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Bill 60, An Act to Amend the Petroleum Products and Carbon Tax Act

Government Bill

19th Assembly, 2nd Session

Introduced on Oct. 31, 2022

Events

Timeline of key legislative events

  • First Reading
    Completed Oct. 31, 2022 (Debate | Vote)
  • Second Reading
    Completed Nov. 1, 2022 (Debate | Vote)
  • Third Reading
    Completed March 29, 2023 (Debate | Vote)
  • Commissioner's Assent
    Completed March 30, 2023 (Debate)
  • Status

    Bill Text



    Related Votes

    March 29, 2023 Passed Third Reading of Bill 60: An Act to Amend the Petroleum Products and Carbon Tax Act, Carried
    Nov. 1, 2022 Passed Second Reading of Bill 60: An Act to Amend the Petroleum Products and Carbon Tax Act, Carried
    Oct. 31, 2022 Passed First Reading of Bill 60: An Act to Amend the Petroleum Products and Carbon Tax Act

    Discussion & Mentions

    Assent To Bills
    Assent To Bills

    March 30th, 2023

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    The Commissioner Of The Northwest Territories Margaret M. Thom

    Mahsi. Good afternoon Mr. Speaker, Premier Cochrane, Ministers, Members of the Legislative Assembly, staff and visitors in the public gallery.

    It is always a good feeling and honour to be here and see all of you. Thank you for your ongoing commitment and hard work on behalf of the people of the Northwest Territories. It is with great honour and respect that I acknowledge the territory of the Dene, Metis and Inuit of this great land. We are extremely grateful to live, work, celebrate, and be welcomed as visitors in your territory.

    After the long and cold winter, it is nearly time to say, Spring is in the air. So enjoy the well-deserved, much-needed Easter break to enjoy the beautiful spring weather, longer daylight hours, the single digit temperatures in some places, and the sunshine. This break will allow you to breathe in the good fresh air to ground you. I wish you all safe, enjoyable travels to your homes, your loved ones, your constituencies. Happy and Blessed Easter season with your loved ones.

    Now as Commissioner of the Northwest Territories, I am pleased to assent to the following bills:

    • Bill 56, An Act to Amend the Northwest Territories Housing Corporation Act
    • Bill 57, Miscellaneous Statute Law Amendment Act, 2022
    • Bill 60, An Act to Amend the Petroleum Products and Carbon Tax Act
    • Bill 61, An Act to Amend the Ombud Act
    • Bill 62, An Act to Amend the Income Tax Act, No. 2
    • Bill 63, An Act to Amend Official Languages Act
    • Bill 66, An Act to Amend the Property Assessment and Taxation Act
    • Bill 67, An Act to Amend the Fire Prevention Act
    • Bill 68, An Act to Amend the Child Day Care Act
    • Bill 73, An Act to Amend the Legislative Assembly and Executive Council Act, No. 4
    • Bill 76, An Act to Amend the Electoral Boundaries Commission Act
    • Bill 86, Supplementary Appropriation Act (Infrastructure Expenditures), No. 3, 2022-2023
    • Bill 87, Supplementary Appropriation Act (Operations Expenditures), No. 3, 2023- 2023
    • Bill 88, Supplementary Appropriation Act (Infrastructure Expenditures), No. 1, 2023-2024
    • Bill 89, Appropriation Act (Operations Expenditures), 2023-2024

    Mahsi cho. Thank you. Quyananni. Merci beaucoup. Koana.

    ---SHORT RECESS

    Recorded Vote
    Third Reading Of Bills

    March 29th, 2023

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    The Speaker

    The Speaker Frederick Blake Jr.

    All those abstaining, please rise.

    The result of the recorded vote: Nine in favour, eight opposed, zero abstentions. The motion is carried. Bill 60 has had third reading.

    ---Carried

    Third reading of bills. Minister responsible for MACA.

    Recorded Vote
    Third Reading Of Bills

    March 29th, 2023

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    Clerk Of The House Mr. Glen Rutland

    The Member for Inuvik Twin Lakes. The Member for Deh Cho. The Member for Thebacha. The Member for Kam Lake. The Member for Nunakput. The Member for Tu Nedhe-Wiilideh. The Member for Monfwi. The Member for Great Slave.

