Municipal and Community Affairs, defer page 3-2 and go to 3-4, Activity Summary, Municipal and Community Affairs, Regional Operations, Infrastructure Investment Summary, Total Infrastructure Investment Summary: $28.09 million. Mr. Bromley.
Debates of Oct. 15th, 2008
This is page numbers 1655 to 1688 of the Hansard for the 16th Assembly, 2nd Session. The original version can be accessed on the Legislative Assembly's website or by contacting the Legislative Assembly Library. The word of the day was summary.
Topics
Tabled Document 93-16(2) NWT Capital Estimates 2009–2010
Consideration in Committee of the Whole of Bills and Other Matters
Tabled Document 93-16(2) NWT Capital Estimates 2009–2010
Consideration in Committee of the Whole of Bills and Other Matters
Bob Bromley Weledeh
Thank you, Mr. Chairman. I believe I’ve raised this before, but I do have concerns about the high costs of our data management systems, which seem to involve very large capital costs. If I’m correct that it’s flowing in this department, technology service centre — oh, sorry; I had that wrong. That would be under the Department of Public Works and Services. I’ll hold the question until then.
Tabled Document 93-16(2) NWT Capital Estimates 2009–2010
Consideration in Committee of the Whole of Bills and Other Matters
The Chair David Krutko
Thank you, Mr. Bromley. We’re on page 3-4, Municipal and Community Affairs, Regional Operations, Infrastructure Investment Summary, Total Infrastructure Investment Summary: $28.09 million.
Department of Municipal and Community
Affairs, Activity Summary, Regional Operations, Infrastructure Investment Summary, Total Infrastructure Investment Summary: $28.09 million, approved.
Tabled Document 93-16(2) NWT Capital Estimates 2009–2010
Consideration in Committee of the Whole of Bills and Other Matters
The Chair David Krutko
We can go back to page 3-2, Municipal and Community Affairs, Department Summary, Infrastructure Investment Summary, Total Infrastructure Investment Summary: $28.09 million.
Department of Municipal and Community
Affairs, Department Summary, Infrastructure Investment Summary, Total Infrastructure Investment Summary: $28.09 million, approved.
Tabled Document 93-16(2) NWT Capital Estimates 2009–2010
Consideration in Committee of the Whole of Bills and Other Matters
The Chair David Krutko
Dealing with the next department, Public Works and Services,
I can refer you to page 4-4. Public Works and Services, Activity Summary, Asset Management, Infrastructure Investment Summary, Total Infrastructure Investment Summary: $17.22 million. Mr. Bromley.
Tabled Document 93-16(2) NWT Capital Estimates 2009–2010
Consideration in Committee of the Whole of Bills and Other Matters
Bob Bromley Weledeh
Thank you, Mr. Chairman. It’s actually another couple of pages before I get to it.
Tabled Document 93-16(2) NWT Capital Estimates 2009–2010
Consideration in Committee of the Whole of Bills and Other Matters
Tabled Document 93-16(2) NWT Capital Estimates 2009–2010
Consideration in Committee of the Whole of Bills and Other Matters
Jane Groenewegen Hay River South
Thank you, Mr. Chairman. Can we get some more information on the proposed facility? Oh, we’re on Public Works now, right? Okay; good. The proposed facility for Inuvik for multi-use facility and records: what’s the use of that building going to be?
Tabled Document 93-16(2) NWT Capital Estimates 2009–2010
Consideration in Committee of the Whole of Bills and Other Matters
Tabled Document 93-16(2) NWT Capital Estimates 2009–2010
Consideration in Committee of the Whole of Bills and Other Matters
Aumond
Thank you, Mr. Chair. The purpose of the Inuvik office complex records storage facility is to house government employees who were in the Perry Building, which had to be vacated in early 2007 because of structural problems. They have now been put into leased accommodations, and they’re jammed in there pretty tight.
The purpose is also to move people from MACA who are in a current MACA facility, which is a good old trailer about 25 or 30 years old, and also to accommodate a health clinic. Then there’s a separate building that’s just for paper storage. It also houses the regional data centre, which was in the Perry Building. So it will include employees from Public Works, MACA, Health and Social Services, Education, Culture and Employment.
Tabled Document 93-16(2) NWT Capital Estimates 2009–2010
Consideration in Committee of the Whole of Bills and Other Matters
Tabled Document 93-16(2) NWT Capital Estimates 2009–2010
Consideration in Committee of the Whole of Bills and Other Matters
Tom Beaulieu Tu Nedhe
Thank you, Mr. Chair. Just a quick question on whether or not the department has a policy on lease versus build.
