Masi. Members' statements. Member for Nunakput.

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, recently the NWT Help Line held its first group phone session. This session, ready to host up to 23 people, provided an opportunity for NWT residents to talk to experts and to hear from each other in a confidential and supportive setting, no matter where they were calling from.

The topic, too, was something that is sadly familiar to too many families across our territory: suicide and suicide awareness.

Programs like this, Mr. Speaker, and others such as Mental Health First Aid, sharing circles, and confidential online chats through the NWT Help Line Facebook page are vital for Northerners. Mr. Speaker, Inuit residents are particularly in need. Our neighbours in Nunavut have declared a suicide crisis in their region, and more broadly, Statistics Canada reported that nearly a quarter of Inuit have had suicidal thoughts at least once in their lives.

Inuit mental health, Mr. Speaker, is frequently challenged in our small communities. These communities are our homes, the traditional territory of our ancestors, but at the same time Canadian colonization has left deep wounds: the legacy of residential schools, addictions, and family violence.

Inuit are strong people, but even the strongest people cannot heal and thrive without dedicated community support and resources for the people. I am concerned, Mr. Speaker, that my riding of Nunakput and its communities of Paulatuk, Sachs Harbour, Tuktoyaktuk, and Ulukhaktok, lack clear mental health support for youth, and in particular for Inuit men.

Research from Statistics Canada tells us that chronic health conditions and food security are "key predictors of mental health distress for Inuit men." This should come as no surprise, knowing, as everyone in the House must know, how difficult it is to access fresh, healthy, and fairly priced food on a regular basis in remote communities.

Despite these factors, I am optimistic, Mr. Speaker. I am looking forward to the expansion of the essential services that the NWT Help Line offers. Knowing the needs we must meet is the first step, but we must continue to be vigilant and support all regions across the NWT when it comes to mental health. Quyanainni, Mr. Speaker.

Masi. Members' statements. Member for Kam Lake.

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, I rise today to speak of recent developments with Aurora College and the announcement of the ending of two important programs for students enrolled in the education faculty, specifically in regards to the Social Work Diploma program.

In the 2014-15 fiscal year, 25 first-year students registered for this program. Out of those, six students graduated with diplomas and six graduates were hired or offered jobs immediately after ending their program. In fact, in the overall education program's division, full-time student enrolment has increased by 28 per cent in 2015-16. These are hopeful and positive results that there is traction for this program.

We have heard that enrolment is low and graduation rates are low as well, which is part of the rationale for terminating this. It seems like there is a lot of uptake and certainly a lot of interest currently from members of the public who are concerned about these changes. I, too, am concerned, Mr. Speaker. However, we have to look at the overall impact of the college. The college currently receives the bulk of our post-secondary education funding, yet full-time enrolment has decreased significantly, as have graduation rates.

These millions of dollars to support these anemic outcomes are awarded year on year, and yet now the college is increasing tuition by $300 a year over the next two years, adding to the cost of living of students who have limited means to begin with.

For an institution that is supposedly at arm's length, Mr. Speaker, the Minister has enormous influence, including appointing the president and governors and more recently giving direction directly to the college. This is an opportunity for us to use this resource and properly to fund it.

Again, I call on the Minister to complete the strategic plan and start getting Aurora College moving in the right direction. We have seen College nordique have an exponential growth in interest. We have seen Dechinta University bring in half a million dollars from the federal government. Our private sector partners are doing well. Northerners want to learn. We need to make Aurora College a world-class institution, and we need to keep working on that, Mr. Speaker. I encourage, again, the Minister to work on the strategic plan and get it on the table in this House without delay. Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

Masi. Members' statements. Item 4, returns to oral questions. Member for Tu Nedhe-Wiilideh.

Marci cho, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, I seek unanimous consent to move to item 11 on the orders of the day, replies to Budget Address. Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

---Unanimous consent granted

Item 11, replies to budget address. Member for Deh Cho.

Mahsi, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, I would to thank my honourable colleagues for speaking before me on this very important matter. I want to take this time to offer my thoughts on the 2017-18 budget. As you know, my riding of the Deh Cho is made up of mostly small communities. I hope with my remarks today to represent the concerns of the people who live in my riding.