    Recorded Vote
    Third Reading Of Bills

    March 29th, 2023

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    The Speaker

    The Speaker Frederick Blake Jr.

    All those opposed, please rise.

    Recorded Vote
    Third Reading Of Bills

    March 29th, 2023

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    Clerk Of The House Mr. Glen Rutland

    The Member for Yellowknife South. The Member for Sahtu. The Member for Range Lake. The Member for Inuvik Boot Lake. The Member for Yellowknife Centre. The Member for Hay River North. The Member for Hay River South. The Member for Yellowknife North. The Member for Nahendeh.

    Bill 60: An Act to Amend the Petroleum Products and Carbon Tax Act, Carried
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    March 29th, 2023

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    The Speaker

    The Speaker Frederick Blake Jr.

    Question has been called. The Minister has requested a recorded vote. All those in favour, please rise.

    Bill 60: An Act to Amend the Petroleum Products and Carbon Tax Act, Carried
    Third Reading Of Bills

    March 29th, 2023

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    Some Hon. Members

    Question.

    Bill 60: An Act to Amend the Petroleum Products and Carbon Tax Act, Carried
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    The Speaker

    The Speaker Frederick Blake Jr.

    The motion is in order. To the motion.

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    Caroline Wawzonek

    Caroline Wawzonek Yellowknife South

    Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, the carbon tax fails to recognize that the Northwest Territories residents, the majority of whom are Indigenous, do not have access to alternative heating fuels, have no ability to lower their heating costs. Some of our communities are literally falling into the Arctic Ocean and others are being washed away by unprecedented flooding. All are facing the increased financial burden of adapting to and mitigating the risks of a warming climate. But none of our communities contribute meaningfully to Canada's greenhouse gas emissions, and none are responsible for the history of greenhouse gases released during Canada's industrial development when northern Indigenous people were still living traditional lifestyles.

    Despite this, the residents living in remote communities, like Sachs Harbour or Paulatuk, pay over $8,000 to heat -- a year to heat their homes before application of the carbon tax. Furthermore, there is no opportunity to switch to clean electricity for heat since most Northwest Territories communities the have no choice but to rely on diesel-generated electricity supply at their local community. The current approach poses a system that puts remote communities, whose residents are primarily or entirely Indigenous, even further behind the rest of Canada at a time when geopolitics and reconciliation suggest we should be making every effort to support them. It ignores the history that led to the disadvantages they experience and ignores their current lived realities.

    Mr. Speaker, I've quoted some of that letter before. It was a letter that I wrote to the federal minister after the public hearing that committee convened. I thank committee for their hearing. It was in hearing them that emboldened me to write that letter. It wasn't the first letter I wrote. I wrote several letters. We spoke. I spoke. Other Ministers spoke. Other jurisdictions spoke. I'm not reading the entire letter. I have shared the entire letter, not because I was asked; I shared all of those letters at my own decision to do so because I needed to try to show that we have raised the voice of the North. We have tried to show the realities of the North. And I'm certainly not in favour of the carbon tax, of the federal carbon tax and the way that it applies to the North. But, Mr. Speaker, just as my colleagues -- and I appreciate that today's tone is certainly trying to demonstrate -- we have worked together. I do hope the public realizes we have met. I have tried to -- with the timing the way it's been to make some concessions. And I think it's made the carbon tax -- or Bill 60 much better. But at the end of the day, the idea of what is best for the Northwest Territories is also something that Cabinet and myself are also faced with a decision upon, that we too have to navigate the government waters and navigate our relationship with the federal government in the best interests of the Northwest Territories.

    So having wrote that letter, having signed that letter, and others like it, having raised the issue at the finance table, at the finance FBT table under similar tones, pointing to the fact that federal ministers attended international conferences, acknowledged that other countries, other countries -- developing nations should, in fact, see some sort of benefit. The developing countries are not the reason that the rest of the world is now facing a climate crisis. They were -- they're underdeveloped. And now we're telling them that rather than developing, they have to pay carbon taxes and carbon burdens. We as a westernized country, we're acknowledging that. And yet in our own country, we're not acknowledging that reality. We're not acknowledging that in our very own country, that in the North we didn't benefit from industrialization. We are facing all of these challenges and yet we have to pay. I've said all those things, Mr. Speaker. I want my colleague and I want the public to know that I have said them, and my colleagues have said them, and we've raised the issue. It's not for lack of raising it.