Tabled Document 93-16(2) NWT Capital Estimates 2009–2010
Consideration in Committee of the Whole of Bills and Other Matters
Tabled Document 93-16(2) NWT Capital Estimates 2009–2010
Consideration in Committee of the Whole of Bills and Other Matters
Aumond
Yes, we do, Mr. Chair.
Tabled Document 93-16(2) NWT Capital Estimates 2009–2010
Consideration in Committee of the Whole of Bills and Other Matters
Tom Beaulieu Tu Nedhe
Could I get a quick explanation of what the process is to determine lease versus build?
Tabled Document 93-16(2) NWT Capital Estimates 2009–2010
Consideration in Committee of the Whole of Bills and Other Matters
Aumond
We have a policy where if we are going to lease office space, we have to go through a financial analysis to estimate the construction cost versus the estimated lease cost over, say, a 20 year period if that’s what the term of the lease would be. Then we do a net present value of the cash or the money that would be applied to either construction or lease.
In this case that was applied and based on the information that we had over the 20 year life of the lease. It would be about $38.6 million more to lease the facility over 20 years than to construct it ourselves.
Tabled Document 93-16(2) NWT Capital Estimates 2009–2010
Consideration in Committee of the Whole of Bills and Other Matters
Tabled Document 93-16(2) NWT Capital Estimates 2009–2010
Consideration in Committee of the Whole of Bills and Other Matters
Tom Beaulieu Tu Nedhe
Yes. I have a question on this specific facility. What’s the size in square footage?
Tabled Document 93-16(2) NWT Capital Estimates 2009–2010
Consideration in Committee of the Whole of Bills and Other Matters
Tabled Document 93-16(2) NWT Capital Estimates 2009–2010
Consideration in Committee of the Whole of Bills and Other Matters
Aumond
Thank you, Mr. Chair. The total area for the office building is going to be about 3,575 square metres, and the record storage is going to be about 793 square metres.
Tabled Document 93-16(2) NWT Capital Estimates 2009–2010
Consideration in Committee of the Whole of Bills and Other Matters
Tabled Document 93-16(2) NWT Capital Estimates 2009–2010
Consideration in Committee of the Whole of Bills and Other Matters
David Krutko Mackenzie Delta
I have a similar question on this item. I know for a fact there was a request for proposal for an office space with the option to lease/purchase, but that fell by way of financial or legal ramifications for doing that. But there was a lot of emphasis and effort put out by the private sector to look at this request for proposal. They took the time to develop the proposal, looked at the lease arrangements, and looked at the different options. They did have a building designed and everything else.
We also have the private sector that provides office space in Inuvik, where they made a lot of capital investment with millions of dollars. As a government don’t we have a policy on market disruption? Also, what are we doing to allow for the private sector to provide such accommodation as the facility we’re already leasing? I’d like to ask: was that ever taken into consideration?
Also, in regard to the request for proposal that was previously called for, do those groups still have an option to consider the possibility of building a facility and leasing it back to this government?
Tabled Document 93-16(2) NWT Capital Estimates 2009–2010
Consideration in Committee of the Whole of Bills and Other Matters
Aumond
The Member is correct. There was an RFP that the department put out last year. There was no response, for the reasons the Member raised. We did however get an unsolicited proposal from one of the proponents to build an office building and lease it. We used that as the basis to do the least cost scenario versus leasing or owning. As I indicated earlier, it was significantly less expensive for us to build and own the building ourselves.
I guess with respect to market disruption, we are not proposing to take anybody who was not in the Perry Building or in leased space into the new office complex. We’re only going to be accommodating those employees who were in the Perry Building and displaced when that building was closed and not people who are already in other government facilities.
We lease about 93 per cent of our office space in Inuvik. With construction of this building we’ll have a more balanced portfolio, but we will not be moving people out of leases who were in those buildings and who would otherwise be in the Perry Building. We’re just moving the people who were in the Perry Building, which has since been closed — other than Public Works, which is in there now on the bottom floor — and taking people from MACA, which is in an old government office, and people who are currently in Health and Social Services, who may move in and provide a client space there. We’re not going to be leasing any less space than we were prior to the Perry Building shutting down.
Tabled Document 93-16(2) NWT Capital Estimates 2009–2010
Consideration in Committee of the Whole of Bills and Other Matters
David Krutko Mackenzie Delta
In regard to the cost per square foot is there an actual number for what the cost per square foot is going to be for this government facility
versus the request for proposal of the facility — the request that did go out in regard to the cost per square foot — as to the private sector building it versus the government building it?
Tabled Document 93-16(2) NWT Capital Estimates 2009–2010
Consideration in Committee of the Whole of Bills and Other Matters
Aumond
We could provide that information — I don’t have it with me today — on what the cost per square foot is for this building. I could not tell you what the cost per square foot would be for the proposals that weren’t received in the RFP.