This is page numbers 281 - 314 of the Hansard for the 13th Assembly, 4th Session. The original version can be accessed on the Legislative Assembly's website or by contacting the Legislative Assembly Library. The word of the day was chairman.

Topics

Written Question 7-13(4): Over Budgeted Capital Projects
Item 7: Written Questions

Page 300

The Speaker Samuel Gargan

Thank you. Written questions. Mr. Erasmus.

Written Question 8-13(4): Housing Corporation Revenues And Expenditures
Item 7: Written Questions

Page 300

Roy Erasmus Yellowknife North

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. These questions are directed to the Minster responsible for the NWT Housing Corporation, the Honourable Goo Arlooktoo. First, how much money did the NWT Housing Corporation spend on capital in 1996-97? Second, how much money did the NWT Housing Corporation receive from the federal government for the remote housing initiative 1996-97? Third, how much money will the NWT Housing Corporation have to give back to CMHC as a result of not proceeding with the rent scale increases that were slated for this spring? Fourth, will the current rebate program remain in place in 1997-98 considering the one year delay in implementing the rent scale increases? Fifth, how much money has this government lost over the last three years as a result of the delay in implementation of the new rent scale? Thank you.

Written Question 8-13(4): Housing Corporation Revenues And Expenditures
Item 7: Written Questions

Page 300

The Speaker Samuel Gargan

Written questions. Item 8, returns to written questions. Item 9. replies to opening address. Item 10, replies to budget address. Mr. Roland.

Replies To Budget Address 3-13(4)
Item 10: Replies To Budget Address

January 29th, 1997

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Floyd Roland

Floyd Roland Inuvik

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, honourable colleagues, this is the second budget of the 13th Assembly. The first one we had no pressures from the

previous round of budget implications. Many of us were new to this level of government. I believe that we were aware of the road that lies ahead. I remember being told by the people in my community of Inuvik that they did not envy the position that we were in. I also heard that this was not a good time to be in government. But for better or worse we spin ahead down the path of budget reductions and we have now travelled this road of reductions for a year. We have heard the concerns from the people and the organizations as they have tried and continue to try and deal with the reductions that have been delivered to them by this 13th Assembly.

And it is with these concerns we enter into a second year of reductions with the message of the pain being felt back in our home communities. As we took part in the business plans trying to address their concerns and fears, and unlike other assemblies, as Ordinary Members we have had the opportunity to try to influence the direction of this government with those concerns and fears from our communities.

Mr. Speaker, we have heard around this table, this House, comments like those made by Mr. Seamus Henry, where he states, I quote from the unedited Hansard on Wednesday, January 29th, in reference to the City of Yellowknife..."the city has taken a blow and is limping a bit, and we are down but certainly not out". Mr. Speaker, I would like to state that Inuvik has taken a large amount of reductions. And we have no new projects on the horizon that will help us rebound from the reductions. Mr. Speaker, there are communities that will receive a positive benefit from having large scale productions on their horizon. Unfortunately, Mr. Speaker, I feel that Inuvik is somewhat out on a limb here to be able to access some of the positive influences there. I hope that we will though, to some degree.

Mr. Speaker it can be said that Inuvik cannot even limp. Instead, we need a prosthesis from the government, possibly from the knee down. Maybe, Mr. Speaker, the government could provide my community with a cart so we could at least get to the street and beg from those who have.

Mr Speaker, my community and the region have felt that for years. Mr. Speaker, I have concern with the message this government sends out. I relate this to raising children because I have four of my own, Mr. Speaker. I think that they learn more by watching than what they do, by what I say to them. Mr. Speaker, I say this because the people have heard what this Legislature has said, and watched what we have done. And although we have tried to deal with our community issues and concerns in committees we still find there are negative impacts being felt in our communities. It is these negative impacts that we seem to focus on.

Mr. Speaker, for over a year now I have listened in committee, Caucus and in this Assembly about what we are trying to do as a government with the task that lie before us of balancing a budget with the forced growth issues that lie before us, a population that is the fastest growing in Canada. With the problems we have socially with alcoholism and drug abuse. With the low levels of education amongst the native people.

Mr. Speaker, it is not easy to see people that you know in your community go unemployed. It is not easy to sit in a meeting and be there as the Board of Delta House is told that their funding will be cut. I know there are times when I would rather not be part of it at all, but I got into this because I was concerned just exactly how those reductions would happen.

