Seeing none, 13-35, Environment and Natural Resources, information item, work performed on behalf of others. Any questions?

We’re going to group these questions here. Pages 13-36, 37, 38 and 39, Environment and Natural Resources, information item, work performed on behalf of others.

Thank you. I would like to turn your attention back to 13-7, Environment and Natural Resources. Mr. Bromley.

Thank you, Mr. Bromley. The motion is being distributed. I’ll just let everyone have a chance to take a look at it.

Committee, motion is in order. To the motion. Mr. Bromley.

No comment.

Question is being called.

We seem to have a tie, and in the spirit of prolonging debate and continuance, the Chair will be voting in favour of the motion. The motion is carried.

---Carried

This will conclude our consideration of the Department of Environment and Natural Resources here today. I would like to thank Mr. Campbell and Ms. Magrum today. If I could get the Sergeant-at-Arms to escort the witnesses out of the Chamber. Thank you.

Continuing on with committee’s wishes, we are going to be moving to Industry, Tourism and Investment. Minister Ramsay, do you have any opening comments?

I do, Mr. Chairman, thank you. I am pleased to present the 2013-14 main estimates for the Department of Industry, Tourism and Investment.

The department’s main estimates propose total operational expenses of approximately $50 million for the coming fiscal year, which is an increase of 1 percent over 2012-13. This includes sunsets of nearly $2.5 million, specific initiatives of $1.2 million and forced growth of $1.9 million.

The mandate of ITI is to promote economic self-sufficiency through responsible development of the Northwest Territories natural resources and the promotion of tourism, trade, investment, business and manufacturing to create a prosperous, diverse and sustainable economy for the benefit of all residents. Through this mandate, we continue to

support the commitment of our government that all residents of the Northwest Territories must have the opportunity to build a stronger future for themselves, their families and their communities.

In 2013-14 the department will support this government’s priority to strengthen and diversify our economy by proposing investments in a number of programs and projects.

Several of this department’s key initiatives centre around energy and energy projects aimed at reducing energy costs and greenhouse gas emissions, in support of the 17th Legislative

Assembly’s stated commitment in making strategic infrastructure investments and hydro initiatives.

Industry, Tourism and Investment works in partnership with the departments of Environment and Natural Resources, Public Works and Services, Transportation and Finance on energy initiatives. The Department of Industry, Tourism and Investment is proposing several specific energy initiatives for the 2013-14 fiscal year. These include:

• $100,000 for finding a solution to the natural

gas shortage in Inuvik, which is a priority for our government. The funding will be used to examine the possibility of liquid natural gas for Inuvik, which has been identified as the most promising solution to Inuvik’s energy situation.

• $250,000 in funding to complete the regulatory

application for the Whati T-line, the proposed transmission line to connect Whati to the Snare hydro system. Reducing our reliance on imported diesel continues to be a key priority for our government.

• $50,000 is proposed for the Water Monitoring

Program in Kakisa. This will allow NT Energy to further study the hydro potential of the Kakisa River, and explore possible opportunities for hydro development that could benefit the community and displace diesel-fired electricity.

The department will continue to support NT Energy in its efforts to continue to contribute to the implementation of GNWT energy planning initiatives. These include the renewal of the Energy Plan, Greenhouse Gas Strategy, the Biomass Strategy and the Solar Strategy. Funding will allow NT Energy to begin the consultation and implementation phases of power system planning, to continue managing energy projects and initiatives that examine and deliver energy solutions aligned with the goals and objectives of the GNWT.

The department is also proposing funding for the upcoming fiscal year in some key areas to support of the priorities of the 17th Assembly.

In support of the GNWT priority of increasing employment opportunities through

decentralization efforts, Industry, Tourism and Investment is proposing to invest $94,000 to relocate its Business Incentive Policy monitoring office from its current Yellowknife location to Hay River. This is in direct response to the 17th Legislative Assembly asking departments to review activities and positions with a view to decentralizing activities and/or positions.

