Thank you. Member for Thebacha.

Thank you, Madam Chair. I just want to stress a couple things. The waiting list in the community of Thebacha is 212 on the waiting list. And I'm just wondering about a couple things with regards to -- first of all, I want to find out how many homes are going to be available new in the 2022-2023 Estimates?

Thank you. Minister responsible for NWT Housing Corporation.

Thank you, Madam Chair. And the Member is specifically speaking about her riding?

We are scheduled here for 2022-2023 for Fort Smith for two units. And in 2021-2022 -- 2021-2022, the CIRNAC -- oh, sorry, I'm getting these numbers mixed up, sorry.

Here I have 2022-2023 receiving two public housing units. This is under the CIRNAC, federal funding that we did receive. And also scheduled for this year's delivery for 2021-2022 are two units for Fort Smith. And for our co-investment delivery for Fort Smith, they'll be receiving four. And they should all be constructed by 2022-2023.

I could follow up with the Member and give those numbers because it sounds already confusing. Thank you, Madam Chair.

Thank you. Member for Thebacha.

You know, we're a regional centre. We're not -- I can consider Fort Smith still a small community. That is -- you know, the amount of homes that are going in there is not going to meet the requirement obviously.

I also want to talk about the homeownership program and the retrofits. I want to know how many retrofits are going in to the community of Thebacha.

Minister of NWT Housing Corporation.

Thank you, Madam Chair, and thank you to the Member for the question.

You know, when we had the 90-unit delivery that we are projecting this -- within the lifetime of this government, this is additional funding that we got from the federal government, and it's went on for constant advocacy with Canada to recognize that we have an aging -- we have aging infrastructure in the Northwest Territories. We're still trying to operate and maintain units that are over 40 years old, and Canada needs to recognize that and work with us.

And I was -- you know, I was fortunate and happy to be receiving the funding that we did -- that we were able to get allocated.

But also I just wanted to tell the Members that we tried strategically to making sure that each of these communities were at least to be receiving one unit out of the 90-unit delivery and recognizing we have 33 communities and looking at the stock that we have, there's some communities that don't even have a public housing unit, and making sure that they do have a delivery for this year. So I tried to distribute these units very fairly but recognizing 33 communities, 90 units.

I know it's not enough, but our continuous conversations with the federal government is not stopping. We do have the Council of Leaders working group where we raised this as well too where the Indigenous groups are able to take that conversation at their own levels and have their conversations with the federal government. And then also the territories having a housing working group with the appropriate federal ministers as well in raising this constant issue for the territory.

And in regards to the retrofits, the numbers, I don't have that. I just have the unit delivery. So I'll have vice-president Jim Martin to respond. Thank you, Madam Chair.

Thank you, Minister. Mr. Martin.

Thank you. Minister -- or Member for Thebacha.

Madam Chair, you know, the thresholds that are required for anyone wanting to have homeownership or any other thresholds within the housing department in the Housing Corporation, when is the last time they raised the thresholds? Like, has it been 20 years ago? Has it been two years ago? Has it been one year ago? Because a lot of, you know, young people that are wanting to go into homeownership, they both got jobs and then all of a sudden they're $120 over the threshold to buy the house that they were in when they first started out and didn't -- were in public housing. And now they could afford to go into homeownership but then they're told, oh, you're just over the threshold. Everything is based on threshold in this housing department that it's -- sometimes it's unacceptable, the answers, and nobody's thinking out of the box. They follow a little -- a little thing of policies, and they go through them and always disappoint everyone. And I'd like to know when was the last time that the thresholds throughout the whole department with homeownership, with waitings on list, with -- and how they do things. Thank you, Madam Chair.

Thank you, Member. Minister responsible for NWT Housing Corporation.

Thank you, Madam Chair. I just wanted to quickly comment before I hand this over for the appropriate date, that we've looked at the rent scale and we've looked at the thresholds as well too.

Right now, with our policy review, I -- you know, as Minister responsible, I want to make sure that I recognize hardship.

Hardship is something that -- that I considered when delivering this program. Are we keeping people at poverty level? Are we able to help them to excel and become homeowners and really looking at those barriers that are existing in the Northwest Territories.

But also I want to making sure -- I want to make sure that I'm working with the department to display fairness and consistency, that the Housing Corporation is here to support low income earners as well too and making sure that that funding is provided to the people that are most in need. And that is what our strategy is about, and making sure that we recognize that.

But also looking at the thresholds too, I recognized that a person making $120,000 living in Nunakput is not very much, you know, and really taking those considerations, that the cost of living as well, the fuel prices, and just basic living as well in those High Arctic communities but throughout the Northwest Territories. So I hear you when speaking like that as well too.

