Good afternoon, colleagues. Welcome back to the Chamber. Orders of the Day. Item 2, Ministers’ statements. The honourable Minister of Municipal and Community Affairs, Mr. Robert McLeod.

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. I am pleased to provide my colleagues with an update on the recent realignment of the School of Community Government, located in the Department of Municipal and Community Affairs.

First started in 1999, the School of Community Government was established to suit the unique needs and requirements of community government staff. Programming was designed to be relevant, specific to the mandate of community governments and provide practical experience. Courses were developed in a modular format and designed to be delivered in a community or regional centre, thereby reducing the cost of travel and time away from family, home and place of employment. This approach was unique to the North and provided education and training opportunities not available through other northern institutions.

The model first put in place in 1999 is still in place today and has proven to be extremely effective in removing many of the barriers community government staff had identified in taking advantage of other educational opportunities.

Over the past years the School of Community Government has delivered training to more than 2,700 community government employees in order to build local capacity to deliver quality municipal

programs and services. The School of Community Government training is provided to a wide range of municipal staff, including mayors and councils, senior administrative officers, finance managers, lands officers, community firefighters and water treatment plant operators. The goal of the training is to build relevant skills and practical experience that community government employees can apply directly to their workplace.

By working with national and territorial partners, the School of Community Government achieves its objectives through an integrated training framework that is based on an assessment of community needs and priorities and delivered to an industry standard. Upon successful completion of training, community government staff participants achieve a recognized certification in their field.

Through a recent realignment Municipal and Community Affairs has established School of Community Government staff positions in four regional centres to continue to improve the school’s ability to build community capacity. These positions are assisting communities by developing focused training plans and through the provision of general support to community governments in establishing human resource development strategies.

As part of the realignment the department is focusing its efforts to support new community government responsibilities and authorities under federal/territorial infrastructure programs and on those areas that support health, safety and infrastructure responsibilities of community governments.

The School of Community Government will continue to work closely with Aurora College on shared course deliveries and instruction, program certification and facility use. This partnership is an important success factor that helps contribute to the goal of improving community capacity.

Members of the 16

Legislative Assembly have

emphasized the need for sustainable communities. This strategic realignment of training and development resources will serve to strengthen the skills and abilities of community government staff and in the long term will establish strong, independent communities.

Thank you, Mr. McLeod. The honourable Minister of Education, Culture and Employment, Mr. Lafferty.

Mahsi. Mr. Speaker, 2008 is the 40

anniversary celebration of Aurora

College. On September 12, graduates, faculty and supporters from past and present gathered at the Legislative Assembly to remember the past 40 years of the college and look towards the future. Throughout the year the celebrations will continue at each of the campuses.

The college has come a long way since 1968, when a single vocational centre was formed in Fort Smith. People travelled from all over the North, including what is now Nunavut, for the opportunity of adult education.

Now there are three main campuses in major communities, the Aurora Research Institute and learning centres across the Northwest Territories. The college has grown with the needs of northern students. Getting educated in the North will help Northerners to lead the wage economy in the Northwest Territories and be leaders and managers in all sectors of our economy.

The college offers a wide variety of courses, with subjects ranging from environmental monitoring to teaching and nursing bachelor degrees. Recently the college won awards for educational innovation for its diamond polishing program.

Mr. Speaker, innovations like the Mobile Trades Training Lab, the new residence in Inuvik and the new Underground Miner Training Program will ensure that the college keeps up with the needs of our growing industry and territory.

The future of the college looks bright. We should all recognize the important role that Aurora College and its graduates play in the Northwest Territories. Mahsi, Mr. Speaker.

Thank you, Mr. Lafferty. Item 3, Members’ statements. The honourable Member for Nahendeh, Mr. Menicoche.

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. We all know that the Northwest Territories has some of the highest costs in the country. These high costs have a big impact on our cost of living. For example, in Fort Simpson the average personal income is around $45,000. The monthly cost of electricity and

heat averages around $600. This means that the cost to power and heat their homes is over 15 per cent of their income. People are struggling to make ends meet and falling further behind because of these escalating costs.

Mr. Speaker, during the last session I spoke about the high energy costs and the impact it is having in our communities. I spoke about the frustration community government leaders have with the cost of electricity and the management of the NWT Power Corporation. This frustration has led to the larger non-hydro communities like Fort Simpson, Norman Wells and Inuvik to consider a number of options, including finding alternate energy suppliers. If these three communities withdraw from the NWT Power Corporation, it could have a serious impact on the remaining NWT Power Corporation customer base and the overall operations of the NWTPC.

Mr. Speaker, community government leaders have met with the Premier, the Minister responsible for the Power Corporation, and the Minister responsible for the Public Utilities Board and discussed two options they would like the government to consider. One would be to treat every resident in the territory the same and bring in the one rate zone. The second option would be to sell the Power Corporation to another energy supplier with a capacity to develop some of the vast hydro potential in our territory. This alternative would allow the GNWT to rid itself of the debt load associated with NWTPC and lead to a reduction of electrical costs in the communities.

Mr. Speaker, the government will be reviewing electricity rates, regulations and the power subsidy program over the next year. We need to take the recommendations made by our community government leaders seriously and consider all the options when looking for solutions that will provide all residents with affordable energy. This needs to be done as quickly as possible.

Thank you, Mr. Menicoche. The honourable Member for Frame Lake, Ms. Bisaro.

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. There is a fundamental problem with the mandate of the Northwest Territories Power Corporation and the regulatory regime that it operates under.

Most of us do our best to reduce our power consumption for the benefit of both the environment — reduction of greenhouse gas emissions — and the consumer — less energy used means lower electricity costs — and we should be trying to

conserve for both of these reasons. The more we reduce our energy consumption, the less power we use. The less power we use, the more NTPC revenues drop. The more their revenues drop, the more riders they add to our bills. When NTPC cannot generate enough revenues to meet their expenditures, they ask for a rate increase or a rate rider to make up for lost revenue. The bottom line is that the dollar figure on our power bill goes up.

There is no incentive for an NWT homeowner to want to reduce energy consumption. Until we change this system, Mr. Speaker, we can never get ahead. Either the environment will take a beating or we will.

The government is reviewing electricity rates and regulation, as mentioned in Minister McLeod’s statement the other day. The calculation of NWT power rates must be completely revamped with a view to fairness and equitability.

Capital costs for upgrades to power generation in one community have to be applied to all communities across the territory, not just to the individual community where the infrastructure is built. Individual communities cannot handle the high infrastructure cost on their own.

We also have to look at revamping the corporation itself. NTPC must be renewed and reorganized. That NTPC is at arm’s length from the GNWT is a good thing, but I feel it has led to the mentality in the organization that they can do whatever they wish without consequences. There seems to be little concern for the consumers, for good business practices on the part of the NTPC’s leadership, little desire to increase efficiencies and identify savings in order to keep our power rates at a reasonable level.

