This is page numbers 3763 – 3804 of the Hansard for the 17th Assembly, 5th Session. The original version can be accessed on the Legislative Assembly's website or by contacting the Legislative Assembly Library. The word of the day was land.

The Speaker

The Speaker Jackie Jacobson

Thank you, Mr. Nadli. The honourable Premier, Mr. McLeod.

Question 149-17(5): Dehcho Land Use Plan
Oral Questions

Yellowknife South

Bob McLeod

Bob McLeod Premier

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. I thank the Member for the question. As a government we are very supportive of land use plans. We have land use plans with the Gwich’in, the Sahtu, the Tlicho, and we’ve been working with the Dehcho on the Dehcho Land Use Plan. We’ve signed a bilateral terms of reference with the grand chief where we have been working together without prejudice to find ways to resolve some very complex land issues, and we’re very supportive of the Dehcho Land Use Plan going forward. As I said before, every time I meet with Minister Valcourt I

press the need for appointing a Minister’s special representative for the Dehcho, and also a federal representative for the Land Use Planning Advisory Commission that’s working on the plan. We fully participate, so we’re looking forward to having a Dehcho Land Use Plan very soon.

Michael Nadli

Michael Nadli Deh Cho

Part of the ongoing process of negotiations was the concept of the Dehcho resource management authority where a regional structure will be established involving all people within the Deh Cho. On that basis, I know it would be a critical piece in terms of how it is that the land use plan could stand and at the same time be implemented and become operational. I wanted to ask the Minister if that indeed is the case that all parties are striving towards.

Bob McLeod

Bob McLeod Yellowknife South

I don’t want to be talking out of school here because we’re still going through different processes. The Dehcho are going through their process; we’re going through our process. But I think we just have to be careful here. We are talking about such an authority, but I think we have to make sure that the understandings and definitions of what that authority will be are consistent. I can say that we are discussing that.

Michael Nadli

Michael Nadli Deh Cho

In the past this government has been very supportive of regional councils that involve municipal governments and First Nations governments, and I know that the Northwest Territories has regional district administrative centres throughout the NWT, including the Dehcho.

Can the Premier explain how it is that perhaps that could be very consistent and almost a parallel process with First Nations’ aspirations towards self-government?

Bob McLeod

Bob McLeod Yellowknife South

As part and parcel of self-government negotiations, I think wherever we are negotiating, governance is a discussion that we have in any negotiations that we have, and I think the leaders in the Northwest Territories have been very creative, and I think that as we see more and more self-government agreements are negotiated I think we are going to see much more of that.

The Speaker

The Speaker Jackie Jacobson

Thank you, Mr. McLeod. Final, short supplementary, Mr. Nadli.

Michael Nadli

Michael Nadli Deh Cho

My last question is: Would the Minister agree that regional administrative centres could become regional self-government models?

Bob McLeod

Bob McLeod Yellowknife South

There are three negotiating parties at the table, and we have to have some consistency across the Northwest Territories, but we do have a regional administrative system already in the Northwest Territories, so I expect that that’s something that could be negotiated, I would think.

The Speaker

The Speaker Jackie Jacobson

Thank you, Mr. McLeod. The Member for Yellowknife Centre, Mr. Hawkins.

Robert Hawkins

Robert Hawkins Yellowknife Centre

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. I raised the issue yesterday about direct appointments, and my view is it’s very important to create them in a transparent manner. At no time, of course, did I say I was against direct appointments, but it’s simply based on the transparency of them. In my Member’s statement I certainly spoke about two dozen shared services employees that have been shown the door by this government in its reorg. Now is an opportunity for the Premier to start using his direct appointment authority in an open, transparent, and maybe even a reasonable way.

I would ask the Premier, would he be willing to take all the names of the two dozen shared services employees who’ve been shown the door by this government, and use his authority at the Cabinet table to appoint these folks through direct appointments so their jobs aren’t lost after they’ve dedicated themselves in some cases 10, 20 and 30 years to this public service and are feeling as if they got the cold shoulder.

The Speaker

The Speaker Jackie Jacobson

Thank you, Mr. Hawkins. The honourable Premier, Mr. McLeod.

Bob McLeod

Bob McLeod Premier

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. We do have various processes in this government, some of which we’ve negotiated through a collective bargaining process, and whenever there’s a change in organization or a change in approach, there’s a process that we have to follow in terms of filling positions. We also have an Affected Employee Policy whereby affected employees have priority on existing positions. I’d be very surprised if there was as much of a problem as the Member is suggesting, so I’d be willing to hear where he sees the problem is happening.