I got involved because of my children and my concern for their education and health, and them having the ability to take part in a healthy environment. I wanted to make sure that the community of Inuvik, at the end of the day when reductions were done would still be a viable community to live in, that would have an education system that will allow them to go wherever and be equal to those who have been educated in other places. I want them to have the ability when they become ill, to be able to get access to health care without having to wait long periods of time for medication or treatment.

I said in an interview not long ago that I do not have to defend what this government has put forward as reductions. I do not believe that it is my job to defend the decisions that are made. Although I have had an opportunity to address the concerns of my constituents in Inuvik, there are still times when I have to mention about it a second time, a third time. I know things are not easy to change in the government system. I have been made aware of that in my slightly over a year of being elected here in the 13th Assembly.

I know the people of Inuvik are healthy. We are able to deal with the problems that come our way. We have done so for some time. We have managed to work our way out of when the oil companies started to leave the Delta. We lost a lot of jobs then. We dealt with the issue of the armed forces leaving the community of Inuvik. We have managed to seem to go through that and I am sure, Mr. Speaker that the community of Inuvik will rise above all the controversies that are happening and deal with the reductions being felt, when it comes to budget reductions being brought forward by this government I feel that we can do this, but a lot of people and folks in Inuvik are very concerned about what lies ahead. The government a few years ago started selling staff housing. Offered it to employees and other people of the community. And the people took them up and bought those houses. A few years later, a number of those people now have pink slips. The community of Inuvik, the taxed based municipality, the town council is now finding difficulty in collecting some of the taxes because people do not have jobs to pay the taxes.

I think, Mr. Speaker, we need to start, as a government, focusing on what can be done and instead of what cannot be done. I need to be able to go back to my community some time soon and tell them there is some light at the end of this tunnel. That there is some opportunity there that we can grasp on to. To try and deal with some of the reductions that have come through our community.

Mr. Speaker, I have been down and spent a lot of my time in Yellowknife since being elected and I have seen, as has been commented before, the growth that is happening around the City of Yellowknife, especially when it is mentioned as the third fastest growing city. I see that when I walk around Yellowknife or go to a restaurant to eat a meal. My Speaker, in my community of Inuvik, when you go down to a restaurant you do not find it full of people. You do not have to make reservations. Some restaurants have had to lay off their staff and run it as just an owner, to keep the doors open. I am sure a lot of those business people do not like going to the government for hand outs, to try and stay open but they are finding they have to do that.

So I would say and urge this government to start focusing on what can be done. How can we help the people in the communities hardest hit by the reductions in the budget? I say this because I feel Inuvik for two years has taken a large amount of reductions. I am being reminded by community members, by the council, and I think I have the support of people in Inuvik when I say that Inuvik wants to be treated fairly and does not support the idea of more reductions continuing on. They accept the fact that reductions are coming. The concern is, are they fair and just?

Inuvik has never really had to rely heavily on government, but we are finding, over the years, we have had to turn more and more to government and the community is not all that good at going out with its hands open and saying, can you give me?

We have been disappointed by a number of things that past governments have done and were disappointed, no doubt, by some of the decisions made by this government. When I go back home to my community and I talk to the people, if they address their concerns, some of them I say, well, where do we get the funds from? We have to deal with the budget, we have to be able to make sure that our future generations have an opportunity to be successful, instead of paying a big debt.

I have compared coming to Yellowknife and going to committee and on the political level we seem to have an understanding of where we need to go and how to do it. I have compared that to a river that flows down, and on a nice day, as the sun shines, the top is clear, calm, and you get a nice reflection and you feel comforted. You have this peaceful feeling. Like I say, at times I feel comforted that we all seem to politically agree on the same thing. But when you get past the surface, Mr. Speaker, underneath there is a lot of water before you get to the bottom of the river.

I have compared the dropping of a stone in a river. Not always when you drop that stone, does it land straight down from where you dropped it. It sometimes lands further down river, and I compare that to some of the decisions we have made, we have agreed on some initiatives, and in principle we have agreed to some of the necessary areas of reduction. I found at times, when I get to my community, that what I thought I agreed to and what happened seemed to be almost two separate things. I know, and I have heard it before stated to me, that although we seem to be changing the way things happen, there is still a lot in the system that does not want to change. I would say that we need to continue to work and we need to apply pressure where it is needed.