A culture of efficiency and effectiveness must be instilled, with cost savings the number one priority for this company. For example, the corporation can eliminate management bonuses. It can stop the current massive advertising campaign that tells us how NTPC is going green and conserving. I have to wonder how much of those savings they are crowing about is being spent on advertising. The Power Corp can eliminate wasteful spending. I received a perfect example of such waste a few weeks ago.

Mr. Speaker, I seek unanimous consent to conclude my statement.

Unanimous consent granted.

Thank you, Mr. Speaker, and thank you to my colleagues. I received a perfect example of such waste a few weeks ago. It was a lovely colour report

—

of minimal value — many pages

long and one sided printing; 30 pages of charts, one chart to a page. Several tables using three or

four pages would have provided the same information at a fraction of the cost. I really had to wonder what value that report had for me.

NTPC’s board must be told that only after they have clearly demonstrated that all avenues for cost saving have been explored will they be allowed to consider power rate increases for its users. As I said before, it’s the duty of the Power Corp to do everything it can to minimize the impact of power generation costs on the average Joe and Mary. Will that day ever come?

Thank you, Ms. Bisaro. The honourable Member for Mackenzie Delta, Mr. Krutko.

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. As we all know, power is an essential service that we all depend on, from heating our homes to turning our lights on, to maintain the community infrastructure and, more importantly, to generate the economic value we have by way of purchasing.

The Northwest Territories Power Corporation has a system of establishing rates by what we call community-based rates, better known as postage stamp rates, which means every community that has a power generating system, regardless if it’s Northland Utilities or Northwest Territories Power Corporation, has to be assessed in regard to power rates. That costs in the range of $3 million to $5 million every two to four years.

Mr. Speaker, communities such as Colville Lake and Tsiigehtchic, which are paying in excess of $2 per kilowatt — in the case of Colville Lake it is $2.85 per kilowatt…. It’s not economically viable for one community the size of Colville Lake or Tsiigehtchic to be able to sustain the power usage in that community without realizing there has to be a better system out there.

Most jurisdictions in Canada have switched to what we call a levelized rate, in which the power is based on different types of power generation, be it diesel, hydro or other ways of generating power. This government has to seriously consider levelized rates, regardless of whether it’s going to be a rate for the Beaufort-Delta region, the Sahtu or the Deh Cho. All diesel communities will be on one rate system; the hydro communities would be on one rate system. We have to look at the savings this will bring forward.

Mr. Speaker, this government spends in excess of $9 million subsidizing power throughout the Norwest Territories. By reinvesting the $9 million and the $3 million we spent in regard to rate application, $12 million dollars could be reinvested in new energy projects such as hydro, wind, solar. I

think it’s something this government has to take seriously in regard to where we spend our money.

Mr. Speaker, at the appropriate time I will be asking the Minister responsible for the Public Utilities Board questions on this matter.

Thank you, Mr. Krutko. The honourable Member for Sahtu, Mr. Yakeleya.

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. I, too, want to join my colleagues in talking about the high energy cost situations in our small communities, which Mr. Krutko, the Member for Mackenzie Delta, alluded to.

I would like to talk about the concept of privatizing our corporation. We have a Crown corporation. There are a number of arguments that say: don’t privatize; don’t get into community ownership; we’re too small or we’re not well equipped to have a Crown corporation go into the private sector. I think that’s totally wrong. I think you have to give the ownership back to the people.

There are major corporations now in our communities and our regions that could look at having ownership. There is the Gwich’in Tribal Council; there’s the Sahtu Corporation, the Deh Cho, Akaitcho, and right down the valley into even ATCO, which has major operations in the field that go into Alberta. They have a number of plants in the Northwest Territories that operate services. They are out of another jurisdiction; however, they can provide cheaper power in the Northwest Territories.

We have a Crown corporation like the federal government. When they have Crown corporations and they’re in trouble, they sell them off. They’d sell them off to the people who could do better for our people in the Northwest Territories. I know there’s enough initiative going on that hopefully in the next year, the government will come back with some initiatives in terms of how we reduce the power.

Sometimes in the small communities we just want to know that our power rates will be stabilized and won’t go up any further. There are people in the Northwest Territories who get assistance from the federal government in terms of their power rates. We also receive that assistance through subsidies. Yet we’re told that these subsidies are going to grow every year, and if we don’t do something, it’s going to be costing us more and more.

As Members we have to start prioritizing what is more important: infrastructure or subsidies? How do we best serve our people? Mr. Speaker, I think the option is to seriously consider privatizing the Crown corporation; give the regional communities and

individual corporations an opportunity to look and see if it’s feasible. If it’s not, then we certainly can have that further discussion. But I say give the power back to the people. We are the owners of the Power Corporation. Among us here, we represent the ownership, so I think we should have a further discussion on privatization.

Thank you, Mr. Yakeleya. The honourable Member for Weledeh, Mr. Bromley.

Mr. Speaker, we are overdue for a thorough and independent review of the Northwest Territories Power Corporation, its operations, its innovations and its response in meeting the evolving needs of communities and residents. It is my view that this review should include the potential need for a complete restructuring.

The Power Corporation is a utility — a public utility, an arm of the GNWT

—

rather than a private

corporation, but this is not reflected in its attitude. It has been six years since the Public Utilities Board ordered the Power Corporation to file interconnection standards for net metering, yet we are still awaiting these. While millions of such systems exist around the world, there is yet to be a single residential grid size power system in the Northwest Territories.

Power rates do indeed need to be reviewed. There is some help required for some of our communities that are paying really exorbitant costs, but rates should be designed in ways that still reflect the local cost of power, and that’s going to be tricky. We need to focus on bringing down costs where they are high, and any new or additional revenue should be directed to achieving our multiple goals of reducing costs and greenhouse gases, increasing community self-sufficiency and developing our local economies.

Mr. Speaker, the government has embarked on a review of electrical rates in the Northwest Territories. However, I am concerned that reviewing the rates without a thorough review of our power provider will not move us forward on this issue.

Some communities, residents and businesses are beginning to propose, design and even implement their own power systems because of the intolerable costs and barriers they face. Increasingly, efficient appliances and homes are becoming available. These situations reduce power demand to the Power Corporation facilities and, given the stagnant response of our corporation, end up driving up costs for other consumers.

Rather than fighting these trends, we need a progressive power company that embraces new ways of doing business and that partners with individuals, businesses and communities

—

one

that helps bring state of the art technology into service and strengthens community self-sufficiency by encouraging local energy solutions. Our communities provide their own water and sewage services, including billing and accounting. There is no reason they cannot be further engaged in the provision of power services.

Mr. Speaker, I request unanimous consent to conclude my statement.

Unanimous consent granted.

