This is page numbers 155 - 185 of the Hansard for the 13th Assembly, 6th Session. The original version can be accessed on the Legislative Assembly's website or by contacting the Legislative Assembly Library. The word of the day was education.

Topics

Further Return To Question 103-13(6): Potential Increases To Power Rates
Question 103-13(6): Potential Increases To Power Rates
Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 176

The Deputy Speaker John Ningark

Thank you. That brings us to the end of oral questions. Item 7, written questions. Item 8, return to written questions. Item 9, replies to opening address. Item 10, petitions. Item 11, reports of standing and special committees. Item 12, reports of committees on the review of bills. Mr. Picco.

Item 12: Reports Of Committees On The Review Of Bills
Item 12: Reports Of Committees On The Review Of Bills

Page 176

Edward Picco Iqaluit

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, I would like at this time to report to the Legislative Assembly that the Standing Committee on Infrastructure has reviewed Bill 8, An Act to Amend the Property Assessment and Taxation Act, and wishes to report that Bill 8 is now ready for the Committee of the Whole. Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

Item 12: Reports Of Committees On The Review Of Bills
Item 12: Reports Of Committees On The Review Of Bills

Page 176

The Deputy Speaker John Ningark

Thank you. Reports of committees on the review of bills. Item 13, tabling of documents. Mr. Morin.

Tabled Document 15-13(6): Key Features Of Western NWT Society
Item 13: Tabling Of Documents

Page 176

Don Morin Tu Nedhe

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, I wish to table the following document entitled, "Key Features of a Western NWT Society". Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

Tabled Document 15-13(6): Key Features Of Western NWT Society
Item 13: Tabling Of Documents

Page 176

The Deputy Speaker John Ningark

Thank you, Mr. Premier. Tabling of documents. Item 14, notices of motion. Mr. Erasmus.

Motion 5-13(6): Impact Of Nav Canada Service Fees On Air Transportation Costs
Item 14: Notices Of Motions

Page 176

Roy Erasmus Yellowknife North

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, I give notice that on Friday, September 25, 1998, I will move the following motion.

Now therefore I move, seconded by the Member for Iqaluit, that the Legislative Assembly recommends that the Federal Minister of Transport, the Honourable David Collenette, review the impact of NAV Canada service fees on the northern and remote areas of Canada and take the necessary steps to mitigate the impacts on the economies and standard of living in Canada's northern and remote communities.

And further, that the Government of the Northwest Territories, through the Minister of Transportation, the Honourable Jim Antoine, transmit this resolution to the Federal Government and all provincial and territorial governments.

Mr. Speaker, at the appropriate time I will be seeking unanimous consent to deal with this motion today.

Motion 5-13(6): Impact Of Nav Canada Service Fees On Air Transportation Costs
Item 14: Notices Of Motions

Page 177

The Deputy Speaker John Ningark

Thank you, Mr. Erasmus. Notices of motion. Mr. Todd.

Motion 6-13(6): Extended Adjournment
Item 14: Notices Of Motions

Page 177

John Todd Keewatin Central

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, I give notice that on Friday, September 25, 1998, I will move the following motion:

Now therefore I move, seconded by the honourable Member for Yellowknife Centre, Mr. Ootes, that, notwithstanding Rule 4, that when this House adjourns on Friday, September 25, 1998, it shall be adjourned until Wednesday, November 4, 1998.

And further, that any time prior to November 4, 1998, if the Speaker is satisfied after consultation with the Executive Council and Members of the Legislation Assembly that the public interest requires that the House should meet at an earlier time during the adjournment, the Speaker may give notice and thereupon the House shall meet at the time stated in such notice and shall transact its business as it has been duly adjourned to that time. Thank you.

Motion 6-13(6): Extended Adjournment
Item 14: Notices Of Motions

Page 177

The Deputy Speaker John Ningark

Thank you, Mr. Todd. Notices of motion. Item 15, Notices of motions for first reading of bills. Item 16, Motions. Mr. Erasmus.

Item 16: Motions
Item 16: Motions

Page 177

Roy Erasmus Yellowknife North

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, I seek unanimous consent to deal with the motion that I spoke of earlier today. Thank you.

Item 16: Motions
Item 16: Motions

Page 177

The Deputy Speaker John Ningark

Mr. Erasmus is seeking unanimous consent to deal with Motion 5-13(6). Are there any nays? There are no nays. Mr. Erasmus, deal with your motion.

