Thank you, Mr.

Abernethy. Seeing no further questions….

Sorry. Ms. Bisaro.

Thank you, Mr. Chairman. If I read the activity description correctly, this section of the Housing Corp is responsible for the maintenance/management of the public housing portfolio. I mentioned this yesterday, and it has to do with the reduction in the amount of funds for repairs to housing stock and also to the home ownership program stock.

I wondered if I could ask for an explanation as to why these repair amounts are going down. Is the problem that the LHOs don’t have the capacity to manage their stock properly in terms of maintenance and repairs, or is it some other issue?

Mr. Polakoff.

You mentioned impact, and I guess that would be my next question. What impact do you see that this reduction in repairs funding will have in terms of the current level of repairs needed in public housing stocks?

Mr. Chairman, as the president has indicated, this is, throughout the budget, to hit our target, a bit of a balancing act.

We’re confident we can still maintain the service levels with the funds that are available.

Thank you, Mr. Miltenberger. Any further questions? Hearing none, we’ll move on to page 2-154. Again this is details on what we’ve just passed. Any questions?

NWT Housing Corporation, Finance and

Infrastructure Services, Grants and Contributions: $5.815 million, approved.

Moving on. Under Debt Repayment, Operations. Oh, I’m sorry. Mr. Beaulieu.

Sorry, Mr.

Chair. I wasn’t sure

where we were at. I did have a question on the debt repayment page.

During our meeting with the Auditor General on the NWT Housing Corporation audit, I asked them a question that I’ve asked this government, and I’ll ask you the question. It’s on the guaranteed debt that is appearing in our books as the GNWT this year for $12.053 million, which actually has an impact on our debt wall. Any of the correspondence we have, or the Budget Address, indicates this is a problem for the debt wall.

Considering there’s no possibility that this debt is ever going to be the sole responsibility of the NWT Housing Corporation — the debt is guaranteed by the Canada Mortgage and Housing Corporation — have you guys thought about different ways of reporting this or getting this out of the debt wall, so to speak?

Thank you, Mr. Beaulieu. I’d like to remind committee members that the Standing Committee on Government Operations report on the review of the report of the Auditor General on the Northwest Territories Housing Corporation public housing and home ownership programs will be coming before Committee of the Whole for discussion — just so we don’t get into too much detail and duplication here. But I’ll ask Mr. Anderson to respond to the question.

Thank you, Mr.

Anderson. On Debt Repayment, Operations

Expenditure Summary: $12.053 million. Mr. Krutko.

Thank you, Mr. Chair. On the same matter, I think we have to find a way to take a lot of this debt off the books. Some people are passed on; they’re still out there. We do have a process by way of writing off bad debts in different areas — education loans and things like that. It doesn’t really serve justice to the corporation. For a lot of this debt, in most cases and in other scenarios, it would have been written off or written down through the process of writing off bad debts, and that’s what these are. These are bad debts, where people got themselves into arrears, or in some cases they passed on and it’s still showing up on the books.

I think there has to be a way of clearing off a lot of this questionable debt that’s on the books. It does have an effect in regard to the debt wall of the Housing Corporation. The people assume there’s all this money out there that’s owing to the corporation. A lot of this money is not owing to the corporation. It’s just people who haven’t paid their arrears, and you carry it on your books year after year. People may not even be in the Northwest Territories, but we’re still carrying them on our books.

I think we have to find a way to assess, evaluate — find ways of writing down this debt. At some point, eventually, we can write it off after it’s carried on the books for a period of time — five years, ten years, 20 years, whatever. I think it’s an item that has to be considered and looked at.

You mentioned the different sections with the federal government, that we have federal dollars that are obligated to us, but again, we do have the Financial Administration Act. We have the processes to write off bad debts. Could some of this debt be put into the Financial Administration Act — an authority that allows us to write off certain types of debts — and reclassify some of this debt under those legislative authorities where we can do that? I’d just like to know if that’s something the corporation would seriously consider.

There are people here that have passed on. Because they were tenants of the corporation — they had arrears or whatnot — it’s still showing up on the books. The corporation does not have the ability to write off debt. I think that’s the bottom line. I’d just like to know if that’s something, seriously, that has to be considered.

At some point we’re going to have to confront this issue. We do have to find a way around it. It’s one of those phenomena, that you cannot write off debt in this corporation. I think we should be able to do that.

Mr. Miltenberger.

Mr. Chairman, just quickly. In regard to the debt repayment, page 2-157, we’re expecting some feedback from the Office of the Auditor General in terms of how this debt is treated on our books. The Auditor General is going to be looking at other jurisdictions and may give us some direction.

As well, there is discussion to be had with the Department of Finance. In fact, if this wasn’t on our books and was carried by Finance, it wouldn’t be part of the debt wall we talk about. That’s a discussion that has to be concluded with the Department of Finance.

In regard to the issue of arrears and the writing off of debt, LHOs can write off up to $10,000. The corporation can go up to $20,000. We have to come to the Legislature for write-offs more than that. We’ve been analyzing the arrears that are there, and we’re going to be coming forward with the write-off of some of that debt that’s been assessed that’s worked its way up from the LHOs. The big issue is that while we can write it off, the debt stays on our books unless it hits the forgiveness, which can only be granted by the Legislature. These other small debts stay on our books as written off, but they are still on the individual’s file as outstanding issues. Even though they are written off, they’re there as a record.

Thank you, Mr. Miltenberger. Moving on, Ms. Bisaro.

Thank you, Mr. Chair. I had a question in regard to the debt repayment. Page 2-156 indicates that the debt is $71.5 million, of which we are paying, in this next year, $12.1 million, and CMHC is contributing $10.5 million. My question is whether or not the CMHC amount is guaranteed, basically, until the debt is paid off, or is it reducing every year, similar to the other funding from CMHC where we’re coming to the end of life?

Thank you, Ms. Bisaro. Mr. Miltenberger.

Mr. Chairman, it is guaranteed, but as the debt gets paid off, it gets reduced.

That’s good to hear. The $71.5 million: is that what is currently owed, or is that the original debt amount? Does it change year to year? By us paying this $12.1 million, is our $71.5 million debt reduced by that, or are we adding to it on the one hand and reducing it on the other?

Mr. Chairman, this is the current amount. If you look at the detail, it went from, ’06–07, $12.994 million down to $12.053 million. That’s the current amount. That’s what it’s dropped.

Just one last quick question. Is there an expectation that this will be paid off, and if so, when might that be?

In 2038.

Thank you. I’d like to call next on Mr. Beaulieu.