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Instead, the record reveals a corporation with little innovation, one that pays out the highest bonuses and compensations we have despite some attempt at curtailment by our Public Utilities Board, and a performance that is flagging with lack of leadership. Let’s grab this bull by the horns, do the review and structure our power systems to be responsive and responsible to the needs of our citizens and our communities. Mahsi.

Thank you, Mr. Bromley. The honourable Member for Nunakput, Mr. Jacobson.

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. The people of the Nunakput riding face some of the highest power rates in the Northwest Territories. Living farther north than many other residents in the Northwest Territories also means that our lights have to be on longer in the winter and heating on in our homes for a longer time in the season. The furnaces are on for longer periods of time.

To put this simply, 700 kilowatt hours that are subsidized for Yellowknife rates by the Territorial Power Support Program are not enough. I know of families that are struggling to pay power bills for a modest three bedroom home. Overcrowding in many of our homes means more showers, more loads of laundry and television watching, which means higher power bills. As a father, Mr. Speaker, you know that one of the definitions of a teenager is a young person who does not know how to turn off a light switch. Everything that teenagers do…. The video games, watching videos, listening to music, learning on computers and connecting with the world around them all take power.

I did some quick calculations using information available on the NTPC website that shows the residents of Tuktoyaktuk and Ulukhaktok pay about twice the cost of power of Yellowknife once the

subsidy runs out. Sachs Harbour and Paulatuk pay about four times the cost. So for every $100 people in Yellowknife pay, the people I represent are paying $200 to $400 more for the same power amount. This amount is compounded by having to pay the GST on the total of the power bill. When I add this to the cost of home heating fuel, the cost of groceries, the cost of clothing your family and your children, I clearly see that the people I represent are struggling. I believe the power subsidy program is a good program but should be modified to recognize the actual power requirements required to run a modern household in different regions of the Northwest Territories.

I believe, Mr. Speaker, the amount of kilowatt hours subsidized to Yellowknife rates should be raised to 1,000 kilowatts in the communities that I represent.

Mr. Speaker, I seek unanimous consent to conclude my statement.

Unanimous consent granted.

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. I will have questions for the Minister responsible for the Financial Management Board Secretariat at the appropriate time.

Thank you, Mr. Jacobson. The honourable Member for Great Slave, Mr. Abernethy.

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Last week in this House the lead Minister for the Ministerial Energy Coordinating Committee tabled the draft NWT Hydro Strategy and GNWT Energy Priorities Framework. Energy is an increasingly important issue for our constituents. How much do we have? How much does it cost? Can our environment cope with our demand? The GNWT also faces increased energy costs along with higher costs for services we already provide and strategic initiatives we would like to pursue.

We are looking at expanding our existing hydro development to offer electricity to industry. We are looking at alternative energy sources like biomass and wind. These are all worthwhile clean energy initiatives that can help address our energy needs in the NWT in the future, but they will not address the majority of our energy needs in the foreseeable future. Meeting these energy demands of our territory will require huge investment. With our own borrowing limits set at $500 million by the federal government and limited capacity under this limit to borrow, how will we take the bold steps required to do progressive things on the energy front?

The energy potential of our territory is huge. The Premier has made comments in this House about leaving no stone unturned to come up with solutions for our energy problem. I believe that the Northwest Territories Power Corporation should play a role in this solution. The NWT Power Corp sometimes get a bad rap, and rightfully so, for increasing our power rates when the costs to generate this fuel are going down or when the power consumption of our residents is also going down. I sometimes question whether we need the Power Corporation at all. They are supposed to be the people’s power supplier, yet there seems to be limited thought about the public as prices continue to climb and bonuses continue to be offered to senior staff. The business case that the Power Corporation is based on seems antiquated and in dire need of a complete makeover or a complete elimination and substitution with something unique, built by Northerners for Northerners.

Also, the fee structure is based on a southern model from decades ago, which may never have been the right model for the Northwest Territories. I hope the future role of the NWT Power Corporation will be based on a new approach to an old problem. I am encouraged to see talk of partnerships in the documents I mentioned earlier in my statement.

Partnerships can bring new ways of doing things, larger amounts of capital investment dollars and expertise in their respective fields. The NWT is growing in stature, and thinking only within our borders about solutions to bigger issues belongs in the past.

I will have questions for the Minister responsible for the NWT Power Corporation at the appropriate time.

Thank you, Mr. Abernethy. The honourable Member for Hay River South, Mrs. Groenewegen.

Mr. Speaker, this is a very complex subject as we struggle here in the Northwest Territories to find the most efficient means to deliver reliable energy to the communities of the Northwest Territories.

Again we’re faced with the remote and rural nature of many of our communities, the far distances we have to haul fuel to feed diesel generators, the disparity that’s created when some communities are able to be supplied from hydro — all of this within the context of a relatively small territory in terms of population. We struggle with all of these things, but we need a very comprehensive review of everything related to the production, distribution

and creation of energy and power here in the Northwest Territories.

I’ve heard some of my colleagues refer to privatization. I think that we should leave no stone unturned. I think we should look at everything. We talk about regulation. We talk about a monopoly. We talk about community empowerment and communities taking on this role. We talk about a single rate zone, levelized rates, the overhead of NTPC, the fuel costs which are out of our control, community based rates and power subsidies. All of these are very, very complex issues.

Although in a community like Hay River, we are probably the envy of other communities when it comes to our power rates. I want to assure Members that even in Hay River the residents do struggle with the cost of energy and with our cost of living there. We still are a northern community. We have a very cold environment to deal with. I know that compared to Mr. Jacobson’s riding, maybe it sounds like we don’t have a lot to worry about.

An idea was brought forward — not my idea but one of my colleague’s — which I thought had some merit. Rather than raising the 700 kilowatt per hour limit for communities where the costs are higher than Yellowknife’s, perhaps we should look at the communities whose cost are lower than Yellowknife’s, and we should put a cap of paying the market rate up to 700 kilowatts. Perhaps again, this could be considered in a review of our power rates. Perhaps those communities which have the lower rate would be willing to pay a premium on their consumption over the 700

kilowatt hours,

which could be then redistributed to assist those folks who are operating on community based rates and very much struggling with their energy costs.

Thank you, Mrs. Groenewegen. The honourable Member for Kam Lake, Mr. Ramsay.

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. I’m going to join my colleagues today in discussing issues related to power rates and the operation of the Northwest Territories Power Corporation.

Power rates and the operation of the NWT Power Corporation have been cause for much discussion and corresponding motions in this House over the five years that I’ve been here. There are some things I just don’t understand when it comes to the NWT Power Corporation. The first is that because of climate change and high prices for power, Northwest Territories residents have been doing all they can to limit their usage of power. The overall power consumption has been reduced in our territory because of conservation, Mr. Speaker. Why is it, then, that if conservation is taken

seriously by our residents, rates are proposed to go up? People don’t understand this, and I don’t understand it.