Mr. Speaker, I believe that the budget should be about vision and leadership first, fiscal prudence second. It is very clear that our House is divided on the matter of fiscal priorities. On one hand, the Minister of Finance and Cabinet are fixated on fiscal restraint and debt management, while we on this side of the House want to ensure that the pressing needs of our people are met. For example, on a daily basis we hear about the needs of our constituents, of the critical need for accessible housing and programs, a responsive and compassionate healthcare system, and the desires for a better way of life through jobs and business opportunities.

I believe these are some of the challenges we all face. However, while we exalt the principles of working together in a consensus system, I don't see a genuine effort on the part of my Cabinet colleagues to work in a spirit of collaboration. It is very hard for me to accept the argument of fiscal restraint when we've tried to work with Cabinet and propose initiatives and are told, "we'll look into it," and the concerns of our constituents are somehow lost in transit.

What is more disappointing is when we are told we have limited resources for projects and then, later on, Cabinet suddenly announces major investments in initiatives of their own. A case in point is the recent purchase of NTCL assets and expenditures of $7 million that just magically appeared like manna from heaven. Another is the purchase of the defunct Cantung Mine property for $4.5 million, another investment that wasn't in the government's business plan. Mr. Speaker, this lack of communication and transparency is not consistent with the principles of consensus government. It does not bode well for a positive working relationship between Cabinet and the Regular Members for the remainder of this Assembly.

Mr. Speaker, I disagree with the priorities put forth in this budget. This budget focuses more on debt management and less on key strategic investments. Our northern economy needs a boost in the allocation of key resources which can cause stimulus and job creation and business opportunities. At least there are positives in the form of continued efforts in infrastructure initiatives, including the Mackenzie Valley Fibre Optic Link Project, the completion of the Inuvik to Tuktoyaktuk Highway, and the recent announcement of the road to Whati, but there are still half-commitments that have been made, such as the junior kindergarten, which create more uncertainty.

To ensure we have a balanced approach to the budget, we have presented to our Cabinet colleagues requests for modest investment in initiatives that in total amount to less than 1 per cent of this $1.7-billion budget. We have recommended the need for investments in employment funding to small communities, the enhancements of home care services to address the aging senior population, road access funding, and the stimulus package for job creation and business growth for small communities and regional centres. However, these requests are not reflected in this budget.

The 2017-18 budget was the product of a process that started in the business planning cycle. Mr. Speaker, it's not my first rodeo, and I've been through this process many times. Each department goes through internal planning and then presents the findings to their Ministers. Ministers and their senior officials then present the business plans to Regular MLAs and standing committees. As Regular MLAs, it's at this point that we become aware of the operations and maintenance and infrastructure projects scheduled for the upcoming fiscal year. What is important to note is it is at this stage that as Regular MLAs we're given the opportunity to express the concerns of our constituents to each department. Generally, that is the process we have to work within, and we try to do it constructively and cooperatively.

It is a huge disappointment to me and to my colleagues on this side of the House when we see the Main Estimates and the modest investments we have requested are not there. Mr. Speaker, these modest investments would make a big, positive impact for our residents without affecting 1 per cent of the GNWT's bottom line. It is very hard for my colleagues and I on this side of the House to believe that our concerns are being heard when the government tells us that they cannot afford these investments while finding big dollars to bail out failing northern business ventures, no matter how important they might be.

I understand the fiscal priorities of this budget must be measured against the 18th Assembly mandate which was developed by all 19 MLAs when we were elected. The 18th Assembly mandate document commits us to work in the following key sectors of the NWT, including education, training and youth development; cost of living; community wellness and safety; economy; environment and climate change; and governance. Within this broad mandate, there is a lot of room for differing priorities. I believe we can do more to enhance tourism and the fishing industry, for example. No fiscal strategy should jeopardize the success of this government to complete its mandate.

I also believe that we can and must do more to ensure the timely settlement of outstanding land claims and self-government negotiations. At the beginning of the 18th Assembly, we all agreed that this is integral for the political and economic well-being of the Northwest Territories.

Because of devolution and the greater authority and power that come with it, there needs to be a bigger government to implement the lands and resource systems that we are now responsible for administering. If this budget is approved, it will reduce the size of government. Has the government looked at how this might impact our new responsibilities under devolution or how it might impact our work to settle outstanding lands, resources, and self-government negotiations?

I encourage the government not to lose sight of the importance of this work. I encourage the review of negotiating mandates that respect constitutional rights of First Nations and reflect the spirit of the United Nations' Declaration on the Rights of Indigenous Peoples. My hope is that continued efforts are made to ensure the fair and just conclusion of land claims and self-government negotiations.