To grow the tourism industry throughout the territory, we are proposing to increase the marketing budget of Northwest Territories Tourism by $600,000 this fiscal year and another $600,000 next fiscal year, for a total ongoing increase in NWT Tourism’s marketing budget of $1.2 million annually. NWT Tourism has historically been underfunded relative to other jurisdictions and is losing market share to other destinations. Increased funding will allow NWT Tourism to take advantage of new marketing opportunities reflected in the 2013-14 NWT Tourism Marketing Plan, and focus on opportunities that would promote development in regions that are experiencing declining tourism activity.

This funding is in addition to $1.2 million in direct support to tourism businesses through contributions to build and diversify tourism products, through our Tourism Product Diversification and Marketing Program and the Sport Hunt Outfitter Marketing Support Program. Moving forward, ITI will continue to work with NWT Tourism, and our tourism operators and outfitters to explore ways to grow this important sector of the economy.

We are seeing increased park usage in all regions of the Northwest Territories, but particularly in the North Slave region. During the three-year period between 2008-2011, the North Slave region has seen a rise of over 30 percent of overnight camping use. Ensuring a safe, enjoyable experience for our parks visitors is our top priority. Industry, Tourism and Investment is proposing $110,000 for increased parks enforcement due to increased use, and $30,000 to upgrade the parks communications system in the North Slave region to be compatible with the communications system used by the Royal Canadian Mounted Police.

Tourism offers some of the best opportunities for growth across the NWT, particularly in our smaller communities. Investing in events such as the highly successful NWT Days in Ottawa just this month, as well as Canada’s Northern House at the Vancouver Olympics, allows us to raise the profile of our territory and showcase not only the tourism potential but also the great opportunities that exist in all 33 of our communities.

Industry, Tourism and Investment is also proposing an investment of $14,000 for increased lease charges at our Dempster-Delta Visitor Centre in Dawson City, Yukon. The Dempster Highway is the gateway to the Western Arctic, and this award-

winning centre has staff on hand to provide travel assistance and advice. Continuing to have a presence in the Yukon, at a relatively small investment, is important to encourage travel to that region of the NWT.

In addition, a forced-growth investment of $30,000 is proposed to meet our legal obligations stemming from the Prairie Creek Socio-economic Agreement, which comes into effect in 2013-14. In addition, $40,000 is being proposed to conduct annual on-site employee surveys as provided for under our four current socio-economic agreements. These surveys assess the social, cultural and economic environments as perceived by the workforce of each mine.

In addition to the activities outlined above, there are also some potential large-scale, significant developments in the resource sector that could result in major investments in the Northwest Territories. During this past year, we have seen intense interest in the oil and gas reserves of the Sahtu region. Three companies have confirmed projects in the Sahtu this season, including work on six wells, the construction of transportation infrastructure, the development of quarry sites, and ongoing scientific data gathering on water and wildlife. Upwards of $100 million is expected to be invested and will result in 350 jobs and significant economic spinoffs for local regional economies.

GNWT departments have been working together to find ways to encourage development and minimize impacts associated with the current and planned petroleum exploration activities in the Sahtu region.

ITI led a Sahtu Exploration Readiness Workshop last November in the Sahtu region with Sahtu business leaders, the local Chamber of Commerce, industry representatives and local residents, to discuss ways to ensure the development was mutually beneficial. The meeting was a success and there is potential to make this an annual event. As a result of last year’s initiative, industry is contacting us to expand the scope of the engagement. For its part, Industry, Tourism and Investment is proposing to establish a business development administrator in the community of Norman Wells at a cost of $122,000 annually. Having a dedicated position is key to assisting and developing local businesses in the region to access opportunities arising from this increased activity.