Also, the General Rate Application is predicated on the price of oil being $140 a barrel. Over the past six months the price of oil has fallen to $65 a barrel, and some economists and industry experts even predict $50 a barrel by Christmas. This makes it very difficult for residents to understand why the increase to their power rates is necessary. The whole premise for the increase is now completely blown out of the water, Mr. Speaker. The government better get ready to explain and answer to residents across this territory this winter when they are hit hard by these increased rates.

Another thing I don’t understand is why some communities in the Northwest Territories today are paying 25 to 35 per cent more for power than other comparable communities serviced by the Power Corporation. Communities serviced by Northland Utilities, like Trout Lake, pay less than a counterpart community like Nahanni Butte, which is serviced by NWT Power Corporation.

In dealing with power rates, I’m of the belief that as a government our first priority and responsibility is to deliver the best, most affordable power rates possible to our communities and the residents who live there. Why do we allow the Northwest Territories Power Corporation to continue to pay out bonuses to senior management when many in our communities struggle every month to pay the power bill?

We need to re-examine the entire structure of the Northwest Territories Power Corporation and its subsidiaries. It’s getting overly complicated and difficult to understand its role and mandate. On behalf of the residents of the Northwest Territories it’s high time to take the action necessary to restore public confidence in the Northwest Territories Power Corporation. Mahsi.

Thank you, Mr. Ramsay. The honourable Member for Tu Nedhe, Mr. Beaulieu.

Mahsi cho, Mr. Speaker. [English translation not provided.]

Today, like my colleagues, I would like to talk about the high cost charged to our residents by the NWT Power Corporation.

My constituents have expressed many concerns over their power bills and the seemingly increasing power rates. This burden has been made even more difficult to deal with when they hear about bonuses that are being paid out to NWT Power

Corporation executives while they shuffle their meagre budgets to pay for the basic essentials of life.

I looked into the operating cost distribution of the Power Corporation and was appalled to find out that as a business entity the NWT Power Corporation profit represents only 11 per cent of total operating costs, while interest payments represent almost 13

per

cent of total operating

costs. In addition to this, Mr. Speaker, the Power Corporation is charging almost 16 per cent of total operating costs towards amortization payments, for a total of almost 40 per cent being charged out in these three areas.

Mr. Speaker, with the high fuel costs during resupplies adding to the already high cost of living for NWT residents, I would like to know if the NWT Power Corporation is exercising fiscal responsibility and looking at cost breakdowns of these cost allocations. Surely these are areas that can be adjusted downwards to lower the overall operating costs at the NWT Power Corporation, and these savings can be passed on to residents of the NWT.

In Fort Resolution we see power from the Taltson hydro dam, while in Lutselk’e the residents are solely dependent on diesel. Both communities, however, consider the power rates to be much too high.

Thank you, Mr. Beaulieu. The honourable Member for Yellowknife Center, Mr. Hawkins.

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. The Power Corp issue is an accountability issue for me. It’s about value for money. The day to day question is: how is it being operated? Are we getting the money that we expect out of this organization? Are we getting the accountability out of this organization that we expect for our citizens in the territory?

Mr. Speaker, I think the government has a role to play. I think it’s time to roll the NWT Power Corp into the territorial realm of responsibility, just like any other department. They act like a department but with the independence of free rein. It’s a grey area as they exist right now. They’re not privatized, but they’re not quite government, so they get to sort of play on their own field the way they want. If they set their own rules, who gets punished? The consumer.

I wouldn’t suggest we ram the PUB through any type of exemption or roll it into the GNWT. I still think today that it provides a service, but the fact is I believe in better performance, and what better

performance than bringing it here to the floor of this House for that type of scrutiny?

Mr. Speaker, it’s about accountability that I don’t think exists. It wasn’t that long ago we heard about the U.S. bailout. What it did was it helped look at bad practices. It helped look at bad policies. That bailout also helped look at — and by the way, rewards, bonuses for their CEOs who run this corporation…. I question this: what about the efficiency of the NWT Power Corp? Does the rate increase, in my mind, mock or similarly look like a proposed rate increase versus a bailout package? Possibly. In my view it’s scandalous. It looks at rewarding bad policies that aren’t reviewed by us. It looks at rewarding bad management, possibly not reviewed by us. And certainly it rewards CEO bonuses, again unaccountable and not examined by us.

Mr. Speaker, my issue is about having confidence in the system. The way it’s set up today, I don’t have confidence in the way it’s structured.

I’m going to close by saying we could probably do the best for our citizens by having it here, accountable in the Legislature, where it belongs.

Thank you, Mr. Hawkins. Item 4, reports of standing and special committees. The honourable Member for Nahendeh, Mr. Menicoche.

Thank you very much, Mr. Speaker. A report on the review of the Human Rights Commission 2006–2007 report.

Introduction

The Standing Committee on Government Operations met on October 9, 2008, to review the 2006–2007 report of the Human Rights Commission. The committee would like to thank Ms. Mary Pat Short, Chair of the Human Rights Commission, and Ms. Thérèse Boullard, director of Human Rights, for appearing before us.

2006–2007 Annual Report

The 2006–2007 report does not include any recommendations; however, the committee would like to take the opportunity to comment on other issues that were discussed during our public meeting.

The 2006–2007 annual report was the third report of the Human Rights Commission since its

establishment on July 1, 2004. The committee welcomed the concise and visually informative new reporting format and is pleased with the commission’s offer to include a community breakdown of the origin of inquiries and complaints in future reports.

The committee was pleased to hear of the progress the commission has made in raising awareness about human rights through its education and outreach activities, including community visits, public presentations, information sessions, educational audio conferences and several publications. The success of the Human Rights Commission’s awareness activities appears to be clearly demonstrated by the steep increase in inquiries, from 253 in the previous year to 427 in 2006–2007.

The committee welcomes the commission’s approach to addressing issues of discrimination in the workplace through the publication of Employer’s Guide to Human Rights, Duty to Accommodate, and Alcohol and Drug Testing, combined with information sessions that were conducted for employers.

The committee appreciates the work of the Human Rights Commission with youth and schools, in particular the development of resources addressing bullying among students.

We acknowledge the commission’s efforts to bring education and awareness workshops on human rights and the NWT Human Rights Act to all regions of the Northwest Territories. The committee highlights the importance of visits to smaller communities, as they will provide residents with a better understanding of their rights under the act.

The committee understands the commission’s need for funding increases due to the growth of inquiries and hearings before the Human Rights Adjudication Panel. However, the committee is concerned about the ability to fund continued budget increases without compromising service and outreach activities in future years.

Conclusion

The committee commends the commission’s work and achievements to date and looks forward to monitoring the continued evolution of human rights in the Northwest Territories.

Mr. Speaker, I move, seconded by the honourable Member for Yellowknife Centre, that Committee Report 1-16(3) be received and adopted.

Motion carried.

Item 5, returns to oral questions. Item 6, recognition of visitors in the gallery. The honourable Member for Monfwi, Mr. Lafferty.

