive Policy
Question 242-14(5): Business Incentive Policy
Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 730

Paul Delorey

Paul Delorey Hay River North

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, I would like to also have an explanation as to how the 15 percent is administered under the BIP. Is the 15 percent taken on one particular bid and then applied to all tenders, so that the 15 percent is actually affecting every bid in the same way, or is it taken on each individual contract and 15 percent from there? It seems to me it would be more fair if whatever percentage they used, whatever bid they used, if that same amount is applied to every contract so that every contractor is affected the same way.

I would like an explanation as to how that 15 percent is arrived at. Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

Supplementary To Question 242-14(5): Business Incentive Policy
Question 242-14(5): Business Incentive Policy
Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 730

The Speaker

The Speaker Tony Whitford

Thank you, Mr. Delorey. The honourable Deputy Premier, Mr. Antoine.

Supplementary To Question 242-14(5): Business Incentive Policy
Question 242-14(5): Business Incentive Policy
Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 730

Jim Antoine Nahendeh

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, I would like to refer this to the Minister of Public Works and Services. He is more hands-on with this. Thank you.