The oil and gas and mining sectors are the cornerstone of the Northwest Territories economy. Our territory has an abundance of untapped resources, ranking sixth out of 72 jurisdictions on the mineral potential index in the 2011-2012 Fraser Institute surveys, and we are just starting to realize the potential for mineral exploration in our territory.

To further explore this potential, we are also undertaking a Mineral Development Strategy, which will help to ensure there is a sustainable mining

future for the Northwest Territories and that it continues to be developed in an environmentally sustainable way. This is being developed in concert with a sustainable Economic Opportunities Strategy, which will identify new opportunities for investment and growth across the territory.

We will have an opportunity to showcase our resource and energy potential this August at the Federal/Provincial/Territorial Energy and Mines Ministers Conference. It is the Northwest Territories’ turn to host the conference and the department is proposing an investment of $227,000 to showcase the NWT and its potential to the rest of Canada. The NWT has major energy potential in areas such as hydro, wind and solar power. In addition, developing mineral exploration projects and providing support for projects that span a wider scope such as lead, zinc, silver, gold, nickel and other rare earth elements has the potential to grow and diversify the Northwest Territories economy. The GNWT is expecting to recoup approximately 90 percent of this funding through delegate conference fees and sponsorships.

Although I have outlined some new and ongoing initiatives this department is proposing, it must also be said that we will continue to support our existing programs to grow and diversify our economy. Demand for our traditional economy and small business programs continues to grow and programs are often oversubscribed.

Funding for the Support to Entrepreneurs and Economic Development Policy will continue with dedicated funding for arts and fine crafts, the film industry and the Prospectors Grubstake Program. ITI is also proposing to continue our investment of over $1 million to the Community Harvesters Assistance Program, $550,000 in promotion and support of commercial harvesting, processing and marketing of fish and meat, and $610,000 under the Genuine Mackenzie Valley Fur Program. NWT furs continue to be in high demand at auction, and there is potential for even higher sales of NWT furs as worldwide demand for our prime wild fur continues to grow. The marketing of wild fur provides great opportunities for residents particularly in our smaller communities to gain economic benefits for their families and communities.

We are also looking to continue investments in Take a Kid Trapping, Take a Kid Harvesting Program, which, with our partners, invested almost $420,000 in 52 projects throughout the NWT.

The initiatives I have touched on are just some examples of how Industry, Tourism and Investment is working on behalf of this Assembly and this government to fulfill its mission, and have a diversified economy that provides all regions and

communities with choices and opportunities as envisioned by the 17th Legislative Assembly.

I look forward to the committee’s comments and questions. Thank you.

Thank you, Minister Ramsay, for those opening comments. Do you have any witnesses that you would like to bring into the Chamber today?

I do, thank you.

Does committee agree?

Thank you. If I could get the Sergeant-at-Arms to bring in our guests.

Thank you. Minister Ramsay, if you could introduce your witnesses to the House, please.

Thank you, Mr. Chairman. I have with me to my left, Mr. Peter Vician, deputy minister of Industry, Tourism and Investment. To my right is Ms. Nancy Magrum, director of shared services, finance and administration, Industry, Tourism and Investment and Environment and Natural Resources.

Thank you, Mr. Ramsay. Mr. Vician, Ms. Magrum, welcome back to the House. We’re going to move on to general comments from committee and then we’ll allow the Minister to have a closing comment at the end. General comments. Ms. Bisaro.

Thank you, Mr. Chairman. I’ve just got a number of things that I want to mention in no particular order. I don’t think it will be any surprise to the Minister to hear me talk about the cost of electricity and what we are doing about it or not doing about it. I am particularly concerned about our subsidy program. It’s a great subsidy, it’s keeping my bills down and I’m happy for that. But I am extremely concerned about what happens when we get to the end of our subsidy for the increased power rates that we’re now experiencing. What are the next steps, is where my head is going. What plan do we have as a government to get us off subsidies? I haven’t yet heard from the government, whether it’s from ITI or whether it’s from the Ministerial Energy Coordinating Committee. I haven’t heard a plan that will make me feel comfortable that we’re not going to be providing millions and millions of dollars in subsidies until time immemorial. So that’s a real concern for me and I think it’s something that in the next couple of years we as a government need to develop a plan and have a long-range and concrete idea about what we’re going to do to deal with the amount of money we put into subsidies.