If there are some dams there that slow the process down, we must take those out. If there is a river flowing too fast that we need to slow down, maybe we need to put up a barrier. I am glad to see that this government has changed its mind over the last year on a number of initiatives that has given the people in my community a chance to breath a little, to look at the long-term impacts of some of the decisions that we have made.

Mr. Speaker, I believe that, as I came in here a year ago and looked at the first budget of the 13th Assembly, I agreed with many around the table then that we need to deal with our budget issues. We need to balance the budget. That is only proper, and I think we are halfway there. If we can come through this year and do it in a more compassionate and caring way, that the people of the territories agree that this needed to be done, then we will have succeeded if our goals are achieved. I can go back to my community at the end of the day and say, now we can start dealing with what needs to be dealt with. We can look at jobs, we can look at employment. We need to start focusing on that.

Because, Mr. Speaker, when people are unemployed and cannot find work, there is a lot of time they sit around and dwell on what could be or what would have been, and I think it is those times that cause a lot of people to turn towards other things that could be self destructive in a lot of ways. If people are busy at work, they are happier people. I think that is what we need to start doing as a government, is to focus on what can be done, not what cannot be done. I would hope that this government would start looking at the initiatives, and I would hope that this government would look at the initiatives in terms of the communities that have taken the brunt of these reductions.

I think the people of Inuvik realize that, as a regional centre we would take more of the hits. We are bigger. We cannot take health care workers out of our health station that have only two employees. We have done that in our community. I think the boards have made wise decisions in a lot of areas and some I will question, but we all cannot be right all of the time. I will give that benefit of the doubt as well to the Finance Minister. He is not always right, although we have heard around the table and some jokes go around about, what is the difference between Todd and God. I know the difference and I think many of us do. He is a man like many folks. He is human and he is given direction by humans, so he is bound to make mistakes, but I hope that is when we, as an Assembly, get together to pick him up and point him in the right direction.

-- Laughter

Replies To Budget Address 3-13(4)
Item 10: Replies To Budget Address

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Floyd Roland

Floyd Roland Inuvik

Sometimes I feel like grabbing him by the ankles and then shaking him for the money.

Replies To Budget Address 3-13(4)
Item 10: Replies To Budget Address

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An Hon. Member

We all do.

Replies To Budget Address 3-13(4)
Item 10: Replies To Budget Address

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Floyd Roland

Floyd Roland Inuvik

Mr. Speaker, I would hope that, at the end of this day I could steer him in the direction of Inuvik. That if he could find any money, he would come to visit us and show the people that there is light at the end of the tunnel. Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

-- Applause

Replies To Budget Address 3-13(4)
Item 10: Replies To Budget Address

Page 302

The Speaker Samuel Gargan

Thank you, Mr. Roland. Replies to budget address. Item 11, petitions. Item 12, reports of standing and special committees. Item 13, reports of committees on the review of bills. Item 14, tabling of documents, Mr. Barnabas.

Item 14: Tabling Of Documents
Item 14: Tabling Of Documents

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Levi Barnabas High Arctic

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. I would like to table a document, a letter from Mr. Berry Tibbitt, educator of Arctic Bay. It is regarding the lay off of regional librarians, Tabled Document 27-13(4). I was shocked to learn today of the lay off of the regional librarian for the Baffin, Kitikmeot, and Keewatin regions including Yvonne Earle in Iqaluit. I have known and worked with Ms. Earle for the past eight years.

Item 14: Tabling Of Documents
Item 14: Tabling Of Documents

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The Speaker Samuel Gargan

Thank you, Mr. Barnabas. I think all you need to do is make reference to what the tabling of document is about, and it is about the regional librarian. You have said that already. Thank you. Tabling of documents. Item 15, notices of motion. Mr. Ningark.

Motion 9-13(4): Referral Of Td 20-13(4) To Committee Of The Whole
Item 15: Notices Of Motion

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John Ningark Natilikmiot

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, I give notice that on Monday, February 3, 1997, I will move the following motion. I move, seconded by the honourable Member for Thebacha, that Tabled Document 20-3(4) entitled Report of the Joint Working Group on the Business Incentive Policy be moved into committee of the whole for discussion. Thank you.