Mr. Speaker, let us be reminded that we seek roles in leadership because we want to make a difference in our families and communities. We all want to make things better for our communities. The time is now to make a change. Mahsi, Mr. Speaker.

Masi. Replies to budget address. Member for Yellowknife Centre.

Mahsi, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, if the preparation of the budget for the last fiscal year was a sprint, quickly compiled after the election, budget preparation for the next fiscal year has been a marathon. We started in September and, despite intensive negotiations and some movement on both sides, we are at an impasse. This afternoon, I want to talk about some of the reasons we are stuck.

In my last Budget Address, I talked about some important and unfinished business around the mandate. We Members of the 18th Assembly do not have a common fiscal goal. This lack of consensus created division during the last budget, and it is fueling division again. The government wants to reduce spending in order to generate a cash surplus. This surplus would be invested in infrastructure. Specifically, the government suggested we cut $150 million in spending over the life of this Assembly to create that surplus.

We Regular MLAs rejected the size of this cut, describing it as austerity for the NWT at a time when investment was needed instead. There has been some movement on this point. In his budget last week, the Finance Minister revised the scope of the cuts to $100 million.

Mr. Speaker, the Finance Minister is playing the long game with his fiscal strategy. While the cuts proposed in this budget will generate a small $15 million surplus by next March, that surplus will grow to $167 million by the end of our term. The Finance Minister will then be able to claim he has generated the first cash surplus in 10 years. To be clear, he is proposing to reverse the deficit the government spent 10 years creating in just four years. The question is: at what cost to the people of the NWT? We are back to our original question: do we need austerity or do we need investment?

We are looking at as many as 200 positions being eliminated this fiscal year and next, creating a major hit to the public service and to local economies throughout the Northwest Territories. As the reality of those losses combined with the slow-down of our economy sinks in, how do we reverse the flow of out migration? The number of people leaving the NWT is at nearly the same level it was during the recession of 2008. My answer to these questions is simple: we can't afford to lose any more jobs or any more people because of decisions made by this government.

Mr. Speaker, I am now going to turn from the fiscal context to the budget itself. The budget isn't all bad news by any means. There are some important investments for residents of my riding, Yellowknife Centre. Downtown residents have been struggling with the effects of a growing population of people who are regularly intoxicated and who may also be homeless. While this population is mostly not from Yellowknife Centre originally, or even from Yellowknife, they have been drawn downtown by their needs and/or addictions. Until recently, our response to this population has been wholly inadequate, and I'm glad to say that's changing.

The location of the day shelter kitty-corner to the liquor store on 49th Street has been a source of bitter complaint, especially from some of my constituents who live at the Northern Heights condominiums on the same street. Among other unpleasant facts, they often encounter bodily waste on the street and verbal harassment when they enter the building or parking garage.

I appreciate the commitment by the Minister of Health and Social Services to move the day shelter as soon as another location is found. I am mindful, however, that the day shelter is unlikely to be welcomed anywhere because of a strong "not in my back yard" reaction to the people who use it.

Thanks to the good work done by the authors of the Yellowknife Homelessness Road Map Action Plan, an investment by both the City of Yellowknife and GNWT, progress on the long-standing problems downtown is at hand. The city has advertised for a service provider for the Street Outreach Service. It's my understanding that paid staff with a vehicle will circulate through downtown assisting individuals in need, and in some cases transporting them to the appropriate facility. I welcome the territorial government investment in a sobering centre as a destination for men and women who are intoxicated. I want to see the program implemented as soon as possible for the sake of those individuals who are intoxicated, as well as for those of us who live and work downtown.

I'm also encouraged to see a further investment in the emergency shelters to expand their capacity to offer semi-independent living. Mr. Speaker, Yellowknife Centre has a large population of seniors. They live at AVENS, Mary Murphy, and in their own homes. As a reminder, the population of seniors is growing like a forest fire on a hot, windy day and is now nearing its peak. The waiting list for the independent living units at AVENS is six years long, and there are waiting lists for the manor and the dementia facility as well. We need to increase services to seniors now.

The Finance Minister's commitment to provide $500,000 to low-income seniors for repairs to their homes is welcome, but it doesn't go nearly far enough. I suggest this amount of money could be spent in Yellowknife Centre alone. Its impact spread among 19 ridings will be negligible.

One of the investments MLAs on this side of the House want to see is an additional $1.3 million to help seniors age in place. Not only do most seniors want to stay in their own homes for as long as possible, there are considerable savings for government if they make these investments, and all this money gets spent with local small contractors.