Item 16: Motions
Item 16: Motions

Page 177

Roy Erasmus Yellowknife North

Thank you, Mr. Speaker, and thank you, colleagues, for your indulgence. Mr. Speaker,

Motion 5-13(6): Impact Of Nav Canada Service Fees On Air Transportation Costs
Item 16: Motions

Page 177

Roy Erasmus Yellowknife North

I MOVE that, whereas the Honourable David Collenette, Federal Minister of Transport, approved NAV Canada's fee proposal for air navigation services on September 11, 1998;

AND WHEREAS it is unacceptable that NAV Canada's service fees will reduce the cost of air transportation in southern Canada by some $100 million a year, it will increase the cost in northern Canada by $7 - $10 million a year;

AND WHEREAS the approved fee structure contravenes the spirit and intent of Section 35(g) of the Civil Air Navigation Commercialization Act, which indicates that charges for designated northern or remote services and for services directed to be provided under subsection 24(i) must not be higher than charges for similar services utilized to a similar extent elsewhere in Canada;

AND WHEREAS the effect of replacing the Air Transportation Tax with NAV Canada's service fees is to increase air cargo rates;

AND WHEREAS residents of the Northwest Territories living in remote communities serviced by air carriers will feel the most impact with increased costs to the basic food needs and all other goods supplied by air cargo;

NOW THEREFORE I MOVE, seconded by the Member for Iqaluit, that the Legislative Assembly recommends that the Federal Minister of Transport, the Honourable David Collenette, review the impact of NAV Canada service fees on the northern and remote areas of Canada and take the necessary steps to mitigate the impacts on the economies and standard of living in Canada's northern and remote communities.

AND FURTHER, that the Government of the Northwest Territories, through the Minister of Transportation, the Honourable Jim Antoine, transmit this resolution to the federal government and all provincial and territorial governments.

Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

Motion 5-13(6): Impact Of Nav Canada Service Fees On Air Transportation Costs
Item 16: Motions

Page 177

The Deputy Speaker John Ningark

Thank you, Mr. Erasmus. The motion is in order. To the motion. Mr. Roland.

Motion 5-13(6): Impact Of Nav Canada Service Fees On Air Transportation Costs
Item 16: Motions

Page 177

Floyd Roland

Floyd Roland Inuvik

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, I will be supporting the motion. I believe that the method in the changing of the way that the billing is done will severely impact the north and how we deal with the way we ship goods. Mr. Speaker, the way it is proposed to be billed would affect the way we see carriers operate today. For example, out of Inuvik, when we fly out of Inuvik, they fly a combi aircraft, as they call it, which is not full passenger, it is half cargo and half passenger, and I believe the way the rates have been structured, or the billing is going to be structured will impact on that way, because in the south, when you compare it to the north, they have full aircrafts, fully loaded and ready to go, whereas, in the north we do not have that ability, so I will be supporting that motion. Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

Motion 5-13(6): Impact Of Nav Canada Service Fees On Air Transportation Costs
Item 16: Motions

Page 177

The Deputy Speaker John Ningark

Thank you. Mr. Miltenberger, to the motion, please.

Motion 5-13(6): Impact Of Nav Canada Service Fees On Air Transportation Costs
Item 16: Motions

Page 177

Michael Miltenberger

Michael Miltenberger Thebacha

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, I as well will be supporting this motion. I believe the people in the north and their carriers in the north are getting the short end of the stick on this particular deal, and I think we have to give the Minister of Transportation any and every lever we can to make the case with Minister Collenette, who I hope will see the clear reality of the really negative impact of this decision

that they are making with NAV Canada. Thank you.

Motion 5-13(6): Impact Of Nav Canada Service Fees On Air Transportation Costs
Item 16: Motions

Page 178

The Deputy Speaker John Ningark

Thank you. To the motion. As seconder to the motion. Mr. Picco.

Motion 5-13(6): Impact Of Nav Canada Service Fees On Air Transportation Costs
Item 16: Motions

Page 178

Edward Picco Iqaluit

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, I seconded the motion because I thought that after seeing the non-receptive way that NAV Canada has dealt with the issue of the service fees, not only now, but last year when it first came up, and again this past summer in Iqaluit when we had the Baffin Leaders Summit, and a representative of NAV Canada, we tried to articulate our concerns with the fees and the detrimental effect it would have on the Baffin region. Over here in the west, in most cases, we do have the road system, but we still have the problem with the service fees and smaller planes. In the east, we have no roads and it magnifies and multiplies the effect of the traffic tariff that is being put in place by NAV Canada. So, with that, Mr. Speaker, of course I will be supporting this motion and, hopefully, our federal Minister of Transportation will be able to make some kind of move on this and use the hammer that is within his legislative ability, and hopefully say to NAV Canada once and for all that, indeed, the north is a unique place, and let us help keep it unique, and take these service fees and these tariffs that NAV Canada wants to introduce and throw them out. Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

Motion 5-13(6): Impact Of Nav Canada Service Fees On Air Transportation Costs
Item 16: Motions

Page 178

The Deputy Speaker John Ningark

Thank you. Mr. Ootes, to the motion.

