Agreed. We’ll commence with that after a brief break.

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I’d like to call Committee of the Whole back to order. The next item we have before us is consideration of the capital budget for the NWT Housing Corporation. Let me repeat myself. I call Committee of the Whole back to order. The first item we have before us this afternoon is the NWT Housing Corporation. It is here as an information item. I would like ask the

Minister of Housing if he would like to make opening remarks.

I have no opening remarks, Madam Chair, but I will bring in witnesses.

Does committee agree?

Thank you. I will ask the Sergeant-at-Arms to please escort the witnesses in.

I would like to ask Minister McLeod if he would please introduce his witnesses for the record.

Thank you, Madam Chair. To my right I have Mr. David Stewart, president and CEO of the Northwest Territories Housing Corporation. To my left I have Mr. Jeff Anderson, vice-president of finance and infrastructure, NWT Housing Corporation.

Thank you, Minister McLeod. General comments. Mr. Blake.

Thank you, Madam Chair. Just a few comments I’d like to make. I’m very glad to see the seniors’ complex that’s planned for Aklavik. It’s much needed in the community and it’s good to see that in the budget.

I’d just like to also emphasize that there are a lot of people moving back to the communities of Aklavik, Fort McPherson and Tsiigehtchic over the last couple of years here and a housing shortage has come underway. I strongly believe we’re in need of single unit multiplex units in the communities. I think that would free up a lot of room for my constituents. Also in our plan, as of now there are no plans for new units in the communities of Fort McPherson and Tsiigehtchic, and I just wanted to stress that it is much needed as a lot of people have moved back.

Thank you, Mr. Blake. Minister McLeod.

Thank you, Madam Chair. We look forward to getting the project underway in Aklavik for the seniors. We also have, as the Member knows, earmarked seniors for Fort McPherson.

As far as the public housing portfolio goes, I mean, we’re always looking at our communities with the most need, and when we do our allocation of public housing replacement units we tend to target those that are in most need. Right now, the two communities, I mean, there is a need in every community and we have to weigh that against the other communities, and that will help us determine where some of our replacement units go. But if there is a shortage in the community, I mean, we would be well aware of it and we’ll target some of our initiatives towards those communities.

Thank you, Mr. McLeod. Next for general comments, I have Mr. Bromley.

Thank you, Madam Chair. I just have one topic I would like to bring up and that’s the energy initiatives. I know the Housing Corporation has been looking into biomass initiatives and they have other energy projects. We will talk about that under detail, but just in terms of the biomass initiatives, I’m aware that the corporation is facing ever-increasing pressures, as every resident and business is in the Northwest Territories, of heating and power, but on the heating front, I’m just wondering if I can get an idea of where we’re at. I think we’re looking into feasibility studies and I was hoping to see some comprehensive multi-dwelling biomass projects. Could I get an update on where we’re at with that generally? Thank you.

Thank you, Mr. Bromley. Minister McLeod.

Madam Chair, we have a couple that are underway right now. One is in Detah. It is a stand-alone system that is connected to the seniors five-plex. The other is in Ndilo. That is a stand-alone system connected to a seniors five-plex. We do have some money identified for some more initiatives across the Northwest Territories. I think we are early in the stages, or we are in the feasibility study part of it right now. We do have a couple that are on the go. We look forward to getting more on the ground here within the next couple of years. Thank you, Madam Chair.

Madam Chair, thanks to the Minister for those remarks. It is great to hear about the Ndilo/Detah projects. Those are this fiscal year rather than next. I look forward maybe to getting an update a year after they get operational so we can hear what lessons are being learned and applied. It sounds like there are not any more new ones being proposed for this coming fiscal year, but maybe the following fiscal year. Thank you. That is all I have.

Madam Chair, as far as biomass goes for this coming fiscal year, we don’t have it identified anywhere but we do have… It’s in the notes that we provided. There are some solar panel initiatives that are being undertaken this year that identifies a location. That could take place during 2014-15. Thank you.

Thank you, Minister McLeod. General comments. Next I have Mr. Dolynny.

Thank you, Madam Chair. First and foremost, I think it is important to give credit where credit is due. After going through the old Hansards and going through some of the opportunities that this area had, has been definitely noted in the scriptures of the very four walls of this

institution. I have to commend the hard work that has gone in during the life of the 17th Assembly.

Again, I don’t want to earmark any one particular individual. I know it is a team effort here, but there has been an enormous amount of cleaning up and putting back on target what is one of our largest expenses. It is hard to get compliments out of Range Lake office, so take them when you can. This is a good job, Madam Chair.

That said, I think it is also prudent for me to talk about where we are spending our money and opportunities where I see that I have to ask the appropriate questions.

We know that all communities are in need of new infrastructure, large and small. I know full well that we have a certain amount of money. I know that we have money that is sunsetting from the Government of Canada and that we are going to have to be very creative over the next 20 to 30 years in terms of how we distribute these monies and look after the needs of all Northerners. But all Northerners includes the city of Yellowknife. I for one don’t want to take money away from communities. That is not the intent of my question. My intent is always fairness.