Mr. Speaker, Regular MLAs have heard the concerns of seniors about the need to increase homecare services, a key element to help seniors age in place. In a letter to MLAs last fall, the president of NWT Seniors wrote, and I quote:

"The field of homecare has been eroded in our territory to the point where frustration and worry about the future are common concerns expressed by patients, healthcare professionals, and homecare staff. We need a new influx of money to fill the gaps that exist in actualizing our priorities, such as aging in place."

These investments in caring for seniors need to be increased as soon as possible.

I want to touch on other welcome news. Yellowknife Centre residents, along with people across the NWT, will benefit from implementing a basic 911 emergency response service. Given all the time that Yellowknifers spend on trails and lakes around the city, residents will experience a greater peace of mind knowing that help is a phone call away.

Mr. Speaker, I heard from many Yellowknife residents in the last month about the need to fully fund the implementation of junior kindergarten. Their argument was clear and compelling: another year of school should not be added at the expense of students in kindergarten to grade 12. I'm pleased the Minister heard this message and agreed to fully fund education for four-year-olds starting this September. There are still some loose ends around the need to spend more on busing, extending inclusive schooling to junior kindergarten, and accommodating other service providers who work with the four-year-olds, but I'll expand on these issues at another time.

Mr. Speaker, residents in Yellowknife Centre and across the NWT find that their spending power has been diminished. The price of rent, electricity, and food are big drivers of the cost of living here in Yellowknife. Many families have trouble making ends meet even when both parents work full-time. I'm hopeful that the new NWT Child Benefit will supplement the advantage of the Canada Child Benefit in reducing poverty, especially among children.

As I mentioned a few minutes ago, it's a sad fact that one in five children in the NWT lives in poverty. We can't expect them to realize their full potential while their family struggles with hunger and providing them with other necessities. The new NWT Child Benefit is expected to reach 1,600 families with an income of less than $80,000 a year. That's a step in the right direction, as is the proposed increase in income assistance allowances to cover the higher prices of food and other necessities.

Mr. Speaker, Regular MLAs wanted to see additional investments in budget 2017. The gap between what the government is offering and Regular MLAs have requested is worth about $10 million, or 0.6 per cent of the total $1.7 billion budget. This is a small number for such a great gulf from achieving consensus. In addition to the initiatives I've already mentioned, we want to see an additional half a million dollars added to the Anti-Poverty Fund. As I mentioned just now, the fund provides small grants to grass-roots organizations across the NWT to respond to poverty at the local level.

Mr. Speaker, applications for funding outstripped money available by a ratio of 4:1 last year. As I said in my statement today, no real change in the multi-generational cycle of poverty will be achieved until we invest in reducing the number of people who live in poverty.

Mr. Speaker, we also want to see a half-million dollar investment in suicide prevention funding. There were a number of suicides across the territory last year; an indication of the pervasiveness of mental health needs, especially among youth. These issues are often driven by addictions, so we need to be able to address mental health and addictions together. We need to improve our response to this cry for help by our young people as soon as possible.

Regular MLAs also wanted to see an additional $600,000 investment to create a mobile delivery model for a healing program that assists men who have used violence in their intimate relationships.

Mr. Speaker, we also want to see almost $3 million invested in ITI to benefit businesses of all kinds, from assistance to junior mining companies through the Mining Incentive Program to offsetting the costs of freight the fishermen pay on their catch.

Mr. Speaker, 146 businesses opened in Yellowknife in 2015, according to city statistics. Small business is a key driver of our economy, and Regular MLAs propose to support that growth with an additional $1.2 million investment in the Support for Entrepreneurs and Economic Development, or SEED, program. Anyone who has attempted to open a small business will appreciate our call to reduce the administrative complexity of establishing a new business.

Mr. Speaker, MLAs on this side also wanted $1 million invested in local access roads and $1.5 million for the Arctic Energy Alliance to expand its work to low-income families and communities outside Yellowknife. All of these investments respond to the priorities we set out in our mandate to increase energy efficiency and reduce the cost of living.

Mr. Speaker, we also wanted the government to roll back a little more than half of the proposed reductions, at a cost of about $15 million. The Finance Minister didn't detail the reductions in his Budget Address, but they are available in the Main Estimates, and the Main Estimates are online at the Department of Finance. There, you will see a $2.3 million cut in funding to schools and a $1.9 million cut to Aurora College, cuts to environmental monitoring, and cuts to funding for small business startups, and the list goes on. The biggest cut is to the government's workforce. A total of 65 positions will be eliminated by this budget, 45 of them in Yellowknife.