    So when I keep saying that I want to hang on to the responsibility and the authority to collect and control revenues under the carbon tax, it's because despite saying all these things, despite raising all these issues, I am not getting responses. We are not getting responses. We are not seeing a flush of alternatives coming to the North. And so I want to do what I can to hang on to as much revenue as I can to be able to recycle it in a way that keeps it in the North and that keeps control of it in the North, whether it's me or another Minister. I can't promise what's going to happen in the future. I don't -- as far as consistency or certainty, Mr. Speaker, the moratorium wasn't supposed to be reviewed the way it was, or rather not. Mr. Speaker, in 2016, the carbon tax was supposed to be collaborative, it was not. So I don't have a lot of faith in what that process from the federal government might look for. The best that I have extracted most recently is an understanding that federal government, federal government departments should meet, should in fact meet with communities in the North. I will, for the remaining time that I have here, certainly make sure that I follow up on that offer that I've had from them that we do everything we can to get those federal Ministers to the North so they can, in fact, see the lack of alternatives we have, and if there is federal money, that it starts to come here so we can get off fossil fuels. We need to do that for climate change reasons, and we need to do that for the cost reasons, and to do it because it's the right thing to do. And I will certainly continue to pursue that.

    But in the meantime, in the meantime, Mr. Speaker, I don't want to hand over control of this money to the federal government. I do think this is the best possible option. It is where I'm left. And I am sorry for the process that we faced as, again I said, I am accountable for the process on this one. We shouldn't have come to the point where people are feeling compelled to vote against carbon tax by voting for Bill 60. It shouldn't have come to this. I hear where people's frustration is, and I know they want to represent their constituents. I do understand that.

    So all I'll say, to conclude, Mr. Speaker, one last time, I'm going to give the pitch of what it is that we are saying is the benefits and the not. I also -- I'm going to start with the large emitters program because this does seem to be fairly -- not, I don't know if "misunderstood" is the right word. I'm going to take that back, Mr. Speaker.

    There's a lot of reporting that's done with the carbon tax. Let me start with that one. I realize there was a request for further and more reporting in the committee's report. There's already a fairly detailed report that goes out every year. It's on the website. It details all the different types of fuel, how much by volume, how much by cost, how much -- which different entities residents, small businesses, government, large emitters, who pays what, who uses what volume. Part of my struggle is not understanding what more needs to be reported upon but we've made a lot of changes to reporting in this government, and if there's more that somebody wants us to do that we can do within the boundaries here, I'm happy do it. I can't promise that the reduction and use of fuel is because of the carbon tax, because there's a lot of other reasons that someone may not want to use fossil fuels. But if we can make some changes to this report, Mr. Speaker, I'm happy to do that.

    Mr. Speaker, the large emitters, in 2021-2022, they paid $19.7 million, three months. Mr. Speaker, residents, small businesses, and governments collectively paid only $16.9 million. The large emitters are the ones paying the most, and they will continue to pay the most under the large emitters program. Keeping our program doesn't give them a discount. It actually keeps them paying, and it keeps them paying in line with being roughly 50 percent users as compared to everybody else, paying a little bit more.

    The OBPS system, the federal backstop system will have some sort of nationalized standard, which may or may not just be our three mines, it may be other mines lumped in, and to the extent that they're over, they pay, and to the extent that they're under, they don't. So I don't think they'll be paying as much under the federal backstop. We'll see how that unfolds.

    But besides that, Mr. Speaker, I am worried for the future of our mineral resource industry. I'm worried for future smaller mines that won't qualify under the federal system and those smaller mines I want -- I want the North to be the critical minerals/metals supplier of the future. But it's going to be making it very difficult if we aren't competitive in that space.