Motion 9-13(4): Referral Of Td 20-13(4) To Committee Of The Whole
Item 15: Notices Of Motion

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The Speaker Samuel Gargan

Thank you. Notices of motion. Item 16, notices of motion for first reading of bills. Item 17, motions. Item 18, first reading of bills. Item 19, second reading of bills. Item 20, consideration in committee of the whole of bills and other matters. Bill 8, Committee Report 2-13(4), Committee Report 3-13(4) with Mr. Steen in the chair.

Item 20: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters
Item 20: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters

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The Chair

The Chair Vince Steen

Thank you. I would like to call the committee to order. Item 20, consideration in committee of the whole of bills and other matters. We have a number of items here. Bill 8, Appropriation Act, 1997-98; Committee Report 2-13(4), Standing Committee on Government Operations Report on the 1997-98 Main Estimates; Committee Report 3-13(4), Standing Committee on Infrastructure Report on the 1997-98 Main Estimates. What is the wish of the committee? Mr. Ootes.

Item 20: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters
Item 20: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters

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Jake Ootes

Jake Ootes Yellowknife Centre

Mr. Chairman, I would recommend that we consider Bill 8 and Committee Reports 2-13(4) and 3-13(4) concurrently. Thank you.

Item 20: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters
Item 20: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters

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The Chair

The Chair Vince Steen

Do we agree that we will deal with Bill 8, Committee Reports 2-13(4) and 3-13(4) after the break? Thank you.

-- Break

Item 20: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters
Item 20: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters

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The Chair

The Chair Vince Steen

Mr. Ootes.

Item 20: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters
Item 20: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters

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Jake Ootes

Jake Ootes Yellowknife Centre

Mr. Chairman, I am seeking clarification on the matter regarding general comments and questions. Can we get that clarified? Are we allowed to ask questions during the period of general comments, or will there be general comments and then questions, and then line-by-line?

Item 20: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters
Item 20: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters

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The Chair

The Chair Vince Steen

Mr. Ootes, I believe for general comments and questions specific to the overall department. Questions specific to an activity would have to wait until we reach the activity. Mr. Ootes.

Item 20: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters
Item 20: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters

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Jake Ootes

Jake Ootes Yellowknife Centre

Yes, Mr. Chairman. Does that mean we can make general comments and ask general questions at the same time?

Item 20: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters
Item 20: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters

Page 303

The Chair

The Chair Vince Steen

It is my understanding, Mr. Ootes, that you can ask questions for clarification purposes, but if you are asking questions specific to an activity, you will have to wait until we arrive at that activity. General comments. Are there any more general comments from the floor? Mr. Miltenberger.

Item 20: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters
Item 20: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters

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Michael Miltenberger

Michael Miltenberger Thebacha

Thank you, Mr. Chairman. Just a point of clarification. We are doing general comments on the Executive?

Item 20: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters
Item 20: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters

Page 303

The Chair

The Chair Vince Steen

Yes, Mr. Miltenberger. We are on general comments on the Executive. Are there any general comments on the Executive, or can we proceed activity by activity? Mr. Ootes.

Item 20: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters
Item 20: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters

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Jake Ootes

Jake Ootes Yellowknife Centre

Well, Mr. Chairman. I wonder if I can ask a question with regard to some statements. Yesterday, Mr. Chairman, the Premier stated, with regard to the communications plan, that it would be forthcoming in a week or so. But the difficulty I have with that is that we are considering the Executive budget now. If we do not know the financial implications of that particular activity, then it will do me no good to know about it next week. I need to know about that now. I wonder if the Premier could clarify that for me.

Item 20: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters
Item 20: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters

Page 303

The Chair

The Chair Vince Steen

Thank you, Mr. Ootes. Mr. Morin.

Item 20: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters
Item 20: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters

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Don Morin Tu Nedhe

Thank you, Mr. Chairman. Just for clarification for Mr. Ootes, the communication plan has to go through Cabinet, then it will go to committee and then Caucus. It is not addressed in these main estimates. If there is ever any need for dollars for that communication plan, it would have to be addressed as a supp.