Thank you, Ms. Bisaro. Just give us a second to circulate that motion.

Committee, the motion is in order. Motion is carried.

---Carried

We are going to continue on with Tabled Document 52-17(5), Supplementary Estimates (Operation Expenditures), No. 4, 2013-2014. We will go to the Minister responsible for opening comments. Minister Miltenberger.

Thank you, Mr. Chair. I’m here to present Supplementary Estimates (Operations Expenditures) No. 4, 2013-14. This document outlines an increase of $30.525 million in operations expenditures for the 2013-2014 fiscal year.

The more significant items included in the supplementary estimates are:

1. $6.6 million for the Department of Health and

Social Services for increased costs for the provision of health care services to non-NWT residents. These costs will be recovered from the patient’s home province or territory.

2. $5.9 million for the Department of Health and

Social Services for increased costs associated with adults in residential care outside the Northwest Territories.

3. $3.8 million for the Department of Health and

Social Services for increased costs associated with the provision of health care services for NWT residents in non-NWT hospitals.

4. $3.4 million for the Department of Health and

Social Services for increased costs associated with children in residential care outside the Northwest Territories.

5. 2.5 million for the Department of Health and

Social Services for increased costs for medical travel.

6. $1,728,000 for the Department of Public Works

and Services for increases in electricity rates.

I am prepared to review the details of the supplementary estimates document. Thank you, Mr. Chair.

Thank you, Mr. Miltenberger. Mr. Miltenberger, if you can one final time introduce your witnesses to the House.

Thank you, Mr. Chair. I have with me Mr. Mike Aumond, deputy minister of Finance; Mr. Sandy Kalgutkar, deputy secretary to the FMB. Thank you.

Thank you, Mr. Miltenberger. Again, thanks to Mr. Kalgutkar and Mr. Aumond for joining us today. Committee, general comments. Mr. Bromley.

Thank you, Mr. Chair. Unfortunately, this expenditure will drive us well beyond our supplementary reserve. In fact, it blows it right out of the water. In the supportive

documents, I keep seeing the word shortfall. What’s happened here is we have done a very shoddy job on budgeting. This is riddled with examples of entirely predictable costs and it reflects to me a really irresponsible approach to budgeting in the first place, and here we are again putting our supplementary reserve into major deficit. This isn’t the first time this has been brought up. We have been bringing this up repeatedly. Again, I have to question what’s going on here.

Again, many of these things are known well in advance. I will be pointing out examples as we go, but I’d say this practice has to stop. These are major dollars. Obviously, we are not through the year yet, who knows what we’ll come up in a year or two from now for this fiscal year. But I am very disappointed to see these sorts of things coming forward when we’re not even through our year here.

That’s just an…(inaudible)…comment there and I will be commenting as we go. Thank you.

Thank you, Mr. Bromley. Minister Miltenberger.

Thank you, Mr. Chair. I will accept the Member has the right to make his comments. I would take exception to the characterization of shoddy and irresponsible. We take this work very seriously. This is a $1.6 billion operation. It’s very complex. There are many variables we can’t control. There are many demand-driven services. I have and this Assembly has full confidence in the Department of Finance and the budget because we just approved it in the Committee of the Whole yesterday, I think, with the exception of one vote against, everybody else supported it. So we will have the discussion. Yes, there are costs that exceed our Supplementary Reserve Fund, but to characterize the work of the Finance department as shoddy and irresponsible is one, as Minister, I take exception to. Thank you.

Perhaps I could ask what the purpose of the Reserve Fund is and why it’s set at the point that it’s set at and why we are exceeding that by $26 million.

Mr. Chairman, the intent of the fund is to allow us to address unanticipated pressures that we may not have anticipated in the budget. Many are demand-driven programs and you look at one of the big drivers is some of the significant costs related to services to adults and children in southern jurisdictions for example. It gives us a target. We try to hold it, along with our forced growth costs, we try to maintain that, but there are some costs that we can’t anticipate and there are costs that we have to be prepared to pay. Thank you.

I think many entities would budget with this in mind. If the supplementary reserve is insufficient, let’s change it. But what

happens is we end up stealing from Peter to pay Paul here when in fact we could allocate responsibly right in the beginning. As I say, this degree of correction is unacceptable in my mind. Many of these things, as I say, are predictable and pretty well known. This government’s been operating a long time.

Thank you, Mr. Bromley. I’m trying to find a question in there. I will leave it at that, I guess. General comments. I have Mr. Menicoche, followed by Ms. Bisaro. Mr. Menicoche.

Thank you very much, Mr. Chair. I know it’s a pretty significant budget at $30 million and I think the term mini-budget is usually termed when you have some such large expenditures. Of course, they are largely unforeseen. I can certainly concur with that.

I have a couple of questions. Firstly, are any of these from the supplementary appropriation list of $30 million, is any of that included in the base going forward into 2014-15 fiscal year at all?

Thank you, Mr. Menicoche. For that we will go to Mr. Aumond.

Thank you, Mr. Aumond. Mr. Menicoche.

Thank you very much. Because it was a significant over-expenditure again, as well, for the predicted 2013-14, are we looking at then a deficit budget based on these new numbers that we have before us?

Thank you, Mr. Menicoche. Mr. Miltenberger.

No, Mr. Chair.

Thank you, Mr. Miltenberger. Mr. Menicoche.

Thank you. I think he said no. Okay. Can he explain – that is such a significant $30 million adjustment to the 2013-14 budget – how we can be under?

Thank you, Mr. Menicoche. For that we will go to Mr. Aumond.