Motion 5-13(6): Impact Of Nav Canada Service Fees On Air Transportation Costs
Item 16: Motions

Page 178

Jake Ootes

Jake Ootes Yellowknife Centre

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, I would also like to speak in support of the motion. We had a briefing the other day from a representative of the Northern Air Transport Association, and he brought to our attention a number of very great concerns we have here in the north with respect to services that are being provided in the north, and to speak bluntly on it, our services are not equal to what services are in southern Canada, and yet our charges that are being made here are equal to what is being charged.

Now, there used to be a head tax for every passenger carried, and the change that has taken place is that it is going to be based on the size of the aircraft, and because of our great distances here, we require larger aircraft to move from one point to the other, and so northerners are penalized because of that. Additionally there is concern, for example, it was pointed out that there are a limited number of runways in the Northwest Territories that can take a 737 fully loaded on landing, so certainly we in the north here are at a tremendous disadvantage. I think NAV Canada has a responsibility to address this question. We are being placed in a situation where we are being penalized because of our location. I think NAV Canada certainly has a responsibility to hear us out. I am very pleased the Minister is going to have the opportunity to meet with the federal Minister on this. I would indulge the Minister to pay attention to our requirements. Thank you.

Motion 5-13(6): Impact Of Nav Canada Service Fees On Air Transportation Costs
Item 16: Motions

Page 178

The Deputy Speaker John Ningark

Thank you. To the motion. Mr. Henry.

Motion 5-13(6): Impact Of Nav Canada Service Fees On Air Transportation Costs
Item 16: Motions

Page 178

Seamus Henry Yellowknife South

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. I will also be speaking in favour of the motion and I congratulate the Members of this House that brought this Motion forward.

Mr. Speaker, there is something wrong with the basic principle, when we have a population of 28 million people in Canada and 40,000 approximately who do not have the links with roads that are available in southern Canada. There is something wrong with the picture where that percentage of the population are able to save $100 million a year and a smaller population in the Northwest Territories who this procedure of NAV Canada affects the most, are going to have to pay $7 to $10 million. I would give as much weight as is possible to the Minister, to bring this to NAV Canada or the federal Minister of Transportation, to ensure some sense is brought to this issue. Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

Motion 5-13(6): Impact Of Nav Canada Service Fees On Air Transportation Costs
Item 16: Motions

Page 178

The Deputy Speaker John Ningark

Thank you, Mr. Henry. To the motion. I will give the mover of the motion the final point. To the motion, Mr. Erasmus.

Motion 5-13(6): Impact Of Nav Canada Service Fees On Air Transportation Costs
Item 16: Motions

Page 178

Roy Erasmus Yellowknife North

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. I have moved this motion for several reasons. First of all because I believe it is inherently unfair for the north to be charged in a similar manner to the way the southern carriers are charged. It is unfair to lower the cost of doing business in the south by $100 million while at the same time increasing the charges to our air transportation carriers by $7 to $10 million. By making this motion, we are certainly not closing the door to further reductions in the future.

As my colleagues have mentioned, there are many reasons why we feel our charges should go down. First of all, being that we are using sub-standard navigation aids, one of the air transportation representatives mentioned that we are using navigation that has been used in World War II, as compared to in the south, where they have radar, that type of thing, we do not.

The second one, is of course that the maximum weight for the planes are being charged and in the north, we can almost never use maximum weights because you have to fly long distances and you have to carry lots of fuel and therefore you can never travel at maximum weight. There is other reasoning there as well, however I will not go into that.

The third reason of course is the en-route fees that NAV Canada charges. By this, I mean the fees that NAV Canada charges to planes that fly over Canada. Those charges are set per kilometre that is flown over us. I spoke last week of four polar routes that will be opening soon, that will fly over us and directly through previously restricted, Russian airspace. Through these polar routes, the Northern Air Transportation Association representatives have calculated that NAV Canada will make a windfall of approximately $140 million by travelling through NWT airspace. That is NWT airspace. In any other area, if you mine something from an area, you get royalties. If you get oil out of an area, you get royalties. A similar situation should exist. If they are making $140 million off of our air space, that should be reflected in our air transportation costs or perhaps they should just pay for our whole fees and then distribute the rest of that to us, that is not needed to pay for the NAV Canada services they will provide to us. So, Mr.

Speaker, I will be voting in favour of this motion.

--Applause