    Mr. Speaker, there's two big parts for residents that committee has had a very direct hand in improving. The cost of living offset. The cost of living offset right now is now a tiered system such that the average resident in every community, including the high cost communities, will see that they will not be seeing an increased cost as a result of carbon taxes and that is thanks to committee and to their feedback for having us find a better solution. Similarly, Mr. Speaker, the community revenue sharing approach, again, put to us to find a solution, a solution was proposed and then in fact told no, you've got to go make that even better. And we did. 10 percent of net revenues, again, based on the current usage that we have and being able to evaluate the current use of fuels more than compensates the impacts of the carbon tax. But, Mr. Speaker, that's not necessarily the point as I think that was made a point of yesterday. Mr. Speaker, it's frankly just the right thing to do to help support communities to get off fossil fuels. At the end of the day, that is the point.

    So, Mr. Speaker -- and, Mr. Speaker, one last -- one last one in addition to, again, saying that the reporting can still be looked at, with respect to getting some of this into legislation and regulations, as already has been said, part of it is the scope of the bill as drafted, which was drafted after our public meeting in the fall. But, Mr. Speaker, I did, in hearing colleagues still yesterday, speak one more time with the department. It is possible to draft a bill that would be very narrow in scope, so certainly not addressing everyone's issues in their entirety, but at least to get the purpose of having the cost of living offset and having the community revenue sharing portion put into a form of legislation or regulation. There is pathway by which we could do that, with committee's collaboration, and certainly if this were to pass tonight, I will go back to committee and ask if that is still in fact their wish. It will be narrow, it won't answer everything, but it will at least enshrine that portion that they fought so hard for into legislation.

    Mr. Speaker -- and then besides that, again, I'll be following up with the federal government. I know my colleagues do as well. It won't just be me. I do hope that our federal government colleagues attend here, that they can be -- stand in the small communities and offer us -- offer a pathway by which to find alternative energies and alternatives to fossil fuels. We don't want to be on fossil fuels. It's not helping the climate. It is expensive. It is not the way of the future. But we're going to need help to get there. And no matter what may happen tonight, Mr. Speaker, that really fundamentally is what we're going to have to do.

    For now, Mr. Speaker, I do hope, again, I know people have made their positions write clear and quite firm. Nevertheless, I do hope that what we do going forward gives us control in a measure by which we can help support residents, businesses, and small communities in the Northwest Territories. Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

    Bill 60: An Act to Amend the Petroleum Products and Carbon Tax Act, Carried
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    The Speaker

    The Speaker Frederick Blake Jr.

    Thank you, Member for Inuvik Twin Lakes. The motion is in order. To the motion. Minister responsible for Finance.

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    Lesa Semmler

    Lesa Semmler Inuvik Twin Lakes

    Mr. Speaker, yesterday I listened to all my colleagues speak. I was chair of Committee of the Whole; I wasn't able to speak so now I get to speak. I get to say my opinion. I tried to keep my cards close during the time because I wanted to, you know, make sure that debate went on and I'm not -- I'm sitting in the chair. So now it's time for me to actually vote, and I have to say it. But I'm going to give -- I'm not going to really repeat everything everybody says because, you know, with my colleagues on this side of the House, whether they're for it or against it, I agree with you. But, you know, I have to listen to my constituents as Member for Thebacha says. And the only constituents that I heard from are against taxes. And we as a government, we know that we're going to have a tax whether I say yes or no. So at this point, you know, I think my mind -- the way that I look at things is that -- sorry, my notes, my everything has been scattered all over. I've been doing this for, like, bouncing back and forth because, you know, I -- so, you know, with all the things that the Minister has done with us, you know, I applaud that she's been trying hard to make sure that this bill could meet the needs of the North. I even look at what the seniors has brought to it, and I look at our Minister of education and all the things that he's done in income support, and even identifying the area that we need to support our seniors. Home heating subsidy, we've increased. We've done all these things for our seniors to try, you know, and I don't know if that was for Cabinet to try and -- you know, implement this -- to make a little bit more of a cushion. But what I do know is that the things that we asked for in our report, we didn't get. We got the things that we talked about prior to and then knowing that this government didn't even take the recommendations from the 18th Assembly and consider them, or did they? Maybe they did, but they didn't even try to do any of those before putting this bill forward. And I want to give it to my colleague, who is not here who is I'm sure wishing he could vote tonight, that he raised this. He raised this and maybe in his way of his own red alert, he raised this in the fall and, you know, us as Members, we're drinking from a fire hose and, you know, we had a lot of catchup to do after COVID, and I'm sure the Ministers as well. And we had so much legislation and so many things that we were reviewing that trying to prioritize what are we -- what are we reading, where are we at, you know. Why didn't we push harder to have this legislation taken off the table, fixed, and then brought back to us. Now we're in the 11th hour and we don't even have time for new legislation to come through.