And also taking into consideration when we're looking at these thresholds, that I'm wanting to look at health challenges, the limited mobility, the cost of living. I want to -- making sure that we really bring that reality in to the policy changes that we are making, and we take those all into consideration when we're looking at program delivery. But I really want to stress fairness and consistency. The programs are available for the people that are most in need, critical need as well. Madam Chair, I'll have vice-president Jim Martin to respond. Thank you, Madam Chair.

Thank you. Mr. Martin.

Thank you. Member for Thebacha.

I just want to -- I'm going to ask the question again because I didn't really get a direct answer.

I would like to know the last time that the Housing Corporation has reviewed and renewed the threshold issue with regards to homeownership, rentals, all these things. And also -- because it's a major block for a lot of people that are just starting out in homeownership. It's a major block in the rental department. And it's a big concern to a lot of the people that I've talked to throughout the Northwest Territories. Thank you, Madam Chair.

Thank you. Minister of NWT Housing Corporation.

Thank you, Madam Chair. I'll have vice-president Jim Martin to respond at the last time that we looked at the threshold and we looked at the rental rates as well too, when the last time we reviewed. Thank you, Madam Chair.

Mr. Martin.

Thank you. Seeing there's no one left on my list for community housing services, we will move on to the executive, beginning on page 3 -- oh, Member for Tu Nedhe-Wiilideh, sorry.

Thank you. And first of all on housing, I just want to just briefly talk about housing.

I just want to mention that I'm also a carpenter by trade. I've worked all over the North, worked for some big companies, worked as an independent consultant, been to many meetings in the North in regards to the Dene Nation, Akaitcho, etcetera, and front and center is housing. And from the people I've been talking to up and down the Valley and also in our constituents, they say housing is broken, the policies don't work anymore for our people.

And so when I look at your plan here, and I really like looking at your -- the four-year plan that's been put together here by the MLA here last -- in 2019 and 2023, and housing's in there, and I like the way they're talking about moving towards working with Indigenous governments to look at building relationships. That's important.

We hear all the issues on housing but nothing seems to get done. They say policies are barriers. I have a constituent in my community of Lutselk'e whose bathtub is, right now it's filled up with sewer. And that person there was told that he can't get a program to fix that repair because he makes too much money. And then if he ever tried to sell that house or turn that house over to the daughter, then they don't make enough money to qualify for a program. So I'm concerned that when we say we're going to work together and start working with Indigenous governments, then we should really do something about it.

Right now, we're seeing that -- my constituent right now for public housing repairs -- or sorry, just to fix up your assets, the Housing Corporation assets, it's $3.4 million. But there's nothing there for repairs, homeownership repairs. Even if we had money, we still got to jump through hurdles to get that money. So if you want to work together, it seems like the Housing Corporation's applying for money through the same department in CIRNAC, and it's First Nations now, it seems like we're competing for money now for housing. We're not working together. We're not working with aboriginal governments.

You know, if want we can fix this problem we all got to work together. And the thing is that we talked about co-investment. How is that going to work if we come together trying to deal with some of these monies that you are applying for from Ottawa? My question is, is your policy going to continue to apply? Because right now, I got constituent members in Lutselk'e that are really dire hard in need of homeownership repairs. Not to mention the policies that are -- that created a lot of these problems in our community, we have a lot of vacant homes that are sitting idle in Fort Resolution. We may have about 20 maybe homes there, that are sitting idle. Same thing in Lutselk'e, N'dilo, and Dettah.

So going forward, I mean I don't have any issues with the staff or anything like that. I just want to make a point here is that this issue is not going to go away. We all need to work together to fix this problem. I applaud my colleague here, asking that we need $20 million for housing. That's not enough. We need more money for fixing these houses to meet it, the demands in our communities. But going forward, right now the communities are saying, oh, we don't like to work with the Housing Corporation because their policies don't work for us. Now we're going to work with Ottawa and try to get our own money.

So to me, when you listen, that's what they're saying. So we got to fix that relationship with Indigenous governments going forward and work together. No longer creating policies that only suit one side. If anything, we should be -- the monies that we get going forward, whether it be the National Housing Strategy or co-investment or anything like that, maybe it's time that we start working -- Indigenous government and do a contribution agreement. So that way here, the communities have the ability to do the work. But most importantly, what I see in here is that we want to create jobs. People are looking for work. So Madam Chairman, I just want just mention that because housing is important, and we got to fix it. Mahsi.