Mahsi, Mr. Speaker. It gives me great pleasure to recognize some of the students here from the Aurora College Social Work Program. There might be some names that might be challenging, but I will do my best: Dolly Pierrot, Joy Muyambo, Tania Ramm, Janell Dautel, Faith Woodruff, Shirley Tsetta, Mary Ann Jeremickca, also a Tlicho member, Jackie Chinna, Nellie Norwegian, Cecile Deneyoua and instructor Bruce Stewart. Thanks for coming.

It gives me great pleasure to join Mr. Lafferty to recognize another class, nursing students, from Aurora College: Jenna Alexander, Leslie Bader, June Bartlett, Heather La Foy, Lindsay Ransom, Shannon Rutherglen, Ayrma Schreurs and instructor Vee Faria. We would like to welcome them.

Mr. Speaker, it’s not every day that the women outnumber the men here in the House. I would like to welcome all the students from Aurora College, especially the students from the second year Social Work Program. I have two former constituents who are in the program, and I would to welcome them: Nellie Norwegian from Fort Providence and Cecile Deneyoua, formerly from Fort Providence and now living in Hay River. I’d like to say welcome to both of them.

Mr. Speaker, I would also like to welcome a constituent of mine who’s taking this valuable program for the people in the Sahtu: Ms. Dalphine Pierrot of Fort Good Hope, working in Norman Wells. I would also like to welcome Cecile Deneyoua, my sister-in-law.

I’d like to recognize Leslie Bader, at least a former constituent — perhaps still — and a practitioner of the arts. Welcome, Leslie.

I, as well, would like to welcome Cecile Deneyoua to the gallery today. She’s a constituent of mine from Hay River. To anyone else in the gallery that we’ve missed today, welcome to the House. I hope you’re enjoying the proceedings.

Item 7, acknowledgements. Item 8, oral questions. The honourable Member for Tu Nedhe, Mr. Beaulieu.

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. As all of us gave Member’s statements on the Power Corp today, I have questions for the Minister responsible

for the NWT Power Corp. Can the Minister advise me if the NWT Power Corporation can re-examine their cost allocations in non-tangible areas such as profit, interest and amortization and try to lower the costs in those three areas?

Thank you, Mr. Beaulieu. The honourable Minister responsible for the NWT Power Corporation, Mr. Roland

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. When the Power Corporation files for any rate applications or changes to its rates, it goes under review by the Public Utilities Board. It looks at the whole gamut of the operation in the Power Corporation. Those are areas that would be reviewed.

Amortization deals with the capital expenses of the public corporation and replacing assets that are on the ground that would need to be replaced, such as power poles, generation facilities and so on. We try to do the best we can in dealing with those areas. In fact, I believe we provide information to Members on the breakdown of those particular areas that affect the price rates that we pay in our communities.

Mr. Speaker, considering that the fuel resupply had occurred when fuel costs were at their highest, can the Minister advise if the NWT Power Corporation can do a comprehensive review of what they are charging the communities that are currently locked into the high cost of fuel that was resupplied this summer?

Mr. Speaker, the fuel resupply is something we work with the Department of Public Works and Services, Petroleum Products Division on. We combined the services I believe a couple of years ago so that we can enjoy a better sale price, if we can put it that way, on bulk purchasing of our product and our storage facilities in communities. The unfortunate thing is that when resupply happened, it was at about the highest price of oil throughout the season. That’s a difficulty we face. Already the Power Corporation is having to deal with the higher prices from future years. That’s why a rate application went into the system.

As for trying to go back and redo it and look at it for this fiscal year, that would be very difficult, because the Power Corporation operates under, I guess in a sense, the evaluation of the Public Utilities Board, which looks at the operation and what it can charge for rates in communities.

Mr. Speaker, in addition to the regulatory regime that directs the Power Corp and helps the Power Corp set their rates, can the Minister direct a comprehensive review of the NWT Power Corporation to examine its full operating costs, especially in the area of how they acquire the infrastructure?

Mr. Speaker, the process we’re involved with now is looking at the energy costs in the Northwest Territories through the Ministerial Energy Coordinating Committee as well as going through our business plans, looking at alternatives of operation. I met with the Northwest Territories Power Corporation board and discussed with them some of the impacts in the Northwest Territories. We need to definitely look at all of the operation. As Member Groenewegen stated, don’t leave any stone unturned.

Thank you, Mr. Roland. Final supplementary, Mr. Beaulieu.

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. It appears that other companies in other jurisdictions that provide power with hydro are able to provide that power to their customers at a much lower rate than the NWT Power Corporation is able to do. Can the Minister direct the NWT Power Corporation to examine a way to reduce the costs of hydro to the communities?

Mr. Speaker, the process that is in place right now is one, again, where the rate structure that’s in place is one the PUB operates under. We’ve heard one of the Members talk about community rate zones or postage stamp areas. In the last process when that issue was discussed, the Public Utilities Board stated that it would be up to the Assembly to decide what structures would be put in place. We couldn’t say for ourselves that we could direct the Power Corporation to lower rates in hydro communities alone. We would have to look at a structure through this forum here and decide if we want to make changes to our legislation that could affect how rates are looked at and then how the PUB would regulate that from that point on. So we’re prepared to look at all options that are before us in the Territories, but the direction for that side of it would have to come from this House.

Thank you, Mr. Roland. The honourable Member for Great Slave, Mr. Abernethy.

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. My questions today are for the Minister responsible for the NWT Power Corporation. I was wondering if the Minister could tell me what role he sees for the NWT Power Corp in the energy future of the Northwest Territories.

Thank you, Mr. Abernethy. The Minister responsible for the Power Corporation, Mr. Roland.

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. I guess the simplest way of saying it is that the role of the Power Corporation into the future of the Northwest Territories is one that’s evolving. Again, I met with the board of the Power Corporation. I stated that we have to look at how we operate and look at all facets of it. The fact that we have to look beyond the existing framework that’s in place is something that we shouldn’t shy away from as we look forward to how we generate and deliver power in the Northwest Territories.

Thanks to the Premier for that response. Could the Premier also tell me what kinds of partnerships are possible on energy projects?

Mr. Speaker, the partnership question is one where, as the Government of the Northwest Territories, we have to open the door on it more. In fact, there are already a number of partnerships that have been formed with the Power Corporation; ffor example, on some of our hydro facilities with aboriginal companies and corporations in the Northwest Territories. But if we’re going to go and look at the hydro strategy that’s been put before the Members, if we’re going to invest in that in the Northwest Territories, we’re going to have to partner up with companies that have deep pockets and as well have expertise in those areas. So, again, we have to look at our role as one that’s changing and evolving as we grow as a territory.

Once again thanks to the Premier for that response. Could the Premier also tell me what specific NWT energy projects could gain from partnerships with private industry?