With regard to tourism, and the Minister mentioned it in his opening comments and it was in the Minister of Finance’s budget address, as well, I’m

extremely pleased to hear that there is going to be an increase to the marketing budget for NWT Tourism. I think it’s overdue. Tourism is a really large part of economic activity in the NWT, and NWT Tourism has been saying for a couple of years now that they want to expand tourism in the NWT but they need to do marketing and they need the money to do adequate marketing. So I’m really pleased to see that we will get an increase to their marketing budget this year and then again in the next budget year. I think that’s going to bode them really well. I think it will also have a big impact on many of our communities outside of the regional centres who may be able to take advantage of the marketing that’s done and develop some businesses.

A minor item, but it does have an impact, and it has to do with parks and the closing date for our parks. My understanding is that we select a date, I think it’s September 15th , and that is the hard and fast

date when we close our parks in the fall. If September 15th falls on a Thursday or a Friday and

the weather is halfway decent, or even if it’s not decent, we still would have people who would want to go out and use the parks after that date. I think it would be of value for the department to consider a flexible date for closing depending on where the 15th of September falls in a week. If it’s falling on a

Monday, well, that’s not a problem, but if it’s falling on a Wednesday, Thursday, or Friday, then I think it would be to our advantage to leave the parks open so our residents can have an opportunity to get another weekend of camping in no matter where they are.

The Mackenzie Valley Pipeline Office, I note in the budget that we still have that office, and I believe the budget document references that we do provide money to the Aboriginal Pipeline Group. I have to wonder why we are doing that. There hasn’t been any activity, really, on the Mackenzie Valley Pipeline for quite some time. My concern is, why are we giving money to the Aboriginal Pipeline Group?

The Sport Hunters Outfitters Marketing Program is something which has been, I think, fully recognized, been accepted and needed by our caribou outfitters. I think it went down quite a bit in money in this current budget year and I gather that there’s an increase in the next budget year. The outfitters are really struggling and I think I would like to have the Minister consider a long-term commitment to this program as opposed to just year by year. An increase in money is always a good thing. I think the outfitters, from what I understand, would like to have… It does cost them probably around $30,000 or $40,000 annually just to keep up their camps. If we could commit to a program that is three years in length as opposed to just one year, and if we could commit to the amount of money that’s required to ensure that outfitters have at least enough money

to maintain their camp in any one year, that would really be of value for them.

I haven’t heard much lately so it makes me wonder about the Come Make Your Mark Campaign. It was very loudly promoted, there was a lot of ballyhoo, for lack of a better word, about it a year or two years ago. I haven’t heard anything in probably the last 12 months. Is that program still operating? Are we still putting money into it? I wonder about the success of that program. Are we not hearing about it because it hasn’t been successful, or are we not hearing about it because it is successful? I would like to know where things are at with that particular program.

Lastly, I’m struggling with my notes here, but I think with regard to NTPC and the government, we talked about this some time ago, but where are things at with the Power Corporation, and the relationship of the Power Corporation to the government? There were some changes being made, I think, at one point. It kind of goes to energy production or electricity production. Do we as a government have the capacity to guide the Power Corporation to where we want to go? It’s hard for me to get out there what I’m trying to say. As a government, and I think it goes back to the subsidies and cost of electricity, are we able to use the Power Corporation to our advantage as opposed to having to bend to their will, so to speak? I hope that was clear. I’m struggling with words on that one.

That’s all I have. Thank you very much.

Thank you, Ms. Bisaro. Moving on with general questions I have Mr. Bouchard.