Mr. Speaker, the loss of these positions is a disaster for the city, coming as it does in addition to a year of grim announcements by the diamond mining companies. In November, Dominion Diamond Corporation announced it was moving its corporate headquarters to Calgary in order to save $19 million a year in operating costs. The company said the move would impact 100 staff. Outgoing CEO Brendan Bell is just one of many people who had to make a decision to stay or go. I know of several families who agonized over this choice, what it meant to their school-aged children, their extended family living in the North, and their employment prospects. While the GNWT didn't comment on this decision, I want to say it was a blow to Yellowknife Centre, where the office is located. The DDC staff is part of our community. They sing in the choir, they volunteer for non-profits, and they coach minor sports. They pay taxes, and Ottawa calculates territorial formula financing based on their presence here. The loss of these jobs, along with the closure of the De Beers corporate office in 2015 and layoffs at the mines, have taken as many as 500 jobs out of the NWT.

The last thing Yellowknife needs is more job losses, Mr. Speaker, yet budget 2017-18 delivers 45 more cuts to positions in Yellowknife. Not all of these jobs are currently filled, but the loss of these well-paid positions is bad news.

All of the fallout I just spoke about in connection with DDC is true for the community wherein government jobs are lost. Axing them represents a loss of taxpayers and reduces the level of territorial formula financing available to GNWT. I appreciate the programs sunset or otherwise need to be replaced, but cutting these positions rather than re-profiling them will increase out-migration and the financial consequences that go with it. Mr. Speaker, it's a sad fact that people who get laid off in Yellowknife tend to leave. They can't afford to live here without a job.

To summarize, we want an additional $10 million investment in our mandate, a sum equivalent to less than 1 per cent of total spending. We also want a rollback on $15 million of the proposed cuts, which again is less than 1 per cent. I repeat that this is a pretty small list of asks, but one Cabinet has been unwilling to work with Regular Members to achieve.

After months of discussion and negotiation, we are at an impasse, which I mentioned at the beginning. When we wanted changes to the mandate, we moved the necessary motions here in the House, and that's what we're prepared to do with this budget. Eliminating a 10-year deficit in four years is simply not a realistic goal. The cost of reaching it is going to do more harm than good for the people of my riding and beyond.

Mr. Speaker, I have some final thoughts about the budget cycle. It occupies a tremendous amount of time by departmental staff, the executive council, and Regular MLAs. This is time that could be spent on another of our roles that has been neglected in this Assembly: reviewing and improving legislation. As we heard from my colleague Mr. O'Reilly last week, the backlog in legislation required is years long. Not even a year into our mandate, the government told the City of Yellowknife that a number of minor amendments to legislation affecting municipalities will not be introduced during this Assembly. At the rate we've been going, this pace is the norm, not the exception.

Mr. Speaker, I recommend that Regular MLAs study alternatives to the way we now produce budgets, with input from stakeholders of all kind, including our colleagues on the other side of the House. If there is a way to free up time to make the budget process more efficient and to find more time to work on legislation, we should take it. Finally, Mr. Speaker, I want to go back to where I started. We don't have consensus on our fiscal position, and until we're able to change that, we're going to keep spinning our wheels on the scope of spending reductions we can all support. Mahsi, Mr. Speaker.

Masi. Replies to Budget Address, day 4 of 7. There appear to be no further replies to Budget Address for today, so we'll turn to item number 4, returns to oral questions. Item 5, recognition of visitors in the gallery. Member for Nunakput.

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, I'd like to welcome Mr. Richard Ross, who is my high school friend and one of the most supportive dads I know, and also coach and mentor for youth in the Mackenzie Delta. Thank you and welcome, Richard. Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

Masi. Recognition of visitors in the gallery. Member for Yellowknife North.

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, earlier Yellowknife North resident Ben Nind was here. Ben Nind is the executive director for the Giant Mine Oversight Board. He is certainly a well-respected community supporter and a big contributor to the creative arts community. Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

Masi. Recognition of visitors in the gallery. Member for Deh Cho.

Mahsi, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, I'd like to recognize two pages from Deh Gah School from Fort Providence. Nyssa Mackenzie and Shannan Bonnetrouge, along with their chaperone Trisha Landry will be here this week from February 6 to 9. I'd like to encourage my colleagues in joining me and welcoming them to the Legislative Assembly. Mahsi.