Mr. Speaker, there are quite a number of projects that could benefit. There is a history within the North of partnering with some of the companies here in the Northwest Territories. The Taltson hydro project is an example of forming a partnership with aboriginal companies in the Northwest Territories. I think that is another example of how we move this project ahead when we get to the next stage after environmental review.

When it comes to the actual financing of the project, how do we move this ahead? The GNWT itself, as we talked about, as Members are aware…. The fiscal restraint that we face, our borrowing limit, all have an impact on the speed that a project of this nature can advance. We would have to look at projects like that. If we’re going to expand further, there have been discussions in the past with the Sahtu people about development of hydro there. We need to form partnerships with aboriginal partners in the Northwest Territories, and we’ll look for partners who have deep pockets.

Thank you, Mr. Roland. Final supplementary, Mr. Abernethy.

Thank you, Mr. Speaker, and once again thank you for that response. Is the GNWT or the NWT Power Corp actively seeking partnerships on any energy projects in the NWT?

Mr. Speaker, there are some partnerships that have been formed, so the Power Corporation is involved in those. Are we seeking beyond that at this point? When I met with the Power Corporation board, the chairman as well, I stated that it’s something we have to pursue. The Government of the Northwest Territories side of it as well as the Power Corporation needs to pursue partnerships out there to come up with options. We shouldn’t always put our eggs in the basket of the federal government, for example.

Thank you, Mr. Roland. The honourable Member for Weledeh, Mr. Bromley.

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. I’d like to follow up on the questions for the Minister responsible for the Power Corporation. Does the current review of electricity rates that is in process include a review of the Power Corporation performance, its corporate innovation and so on?

Thank you, Mr. Bromley. The honourable Minister responsible for the Power Corporation, Mr. Roland.

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. The work that we’re doing on the Ministerial Energy Coordinating Committee and looking at the structure, the rates, delivery, energy generation…. We’re looking at quite a number of options — opening the books, in a sense, to options that are out there. Members have suggestions when we go forward with this paper looking for further input as to other options that we may have missed.

Again, going on what has been stated before — I said it and Member Groenewegen said it earlier today — we should not leave any stone unturned when it comes to power generation and delivery in the Northwest Territories and the structure of the corporation.

I would like to acknowledge that there are many issues that the Power Corp is struggling with. There are some of the increasing efficiencies we’ve learned about and that are becoming available technically that make it harder to service the capital the Power Corp has to look after.

I think there could have been a much more innovative response to this and more innovative or progressive adoption of this technology.

Given this and the Minister’s comments, would he commit to starting a thorough and independent review of the Power Corporation which would include a possible restructuring to address all these issues?

Mr. Speaker, as we go through this process of developing the paper that we can bring forward to Members and looking at the option of what the Power Corporation is, how we deliver energy in the Northwest Territories, rate structures, regulation… There are a whole number of areas: the subsidy program itself, as well as what the Member has requested. I will take that message back to the energy coordinating committee and look to see how that can be implemented. We’ve had discussion about the distribution structure review. In a sense, as we go through these next steps, we as Members of this Assembly will be looking at those questions. Again, I’m prepared to sit down with Members and go through this in more detail and look at options that are available to us.

I appreciate those comments from the Minister. I think this is timely; a lot of our public are calling for it. I’m wondering if included in that could be the whole relationship with the Public Utilities Board. I haven’t heard the voice of the Public Utilities Board in this government. I wonder if there’s a way we could bring them to the table and get their perspective on this whole business. I know they’re saddled with some responsibility for at least the financial end of the Power Corporation’s business.

Mr. Speaker, the role of the PUB, as well as the role of the Power Corporation in the Northwest Territories, is one that is directed by the legislation that we as an Assembly control. There’s always opportunity to bring them in to have a discussion about the legislation they operate under. I stated earlier the need to look at some of the legislation that we can impact and that should pose potential changes for the future.

Thank you, Mr. Roland. Final supplementary, Mr. Bromley.

Perhaps I wasn’t talking so much about changing the Public Utilities Board as giving them a voice so that we can be fully informed. I think we are doing a review of the Power Corporation, or at least recognize the need for it. Where is the voice of the Public Utilities Board here?

That leads me to my final question. The last Assembly adopted, I believe it’s called, the NWTEC, Northwest Territories Energy Corporation, or something like that, that’s now the umbrella

organization. How does that corporation fit with the responsibilities of the Power Corporation and protecting our consumers, working to the benefit of our residents?

Mr. Speaker, one could say the reason that legislation was adopted by the previous government was to protect the residents of the Northwest Territories. For example, if the Power Corporation itself, which is fully regulated by the PUB…. I must say, on the PUB side their voice is being heard through this process, as the Minister responsible seeks their input in some of the work he brings to the table. That aside, the rate structure, or the structure that was put into place around the hydro corporation side of things, was done in a way that would minimize impact on the rate base or the residential groups and commercial groups out there that are now regulated.

For example, if we were to do hydro expansion within the existing framework, all of those costs per capita would end up being borne by the rate base of the Northwest Territories or that region or community. It was felt that in today’s framework, that would not be affordable for individuals or companies. Instead, for example, the Taltson is outside that system. It’s going to be paid for by industry if the plan moves ahead as it’s been designed.

Thank you, Mr. Roland. The honourable Member for Nahendeh, Mr. Menicoche.

Thank you very much, Mr. Speaker. I, too, would like to continue the questioning with regard to the NWT Power Corp Minister.

I just wanted to lay out the land a little bit. During my travels in my constituency people are concerned about the government’s plan to increase taxation in various different areas. They’re concerned about the high costs of heating fuel and gasoline fuel that continue to rise even though they’re falling worldwide. Another concern is that now our government, in its infinite wisdom, wants to raise the power rates, Mr. Speaker. That’s something to which I’m fundamentally opposed.

I just wanted to lay out that the little people in our smaller communities are impacted. I just want to say that far before Joe the Plumber, there was Granny from Nahanni, and she’s impacted by all these costs of living pressures.

The Minister is responsible for the NWT Power Corp, which put forward the General Rate Application to increase the power rate. I’d like to

ask the Minister, now, if he can withdraw that application.

Thank you, Mr. Menicoche. The honourable Minister responsible for the Northwest Territories Power Corporation, Mr. Roland.

Mr. Speaker, the rate application has been put forward to the PUB; it’s being reviewed. We’ll expect a ruling on that and take the direction from that process.

The problems…. I mean, it’s not as simple as my declaring that that rate application be pulled. The simple fact is that right now, in our existing framework, the Power Corporation has to work within the legislation as regulated by the PUB and has to show and cover the cost of operation. It goes through that process. What we do as the GNWT outside of that is, for example, through the Territorial Power Support Program, where we match the Yellowknife rate for every community outside Yellowknife that pays a higher price. That’s our way of limiting the impact. For example, the rate rider application that’s out there…. The majority of that will be caught by the Territorial Power Support Program.