Earlier today one of the other Members talked about population moving back into the communities. I can assure you that statistics are showing quite the opposite. There has been a migration from the communities to the urban centres. The last 10 years or so, it has been an 8 percent-plus in-migration. The urban centres, including Yellowknife, are becoming larger. With that, a lot of the community patrons and residents are moving into a more regional base.

Given that statistic, right now in the city of Yellowknife, there are 168 people currently on a waiting list for housing needs. When you look at that number, it’s pretty daunting, it’s a big number, it’s a large number. If you had to put that number up against any other communities, it would probably represent a large number of our communities out there. The interesting thing is that of the 168, and I don’t have the full statistics on it, but I can assure you that a lot of them are from the communities that are now here in Yellowknife.

When I look at some of the breakdown that we have here in the activity summaries as we are going to go through here, I notice that there is a good distribution. I think there is some stewardship behind this, but again, with that number I indicated earlier from Yellowknife, there isn’t very much happening to address that large number. I will start that first part of my general comment in that breath.

The second part of my general comment has more to do with we know that there have been a lot of initiatives that the Housing Corporation has undertaken to reduce or mitigate costs of energy. We know that. We know there are retrofits. We

know there are biomass programs. We are looking at cells, photo PV systems. I encourage the housing authority to come up with more and more of these initiatives.

That said, we have not really heard the statistics yet in terms of what has been some of the bigger savings in a general sense. Has there been an overall 7, 8, 9 percent savings in energy costs overall?

I am just clarifying some of the generalities. If we can get those two things on the opening comments agenda from Range Lake, that would be appreciated. Then again, I want to thank the hardworking crew down there. I want to make sure that it is resonated loud and clear with all members of the Housing Corporation. Thank you.

Thank you, Mr. Dolynny. Minister McLeod.

Madam Chair, first of all, we appreciate the Member’s comments. I think the good work that is being done at the Housing Corporation is reflected in the budgets that we bring forward and how our funding is spread evenly across the Northwest Territories. Yellowknife, being one of the largest centres, in the last couple of years we have a few major projects here in Yellowknife. In the last seven years, I believe it is, we spent approximately $28 million in the capital. We spent $167 million in the smaller communities and about $66 million in some of the large communities, Inuvik, Hay River, Fort Smith, Fort Simpson, Norman Wells. We make a real effort to allocate our funds fairly and equally.

Part of the problem in the smaller communities is Housing might be their only option to getting a place to stay, whereas some of the larger communities, you are able to get some other types of accommodation. That’s why we introduced the Rent Supplement Program. I think it goes a long way in helping some of the residents in some of the larger communities get a place to stay at a fairly reasonable cost. We try and distribute our funding equally across the Northwest Territories, again, recognizing that Yellowknife is one of the larger centres and there are many more options here.

As we go forward, you talk about the 168 people on the waiting list. If you looked across the Northwest Territories, the waiting list in a lot of our communities are not as large but if you go percentage-wise, based on population, it’s almost equal, if not more. Their options in the small communities are limited. In the next couple of years we are targeting a lot of the smaller communities, but we’re not ever going to overlook some of the large communities and the needs they have there. As we come forward with future budgets, I think you will see that we’ve made an effort to respond to all the needs across the Northwest Territories, be it large or small communities. Thank you.

Thank you. Oh, Mr. McLeod.

I’m sorry. I apologize. I was so concentrating on the first point the Member made, I forgot about the second.

We are monitoring the one unit that we have up in Inuvik. We are able to monitor the use there as far as utilities go. I am committing to providing data to all the Members on some of the savings that we are seeing because of using a few more energy-efficient systems plus the work that we have done on the units themselves.

Right now it is fairly early in the game. We do have a new system where we are able to monitor the utility costs for pretty well every unit in the NWT Housing Corporation portfolio. Once we start doing that, we will be able to identify which of our communities and which of our units have a lot higher energy costs. We have a unit in one of the small communities where we are seeing that their utility bills are quite high. We would use that information to possibly do an energy retrofit on that unit with the hopes of bringing the costs down. So we will be able to monitor all our units closely and, again, I will be more than willing to provide information to the Members as to some of the savings we’re seeing because of all the work that we’re doing. Thank you, Madam Chair.

I appreciate the Minister’s response to that. I encourage the Housing Corp to look at all the different pilots that are out there. The one in Inuvik that a number of Members here had the opportunity to go visit was quite impressive and one in which will probably set the gold bar standard what we’re going for and trying to achieve. That said, we need to create an environment where we’re doing more than just a pilot. We need to be looking at all our rollouts, looking at all energy efficiencies out there. So I encourage the Housing Corp to come up with more ingenuity. I know there are great ideas out there and I’m really trying to foster an environment that the Members on this side of the House are more than willing to hear those innovations. We want to see those innovations. Don’t be scared to bring those innovations forward. You will probably get a lot of support if you do so. Let’s not rest on our laurels, Madam Chair. Let’s take a look at every opportunity, every unique building type. I’ve heard so many great ideas on this side of the House in terms of model, design and opportunity for employment for construction.

So keep up the good work and thank you, Madam Chair, for allowing me to do general comments.