    You know, I talked to my colleagues about who do I trust? Who do I trust? Do I trust the Government of the Northwest Territories? Do I trust the federal government? Right now, you know, there's so many things that we've asked for and we've not gotten. We've asked for different types of things from these Ministers we haven't got. And so do I go with -- as somebody had told me yesterday, if they say that I still have hope. As a new Member, of course I have hope. I'm here because I have hope that this government will listen to me. But time and time again that hope has been stepped on. So, you know, after everything that I've got to contemplate, I have to stand with majority of my colleagues as you guys do together, and I will not support this bill. Thank you.

    Bill 60: An Act to Amend the Petroleum Products and Carbon Tax Act, Carried
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    The Speaker

    The Speaker Frederick Blake Jr.

    Thank you, Member for Hay River South. The motion is in order. To the motion. Member for Inuvik Twin Lakes.

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    Rocky Simpson

    Rocky Simpson Hay River South

    Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, I oppose the carbon tax. Unfortunately this vote is not about removing the carbon tax. The carbon tax is here. It's -- you know, it's a federal initiative. It's being -- you know, it's been taken to the Supreme Court, and the Supreme Court upheld its legitimacy. This vote is basically on who will collect and administer a tax that is being pushed on not just us but all Canadians. And what are we gaining, I guess, by using the federal backstop? Nobody here can tell me, nobody on this side and, really, nobody on that side. And even the federal government. You know, when I talk to people, you know, in Ottawa, they don't have any idea really. I don't think they -- I think they think that we're going to continue to administer it and more likely we are. So, you know, we talk about, you know, you're throwing it back it to the federal government and not doing their dirty work. You know, and maybe that's -- maybe that's the way to go, you know, especially when we see that, you know, we have a federal minister coming in supposedly this week that doesn't have time to meet with Regular MLAs, yet on the other side I can meet with these people any time I want, you know, in trying to work with them. So, you know, really, at the end of the day, from the beginning, I looked at what the scenarios are and, you know -- like, my colleague here from Thebacha, I made my choice at that point, and I'm not about to waiver from it either. And because of, you know, the statement I made the other day, or yesterday about how I'd vote, I'll stick with that and I'll vote in favour of the bill. Thank you.

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    The Speaker

    The Speaker Frederick Blake Jr.

    Thank you, Member for Thebacha. The motion is in order. To the motion. Member for Hay River South.

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    Frieda Martselos

    Frieda Martselos Thebacha

    Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, ever since this bill was introduced, this Bill 60, I have been opposed to it and I continue to be opposed to it. I think as elected Members, we are elected by the people that we represent within the communities, ordinary people, people who will never be able to go through the door, okay. We speak for those people, for the middle class, for the poor, for the seniors societies, you know, for the senior population, for small business, for the Indigenous groups, and for everyone. And I just cannot vote for Bill 60. I think that we have an obligation to the people of the NWT to do the right thing, and the right thing is to not support Bill 60. It's going to come back and haunt us if we do. And, you know, I can't understand how, you know, we elect -- we elect Cabinet, you know, and I have a lot of faith in a lot of Members across the room here. You know, we elect them and yet they don't vote for whatever they don't want to vote on; they all stay together and there's no -- you know, there's not an open -- you know, you have to start -- I know there's a lot of compassionate people on the other side and it must be very difficult sometimes for people to not understand that we are in this, at the 11th hour at this stage. It's just -- it's not acceptable. And for that reason, I don't waiver. When I say I'm going to do something, and the people of the Northwest Territories and all these groups that submitted submissions with regards to Bill 60, those groups represent a lot of people. And nobody wants Bill 60 the way it is right now. So I'm sticking to my guns and I support -- I do not support Bill 60. Thank you, Mr. Speaker.