I do want to make the case that the world has changed in the last six months, Mr. Speaker. Our financial world went topsy-turvy, and we cannot be relying on our old user pay system that’s there just because fuel prices are going up. We cannot go to Granny from Nahanni and ask for more money to pay the power costs in those communities. Because of that, I ask again: can we stop this current General Rate Application process? It’s based on old, erroneous information. Plus I do not believe that this General Rate Application includes the review of operating maintenance costs, which the people have to pay for, and the bonuses that are included. Mahsi.

Mr. Speaker, the Member talked about old, erroneous numbers. The numbers are tested quite thoroughly with the volumes of information that have to be provided to the Public Utilities Board about the operation of the Power Corporation and why it’s seeking any changes to its rates. That is something that is there. Those numbers are proven. Our question and further justification if required is given. That is a fairly substantial process with the volumes of information that have to be given at any application to the PUB around rate structures and changes to rates.

The bigger piece…. Again, I say that the government overall provides the Territorial Power Support Program, which minimizes the impact on individuals outside of Yellowknife who pay a higher rate than Yellowknife. That’s, I guess, the area that we would have to look at if we want to minimize further impact across the North.

As well, as I’ve already mentioned to a number of other Members — now that we are going through this process of looking at energy development, generation, regulation — that here’s the opportunity with which this House can give clear direction on how we proceed and how we change things going forward. Because I agree: we can’t continue doing business the same old way.

Once again, I believe that the General Rate Application is based on erroneous information, and I’d like to see that it is at least withdrawn until it is re-evaluated one more time. That’s something that people have been telling us as their MLAs. The will of the people also becomes the will of this House. And that’s something I’d like to bring to the Minister. Will he look at pulling the General Rate Application, reassess the application package and put in some consistent and current information?

The fact is that the information provided goes through much scrutiny and is tested. It is not erroneous information. That’s the environment that we have to operate in, the existing framework. Members want to change that framework. As I’ve stated already, we are more than open to looking at changing the framework we operate in, and that’s across anything from the rates to the regulations to the structure. It is time that we as the Government of the Northwest Territories look to the future of what we can provide and how that provision of services affects the constituents in our communities.

Again, much of this rate application will get picked up through the Territorial Power Support Program for those people who live within the 700 kilowatt hours.

Thank you, Mr. Roland. Final short supplementary, Mr. Menicoche.

Thank you very much, Mr. Speaker. Once again, I say it’s an old system. It comes from I don’t know how many years back. It’s backwards, and it’s not working for the people. We’re asking people to save power in the smaller communities, yet in order to make money, the Power Corporation has to charge more. That’s a backwards system. I’d like the Minister to acknowledge that and look at changing that system and stop this General Rate Application and review it.

With the existing framework we have to operate under — that is, the acts that are in place, the Public Utilities Board regulation process — if we were to delay this process, then the potential is that next year we would have to go for even a higher request for operation.

The fact that individuals have been saving on their energy use, yes, is one that helps, in a sense. But,

Mr. Speaker, I’ll speak from experience. I have a large family; I have a home in Inuvik and pay a higher rate than Yellowknife. For approximately 11 months of the year I keep — I should say, my wife keeps — the power consumption below the 700 kilowatt hours, and we live within that time frame. Now, not all people can do that, because of the quality of the homes they live in and the nature of the weather and weather patterns.

But, again, if we want to change the way it’s looked at, the way it’s reviewed and how we provide power, the opportunity’s here. I’m agreeing: let’s do that; let’s really look at how we deliver those services. Through the Ministerial Energy Coordinating Committee we’re working on a paper that we can bring to Priorities and Planning and set the direction we go in the Northwest Territories.

Thank you, Mr. Roland. The honourable Member for Nunakput, Mr. Jacobson.

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. In my Member’s statement today I spoke about the high power costs in my riding of Nunakput and the fact that longer winters mean the people I represent consume more power. My questions today are for the Minister responsible for the territorial power subsidy, the Hon. Michael Miltenberger.

Can the Minister explain to this Assembly how the figure of 700 kilowatts, subsidized to the Yellowknife rate, came into being? My understanding is that this is the cost to run a fridge and a furnace and few lights.

Thank you, Mr. Jacobson. The honourable Minister of Finance, Mr. Miltenberger.

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. We inherited the Territorial Power Support Program when we took over the Power Corporation in 1988. The 700 kilowatt figure was, as I understand, sort of an average cost for your average household. It’s been there for some time, but I believe it’s for the total cost per household, as opposed to a fridge, a stove and a couple of light bulbs.

The Minister said in 1988; that’s a long time ago. I think I was 16 years old. Would the Minister agree that the far northern communities that I represent may need more than the 700 kilowatts of power provided to a minimum household?

Mr. Speaker, the 700 kilowatts is an average consumption figure, and most families across the North are able to live with that.

As Canadians, as Northerners we add more and more power using applications and appliances that drive up our own costs. We have things like vampires that just keep running 24 hours a day, waiting quietly to be called into use; we keep adding to our power consumption.

The issue is, is it more or is it conservation? The Yukon, I understand, has 1,000 kilowatts; we have 700. That’s an issue of debate. The commercial subsidy is another one that’s an issue of debate as well.

Will the Minister commit to examining the issue to determine whether the 700 kilowatt total is still relevant and whether the government should consider a tiered approach on the amount of kilowatts that are subsidized depending on where we live in the NWT?

The Premier has indicated today and it’s been mentioned in the past that we have an opportunity with the work that’s occurred and underway to look at the regulation, the generation and the distribution of power in the Northwest Territories: the subsidies, the differential rate zones that are currently in place, the structure of the Power Corporation. Those are all subjects that are on the table for discussion as we look at dealing with the cost of energy, the cost to the small communities, sustainable communities, conserving energy and greenhouse gas emissions. All those things are now here for us in this Legislature to put our minds to.

Thank you, Mr. Miltenberger. Final supplementary, Mr. Jacobson.

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Would the Minister commit to sharing the results of such a study with the Standing Committee on Economic Development and Infrastructure?

Better than that, Mr. Speaker; we’re basically, as a government, reaching out to the Members to say, “Let’s engage together to look at this very complex, difficult subject, in terms of the redesign, the structures” — the very issues that the Members have identified as problematic. The opportunity is here. The work is underway. We’re looking at doing a lot of things in the next number of months that are going to be fundamental in terms of the changes they could bring. Collectively, we could do a very good job of this.

Thank you, Mr. Miltenberger. The honourable Member for Mackenzie Delta, Mr. Krutko.

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. As I stated earlier, my question is going to be directed to the Minister responsible for the Public Utilities Board.

Mr. Speaker, this government, every four years, goes through an application process of some 33 applications that have to be compiled and submitted to the PUB board for review. The PU review board is the one that establishes the rates that are going to be implemented in the communities. It’s not the Power Corp; it’s the PUB.