Thank you, Mr. Chairman. I’m hoping to start with a few general comments. Mine are in no specific order, either, I guess.

Obviously the first one that I would like to get some more details on the implementation of the decentralization by the department is the transfer of the positions over to Hay River and when the department expects that to happen. We’re obviously very pleased and excited to hear about that in the Hay River area. Just to see when that implementation will happen. I guess, when would we see those positions actually on the ground in Hay River? It would be nice to have a game plan from the department on how that implementation is going to be happening.

I, too, have questions about the Mackenzie Gas Project. Are there any updates to it or are we just expecting that to be at a standstill for the next year? Ms. Bisaro had mentioned the funding to the pipeline group and where we’re standing with that. Have we maintained the same levels?

I know from our side, as Members, we were asking for $1.2 million in marketing starting this year. The

department’s committed to doing $600,000 this year and then another $600,000 next year to get to the $1.2 million. I’d like to see us get to the $1.2 million this year, to the point where we can increase that amount. That’s a wish list, I guess.

Along the lines of tourism, I’d also like to, I know when we were discussing the business plans the department’s analysis of the marketing dollars that the department puts in and what kind of return we get into different areas. If we’re marketing on TV or whatever, are we seeing the results in our viewing, the results in fishing, general tourists? Do we see it in sports and leisure visitors? It would be nice to have a better indication or some more details on that as far as where our money is going.

Obviously, as the MLA for Hay River, I’m interested in the small business sector and the volume and amount of the SEED program. Is that maintaining its level or are we increasing those amounts this year? We’re, obviously, interested in seeing small business expanding throughout the Northwest Territories. I’d like to know what the status of the SEED program is.

I’m also very interested in the department’s assistance in agriculture and the fishing industry to vital parts of expanding areas for the Hay River area. Obviously we’d like to see the fishery expanded to the way of old, picking the volumes back up and what the department’s plan is to assist in that area. As well as the agriculture, the small agriculture that we have in the Northwest Territories mostly based in the South Slave area, it’s expanding throughout the Northwest Territories. I know there’s some in Norman Wells and there’s a little bit in Inuvik. What are the department’s plans to assist in the expansion of the agriculture that is basically helpful in reducing the cost of living for some people throughout the Northwest Territories and to the development of jobs?

Some of the other questions I’ll have as we go along, I know we discussed in last year’s budget the permafrost scientist position in Inuvik and I just wanted to make sure that it had been filled and what the status of that position is. If it hasn’t been filled, when will it be filled and why hasn’t it been filled?

I, too, have some questions on the energy side. I see the $50,000 for the Water Monitoring Program in Kakisa, which I assume is some sort of river generating system. I’m just wondering why the department would be doing this again. I know we’ve tried that in Fort Simpson, with limited success. What is the difference between that program and this program? Are we not just reproducing things that we’ve done before with limited results?

Those are my opening comments. I will have more detail as we go along.

Thank you, Mr. Bouchard. Next on my list is Mr. Yakeleya.

Thank you, Madam Chair. I’m happy to see the Minister making some strong efforts in taking care of the opportunities that are in the Sahtu region and the development of some of the business opportunities that could take some presence in regard to the, oil and gas Canol shale play in the Sahtu region.

The Minister is looking at some partnerships within ITI and there are many types of partnerships. I look forward to seeing where there are some various levels of different types of partnerships. We have partnerships with oil and gas, partnerships with the community, with Aboriginal businesses, with northern businesses and different partnerships that would promote community self-reliance.

As my colleague indicated, one of them is agriculture. In the Hay River area they have a lot of chickens and eggs. That’s something that I really support. Every store in the Northwest Territories, hopefully, in five years should be having these Polar Eggs on their shelves and we should buy from the North. I would like to see some type of measurement.

