Thank you, Mr. Chairman. I guess it's a bit of a misnomer then. I know the Finance Minister spoke about this new spending -- $2.8 million -- on compensation benefits increases, but if it's something that has already happened, it's not really that we are spending more money or is it in the budget address just because we are spending that on an ongoing basis? Is that why it's in the budget address? Thank you.

Thank you, Mr. Ramsay. Mr. Miltenberger.

Thank you, Mr. Chairman. Mr. Chairman, it's a four-year contract and, like most collective agreements, there are negotiated benefits and increases that are part of the Collective Agreement. Thank you.

Thank you, Mr. Miltenberger. Mr. Ramsay, thank you. General comments. I have next, Mrs. Groenewegen.

Thank you, Mr. Chairman. I have a few questions for the Minister this afternoon. The Minister has made reference to our desire as a government to train and retain and enhance the professional skills of northern nurses. It seems like although that is what we want to do, anybody who embarks on this seems to run into a lot of obstacles. I am speaking specifically to the attempt to train nurse practitioners to work in the communities.

It seems like the rules and the policies that are put in place around some of these things actually serve as a bit of a deterrent to anybody wanting to do it. The Nurse Practitioner Training Program is offered here in Yellowknife, it started in September 2004. The enhancement to this particular training program was that the nurses that were in training, who would already have a considerable amount of experience, would receive 100 percent of their salary while they are taking this additional training. But it was a long trail of negotiations for the people in order to iron out all of the hurdles and everything as they went along.

One of the issues that was an obstacle is the cost of setting up a second home while they are here taking this training in Yellowknife. I would like to ask the Minister, is he aware of cases where there are nurse practitioners who are here for a short term, who are actually provided accommodation at no cost, that are from outside of the Northwest Territories. Thank you.

Thank you, Mrs. Groenewegen. Mr. Miltenberger.

Thank you, Mr. Chairman. Mr. Chairman, I just have to ask the Member for some clarification. Is she asking about fully-licensed practicing nurse practitioners that we have hired, or on training? Thank you, Mr. Chairman.

Thank you, Mr. Miltenberger. Mrs. Groenewegen.

Thank you, Mr. Chairman. Mr. Chairman, there is a program called Introduction to the Nurse Practitioner Program, and I believe that there are people who access this program who are from outside of the Northwest Territories. It is a short-term program for which housing is provided to the candidates at no cost. Thank you, Mr. Chairman.

Thank you, Mrs. Groenewegen. Mr. Miltenberger.

Thank you, Mr. Chairman. Mr. Chairman, I can't answer that question, but I will commit to get the information. Thank you.

Thank you, Mr. Miltenberger. Mrs. Groenewegen.

Thank you for that, Mr. Chairman. People who do come here for the Nurse Practitioner Program are expected to maintain their residence where they are from -- it would make sense if they are a mature, middle-age person that's been practicing already, that they are going to probably already have a home established -- then they come here to have this training and they are expected to maintain two residences. Even MLAs aren't expected to do that.

If that were a deterrent to being able to partake in this, it seems like it would be small cost to pay -- considering the few people in this program -- it seems like it would be a small price for someone to pay to see an experienced nurse enhance their professional training to become nurse practitioners. I would like to ask the Minister if his department has given any thought to smoothing the path, so to speak, for some of these training programs that would ultimately result in us having a larger inventory, a larger group of trained northern professionals with skills to go back and service their communities. Thank you.

Thank you, Mrs. Groenewegen. Mr. Miltenberger.

Thank you, Mr. Chairman. Mr. Chairman, we are thoroughly committed -- as the Member is herself -- to the whole concept of the advancement of the profession of nursing practitioners. It hasn't been without its bumps in the road and there are still some outstanding issues.

We have tried to address them one by one. In this case, there have been discussions with the union -- both unions -- involved to indicate to them that under the Collective Agreement, when you take education leave, there are certain criteria we are bound by that can only be changed, I understand, if it's a negotiated agreement, through collective bargaining.

We have tried to do many other things, like topping up the salaries to 100 percent and assisting with all other outside costs when possible. But that is, as the Member has indicated, still an issue. Thank you.

Thank you, Mr. Miltenberger. Mrs. Groenewegen.

Thank you, Mr. Chairman. Another concern I have with respect to the Nurse Practitioner Program is that after the training is received, there is a return of service agreement, a contract that needs to be entered into. Positions are not that plentiful for nurse practitioners. Another deterrent I guess to experienced northern nurses taking this is the fact that theoretically there is no assurance that they can return to their original community to fulfill that role as a nurse practitioner. If there is no job open, what are they supposed to do with those skills?

They are required to have a return of service, but if they can't go back to their own community, if the department can't employ and accommodate their new skills in the community that they are from, I think that that would be a huge obstacle to wanting to do that. They could end up anyplace in the Territories where they had an opening for a nurse practitioner. Thank you.

Thank you, Mrs. Groenewegen. Mr. Miltenberger.

Thank you, Mr. Chairman. Mr. Chairman, the intent is to the greatest extent that we can, as a system, have returning nurse practitioners be able to return to their home community.

We are currently in the process, as the Member will see when the document about the facilities comes out, that we are setting in benchmarks and services mixes that builds in for the first time in a formal way the number of nurse practitioners that were suggested be in communities based on the size of the community.

There are a number of things that we have to do. We have to look at making sure the job description is properly classified to reflect the new level of skill and scope of practice and experience that the nurse practitioners will be providing, to make sure that there is the funding to cover off the difference between the position they are in and the upgrade to that new position.

We are definitely working on being able to identify and deal with that issue. There are going to be finite limits to that though, that if a community is entitled to or is deemed to be appropriate, that they have, say, four nurse practitioners, once those four positions are filled and there are no vacancies, then we are going to be limited. But we are not at that point. We are trying to get to the point where we are, in fact, identifying positions. For example, in the Member's community, there is a need for more than the one that is currently there; a nurse practitioner. The intent is to expand that service. Thank you.

Thank you, Mr. Miltenberger. Mrs. Groenewegen.

Thank you, Mr. Chairman. Also, just on the point of fairness and how we treat our health care professionals. The Minister made reference to the two different unions and the two different circumstances under which nurses and health care professionals work in the Northwest Territories and the desire for parity. I was just wondering if the Minister could update us on how we are doing between the UNW and Public Service. Whether there has been any recent movement there or negotiations or expressions of people being satisfied or dissatisfied with the fact that, at the end of the day, after the government had wanted to roll all the health care professionals in under one employer, that that was not accomplished for monetary reasons. I would just

like to know where we are at with that. Thank you, Mr. Chairman.

Thank you, Mrs. Groenewegen. Mr. Miltenberger.

Thank you, Mr. Chairman. Mr. Chairman, clearly that is an initiative or a decision that was made that had certain outcomes and I have asked that we revisit that. Yes, there were monetary considerations initially, but over the course of the last few years, through successive negotiations and collective agreements, we have come close to spending the money anyway.

There are still the outstanding issues of two separate collective bargaining units. I have asked that we revisit that and the department is doing an analysis to pull together numbers and the papers to see how we can go forward on this. My own intuitive sense is that it should be revisited. Thank you.