There was a decision made in the early ’90s to establish postage stamp rates, which means that every community has to apply individually in regard to what the rate is going to be. This government alone spends almost $3 million on these rate applications for 28 communities, not counting the Northland Utilities’ application.

I did move a motion in this House back in February directing the government to approach the Public Utilities Board and make amendments to the Public Utilities Act to allow the Legislative Assembly to consider looking at levelized rates. I’d like to ask the Minister if he’s had an opportunity to meet with the PUB for them to bring forward legislation that will allow us to establish levelized rates.

Thank you, Mr. Krutko. The honourable Minister responsible for the Public Utilities Board, Mr. Bob McLeod.

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. The motion that was moved by the Member and was approved by the Legislative Assembly I think will assist us in our review. As I’ve written to the Member, we are undertaking a review. We will be asking the general public, the people who pay the bills, to give us their feedback and direction as to how we should deal with this issue.

The PUB takes direction from this Legislative Assembly. Through the legislation we direct how they should operate. Once this review is undertaken and we obtain the results and we reach agreement as to how we should regulate it, we will then give the necessary direction to the PUB.

Mr. Speaker, as stated by the Premier and now the Minister responsible for the PUB, has the government considered bringing forward legislation that will direct the PUB to take a look at levelized rates?

Mr. Speaker, we’re looking at a wide range of possibilities with regard to rates. We want to hear from the people out there, the electricity users, whether that is something that would be supported. A levelized rate would mean that everybody pays the same rates throughout the

Northwest Territories, whether you use hydroelectricity or thermal electricity or diesel electricity. At the time the decision was made to go with the postage rates, it was felt that rates should be accumulated by individual communities. With our review we will go to the communities, and we will find out what the users want.

Mr. Speaker, as I stated in my statement, this government alone can save almost $12 million. Right now we pay a subsidy of over $9 million a year. It costs this government a little over $3 million to do these rate applications. There are savings that could be major by simply changing the direction the PUB has taken by establishing the 33 rate system, where basically 33 applications have to be reviewed every four years. Has the government looked at the cost savings in regard to making this decision, unilaterally knowing that there are cost savings to be had here? Has the Minister looked at the cost savings we can derive from changing the way we do this?

The Public Utilities Board prides itself on the amount of money it saves the average consumer by disallowing some of the costs put forward by the Power Corporation. One of the things we have to take into consideration is if we don’t have the Public Utilities Board reviewing the rate applications, who will review those rates? Who will ensure that the costs are appropriate?

Having said all that, we are undertaking a review. We are looking at how the Public Utilities Board operates, and we’re looking at whether there are other regulatory mechanisms that would be more cost effective and feasible.

Thank you, Mr. McLeod. Final supplementary, Mr. Krutko.

Mr. Speaker, as we’ve heard time and time again, everywhere you go, everybody wants to deregulate and make things straightforward and simple. I think this government should also be amenable to that.

I would like to ask the Minister, knowing from his last comment about who’s going to do it…. I think maybe it’s time the Legislative Assembly established rates through legislation, that we establish exactly what the fee structure is going to be and do it through legislation and simply leave it to a board that will do it. I’d like to ask the Minister: have you considered the deregulation of this industry and making it simplified by simply legislating fees on the floor of this House?

As we said, we are undertaking a review where we’re going to leave no stone unturned. We’re looking at every option, including if the Legislative Assembly wants to take on the responsibility for setting the power rates. If that’s what we want to do, we will look at that

option. Somehow I don’t think we want to do that, but we will undertake a review, and we will come forward with the results.

Thank you, Mr. McLeod. The honourable Member for Sahtu, Mr. Yakeleya.

Mr. Speaker, 42,000 people in the Northwest Territories own the Power Corporation. This government acts on behalf of the shareholders. We have a Minister that takes care of the Power Corporation. We now have a new committee of Ministers — the energy coordinating committee.

I want to ask the Minister of the new coordinating committee, Mr. McLeod, in terms of the mini hydro initiative. I talked about privatization and partnerships; it’s a very complex issue. I would ask the Minister if the mini hydro initiatives in Whati, Lutselk’e and Délînê are on target, are they going to be supported by this government in terms of reducing the cost of energy in their communities? Then we can look at some form of partnership, maybe privatization, in terms of that type of initiative that would bring the Power Corporation in line with the true meaning of partnerships. Would the Minister let the people know that these initiatives are on target, they are on the go, and we are going to fully support them?

Thank you, Mr. Yakeleya. The honourable Minister responsible for the Public Utilities Board, Mr. McLeod.

Mr. Speaker, as a government we have released a number of discussion papers. We have an energy priorities paper that we have released, which identified all of our priorities. We are now entering the second phase, whereby we will be coming forward with business plans in which we will identify the resources necessary to undertake the initiatives we have identified. If the Assembly approves, then we will have the resources to be able to continue with these very important projects.

I look forward to the plans and to the reports in terms of the Assembly and the priorities on the initiatives. There are many initiatives set up by communities to own power. We are sharing the power, sharing responsibility with our communities

—

the same thing with the Power

Corporation. Now it is the time to give that to the people, share the power with the people.

The question I have for the Minister in terms of this initiative is: would the Minister look at similar projects they did in Whati, where power information, educating the people in terms of how we best

conserve, generate, save power in the community…? Whati did a very wonderful project in terms of conserving energy with the youth and elders. Is that something we’re looking at in terms of this committee — going down to Mackenzie Valley and saying: “We’ll share the responsibility; what we are going to do is educate you on what types of initiatives we can do to conserve energy in the North”?

Mr. Speaker, certainly we want to work with the small communities. Recognizing the high cost of energy in communities and as we roll out our business plans, we expect to have working with the communities be a large part of it.

Thank you, Mr. McLeod. A short supplementary, Mr. Yakeleya.

Mr. Speaker, in terms of the issue of privatization and how we go about it, the mayor of Norman Wells has said: “Why don’t we sell the Power Corporation?” — in terms of having our own communities look after energy issues in our regions. Would that type of discussion happen with our Assembly, with our communities, as to how we best get energy issues on the table that would seem to help our people in our region in terms of privatization? I know it is a wide spectrum. What things could the Minister bring forward to this type of discussion with our region?

Mr. Speaker, I too was at the meeting where we heard a number of mayors suggest that we sell some assets. These are the kinds of questions we are asking as we are undertaking our review. I think we have to be very careful. Some of these suggestions could have serious repercussions. If we’re going to privatize our electrical generating companies — and I alsohear other Members saying we should have deregulation…. If you look at other provinces where they have had deregulation, where everything is in the private sector…. I am not saying it is a bad thing; our department has the lead for privatization as well. But we need to find out from the public how they feel about it. As we undertake this review, we will take everything we hear and then we’ll come forward with recommendations.

Thank you, Mr. McLeod. A final short supplementary, Mr. Yakeleya.