Robert Hawkins

Robert Hawkins Yellowknife Centre

Many of these employees have 10, 20 and 25 years of experience. They don’t meet their numbers, so in other words, they’re too young to retire, they don’t have enough years in the public service to qualify, so even if they wanted to take early retirement, they don’t qualify. Some are being offered these eight-month training programs and told good luck after that. There have been a few who have been able to hit their numbers and said the only option for them is to retire, obviously.

I’m asking the Premier, would he be willing to use his authority at the Cabinet table to direct appoint these employees that aren’t just Yellowknife employees, there are Fort Simpson employees, they are territorial employees and they’re certainly family people who pay taxes. Here’s an opportunity when we have 571 jobs that the government is actively looking at – 24 people only really represent 4 percent of that workforce – here’s an opportunity for the Premier.

Bob McLeod

Bob McLeod Yellowknife South

The Member is correct; 24 people were affected by shared services, 20 of them have jobs. There are four that have still not been placed, one in the Deh Cho and three in Yellowknife. I fully expect that they will all find suitable, reasonable employment consistent with what they are doing now.

Robert Hawkins

Robert Hawkins Yellowknife Centre

Would the Premier be willing to ensure that these people are guaranteed a job somewhere in the government if, after their training experience, there is no job opening up for them?

I can tell you some of these folks have been doing jobs like they’ve been doing today for 20 or 25 years, and their jobs have been reclassified and they have been told to go reapply for them. By the way, they don’t qualify for interviews anymore. That’s part of the problem here, so I’m asking what guarantees will this Premier provide this sector and what message is he sending by just letting the process roll out by itself with no protection. It sends the wrong message to our territory and certainly the public service. Thank you.

Bob McLeod

Bob McLeod Yellowknife South

As a government, we look after all our employees. Our employees are our most valuable asset, so I think it’s very misleading to suggest that we are throwing these employees under the bus. As a matter of fact, we do have an Affected Employee Policy. We will be placing these employees. We have told all of them that they will find jobs. Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

The Speaker

The Speaker Jackie Jacobson

Thank you, Mr. McLeod. Final, short supplementary, Mr. Hawkins.

Robert Hawkins

Robert Hawkins Yellowknife Centre

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Is the Premier saying in this House – and I’d like him to be crystal clear about this – after the affected employees are sent off for re-programming, retraining or reclassification, whatever you want to call it, will he guarantee them positions after this? They are told they are out on their own after they have been retrained and good luck. That’s the message they are being told. The Premier is trying to tell me something different in this House. I want him to be very clear. Will these employees be offered employment after their training program has been done? Thank you very much.

Bob McLeod

Bob McLeod Premier

Our government is not recognized as one of the 100 best employees in Canada because we aren’t looking after employees. If the Member has a list of employees affected that aren’t being offered jobs and are being shown the door, give it to us and we’ll fix the problem. Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

The Speaker

The Speaker Jackie Jacobson

Thank you, Mr. McLeod. The honourable Member for Frame Lake, Ms. Bisaro.

Wendy Bisaro

Wendy Bisaro Frame Lake

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. I would like to ask some questions of the Minister of Finance today. I’d like to try to make some sense of the budget numbers that we’ve been given. I’d like to try to make some sense of the answers the Minister gave me and Mr. Dolynny yesterday. I’m hearing mixed messages. I’m trying desperately to understand what the Minister is telling me.

I would like to refer the Minister again to page 5-9 of the budget, the revenue summary under the Department of Finance specifically to the personal income and the corporate income tax numbers. It’s about $158 million estimated for the 2014-15 budget year. The 2013-14 budget estimates slightly more in revenues; it’s about $165 million.

The Minister, yesterday, stated personal income tax and corporate income tax revenues will be about $30 million short, and he said that in the budget address. So my first question to the Minister is to ask the Minister to please tell me in dollars, how much personal income tax and corporate income tax revenues are expected for the 2014-15 budget, and please include the anticipated loss of $30 million. Thank you.

The Speaker

The Speaker Jackie Jacobson

Thank you, Ms. Bisaro. The honourable Minister of Finance, Mr. Miltenberger.

Michael Miltenberger

Michael Miltenberger Minister of Finance

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. That sounds like a written question to me, so I’ll take it as notice. Thank you.

The Speaker

The Speaker Jackie Jacobson

Thank you, Mr. Miltenberger. The honourable Member for Inuvik Boot Lake, Mr. Moses.