When the Minister talks about community self-reliance, I’d like to see some type of initiative that would have the Norman Wells potatoes, for example. In five years we should be filling half of our potato shelves in our Northern Co-op Stores or Northern Stores. That would promote community self-reliance and promote the development of our most valuable resources, which is our people. So it’s things like that that I look forward to the Minister providing good quality programs and services that would obtain these highly achievable results, It could happen. So I look forward to the Minister in that area.

The Minister wants to promote and support the Northwest Territories. We are no different than him and his department. We also want to do it. We saw that in Vancouver. It was a very good job. We also saw that recently in Ottawa, where the North has been promoted as a place to potentially address dollars in our economy, our resources. This, in turn, supports local businesses and people in our small communities.

I guess what we look at is the economic prosperity that the North could have. It’s overwhelming when you look at the prosperity and the wealth in the Northwest Territories. One of the obstacles that we need to look at through the economic area is the infrastructure. It’s no surprise to the Minister that when you look at a region that has gained some attraction in oil and gas and the oil companies are going for the money in my region, we need to look at some much improved infrastructure. We should talk to some other Ministers to see this come to fruition. However, I support the Minister in creating

some of the economic prosperity in the Northwest Territories.

At the same time I’m saying that, the Minister is very cognizant of the sustainable development, the renewable resource development in the areas of conservation and the protection of our environment. The Minister noted that we have the young children. We want a good, strong environment for our children. We value the environment, and that’s where we look at how we balance the protection but also the opportunity for our children to make a living off our land. That’s where the Minister is going to be going. I look forward to some of his discussions and ideas as to how we do this. That’s exciting.

I think he has some viewpoints that need to be shared with us sometime in the future as to having a paper that would protect our environment, protect our pristine area through the Protected Areas Strategy, through our land use plans. I’ve been working with this colleague, ENR, and how do we have both. How do we use both to our most beneficial opportunity for sustaining ourselves as a young, developing territory in the Northwest Territories? I ask the Minister to come with us with some of your thoughts so we can have a good discussion.

The last point I want to ask the Minister is that I look for avenues and opportunities where you could see the North being promoted, utilizing what we have here with our culture, with our language and with the diamonds. I think you did a good job of utilizing the diamonds in the southern part of the North. When you go down south, they always talk about the polar bear diamonds. They’ve branded well. People are starting to say they want the polar bear diamonds. So utilizing and marketing those key marketing strategies that will sell the North to the southern people.

I guess I want to end off with the Minister looking at tourism, tourism in areas where we don’t yet have an all-weather road. So how do we promote? Because it will be a while before we build an all-weather road. So how do we promote small communities like the ones in the Sahtu or any other small communities that we represent? How do we get tours into those communities knowing that there is the high cost of flights, accommodations might not be up to the standards that typical tourists like, and not enough things to do? Is that something that we just have to face saying, you know what, guys, we can only attract 5 percent of the tourists, and the next 80 percent of the tourists are going to be here in Yellowknife because it is just the way the market is? We can’t keep on saying we’ll try each community. We know that’s not going to happen.

There are only so many people that can visit Deline. The world’s biggest trout was caught in Deline, 85 pounds. I don’t see any tourist marketing on that. Surely we can’t be that ignorant of the fact

that that is something we should use to attract people. Eighty-five pounds, the largest world record trout caught, but I don’t see much tourism attraction and marketing of that, or Great Bear Lake being the birthplace of ice hockey, or the biggest muskox was shot in Norman Wells.

We seem to be marketing different areas or the Nahanni on the river. We have to start marketing some of those, or the Canol. It’s considered the world’s…(inaudible)… I think we have to have some selection of our marketing in that area. That is what I wanted to ask the Minister. When you look at marketing, I asked him if he would look at the whole North and focus on some of those key areas that we have in the Northwest Territories. I’m only speaking of the Sahtu. I think we have some good things we could market, but we also have to be realistic on how much we can market. I look forward to going to the Minister and his budget. Thank you.

Thank you, Mr. Yakeleya. We are on general comments. Next on my list is Mr. Moses.