Masi. Recognition of visitors in the gallery. Item 6, acknowledgements. Item 7, oral questions. Member for Tu Nedhe-Wiilideh.

Marci, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, I have questions for the Minister of Health and Social Services on my Member's statement. When it comes to NWT's health performance, we publicly measure things like diabetes, immunization, school readiness, smoking, obesity, but we don't track poverty. My first question for the Minister is, pillar two of the action plan to reduce and eliminate poverty in NWT is healthy living and reaching our potential. Can the Minister expand on some of the department's achievements in this area during the 18th Assembly, and how these relate directly to poverty and poverty's health impact? Thank you.

Masi. Minister of Health and Social Services.

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, addressing poverty, as the Member is aware, certainly is the responsibility of all departments, all boards and agencies, as well as NGOs and individuals themselves. The Department of Health and Social Services can do things to help individuals combat poverty here in the Northwest Territories. There's a large list, but I'll just touch on a couple of the things that we're doing.

Throughout the Northwest Territories, we've been holding community health fairs to help people understand the types of things we all need to be doing, making healthy choices to support healthy living, which ultimately can support them in their fight against poverty.

There has also been a significant amount of federal dollars that have flowed through the Department of Health and Social Services to the individual communities throughout the Northwest Territories to support community wellness, and different activities that are being undertaken by the different communities themselves, community-driven, to help address issues in the communities. Often, poverty is on that list.

Mr. Speaker, in this budget, this government has made commitments through the Department of Health and Social Services to help combat things around poverty, such as putting in a sobering centre here in the Northwest Territories. It's not just the Department of Health and Social Services, as I've said. This government is committing $3 million this year and ongoing to support small business opportunities in communities. JK is fully funded and will be fully funded as of September. This is supporting poverty reduction in the Northwest Territories. We have $22 million, up $2 million this year, being available in income support to help address poverty in the Northwest Territories, but I do take the Member's point on impacts on health, and we take those very seriously. We do have a territorial action plan that we refer to on a regular basis and, as we're making decisions on programs, we think about the impacts they will have on our residents to help reduce things like poverty. Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

I hope the Minister hasn't answered all my questions with the first response.

---Laughter

Thank you. How does an understanding of poverty as a health determinant currently factor into the department's policies and planning?

The Member had a very comprehensive Member's statement today which I think addressed many of the issues that are being faced by residents across the Northwest Territories, and I appreciate the content of that statement.

Poverty, as I think the Member has clearly articulated, is a very complex issue with many contributing factors, and there is no single solution. I think that goes to MLA Green's comment about how I always respond to poverty questions. At its most fundamental level, Mr. Speaker, the department priorities and planning in the health and social services are grounded on a population health approach. A population health approach has as one of its fundamental considerations the fact that poverty is linked to health. So in our planning and design of programs and services, the consideration of poverty is built into the work that we are doing as a Department of Health and Social Services. It is also built into the work that Education, Culture and Employment is doing, as well as the Housing Corporation, so it is something that is being done by Health and Social Services and in cooperation with other departments in our government.

How can the department share poverty-related health information with other GNWT departments and other Ministers to improve the whole government's approach to eliminating poverty?

In the last government, the government, in cooperation with NGOs, Aboriginal governments, community governments, and other stakeholders, put together an anti-poverty framework. One of the things that has frustrated me about that important work, and it was important work and I appreciate all the work the stakeholders have put in, but it is something we hear time and time again. Number one, there is no evaluation criteria established for any of the work being done on addressing poverty in the Northwest Territories. Number two, there was no real agreed-upon definition of what poverty is.

These are things that came up at the last anti-poverty round table again. It's my belief, and we need to work together as an Assembly to figure out how to move forward on this, that we do need a definition of poverty in the Northwest Territories so that we have something that we can actually measure ourselves against. Also, we had discussions; we haven't established things that we need to evaluate that do need to be based on something, and a definition would go a long way to making that happen.

The bottom line is we aren't evaluating our programs against poverty, and I have no information to provide about success. I could tell you how many programs we have run. I could tell you from an education point of view how many people are on income support, but I cannot tell you the success rate in reducing poverty that our programs have. We have to continue to work with our stakeholders to identify and develop that criteria. Then we need to start tracking it so over the years we will be able to provide that information to tailor our programs to meet those outcomes.