This is page numbers 185 - 240 of the Hansard for the 14th Assembly, 3rd Session. The original version can be accessed on the Legislative Assembly's website or by contacting the Legislative Assembly Library. The word of the day was chairman.

Topics

Committee Motion 7-14(3): Recommendation To Issue Timber Harvesting Permits Only With Consent Of Affected Parties (carried)
Item 20: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters

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Floyd Roland

Floyd Roland Inuvik Boot Lake

Thank you, Mr. Chairman. Mr. Chairman, under this area, as I look down this particular page, I look for things that would affect the wildlife officers and their ability to do their work.

Over the last number of years, there has been a great deal of transfers handed down to wildlife officers in enforcing their jobs and so on. However, the only capital acquisitions I see here are the ones for parks, visitors centres, in that area, buildings.

So can the Minister inform us whether they feel that all the wildlife officers have enough equipment out there that they are well in hand and taken care of? That their snowshoes and back packs are good enough for them?

Committee Motion 7-14(3): Recommendation To Issue Timber Harvesting Permits Only With Consent Of Affected Parties (carried)
Item 20: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters

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The Chair

The Chair Paul Delorey

Thank you, Mr. Roland. Mr. Handley.

Committee Motion 7-14(3): Recommendation To Issue Timber Harvesting Permits Only With Consent Of Affected Parties (carried)
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Joe Handley

Joe Handley Weledeh

Mr. Chairman, the capital acquisition items that are in here are items that have a total cost of more then $50,000. So unless someone is buying a $50,000 back pack, it will not show up in there.

Mr. Chairman, there is a total of $2,427,000 in our capital budget, looking at the old way before tangible capital assets came into effect. There are a number of items here worth a total of $1,186,000 that make up most of the mobile equipment, tools, things the officers use because the value is less then $50,000. Thank you.

Committee Motion 7-14(3): Recommendation To Issue Timber Harvesting Permits Only With Consent Of Affected Parties (carried)
Item 20: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters

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The Chair

The Chair Paul Delorey

Thank you, Mr. Handley. Mr. Roland.

Committee Motion 7-14(3): Recommendation To Issue Timber Harvesting Permits Only With Consent Of Affected Parties (carried)
Item 20: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters

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Floyd Roland

Floyd Roland Inuvik Boot Lake

Will the Minister provide that to the Members for the sake of reviewing this? We know the system has changed significantly, and the committee requested that as part of the information that was to be made available. We hope in future budgets that they will be able to review it somehow. Thank you.

Committee Motion 7-14(3): Recommendation To Issue Timber Harvesting Permits Only With Consent Of Affected Parties (carried)
Item 20: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters

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The Chair

The Chair Paul Delorey

Thank you, Mr. Roland. Mr. Handley.

Committee Motion 7-14(3): Recommendation To Issue Timber Harvesting Permits Only With Consent Of Affected Parties (carried)
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Joe Handley

Joe Handley Weledeh

Mr. Chairman, I have the page here. We can certainly provide it to the committee Members.

Committee Motion 7-14(3): Recommendation To Issue Timber Harvesting Permits Only With Consent Of Affected Parties (carried)
Item 20: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters

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The Chair

The Chair Paul Delorey

Thank you, Mr. Handley. Resources, Wildlife and Economic Development, capital acquisition plan, resource management and economic development, $1,619,000. Agreed?

Committee Motion 7-14(3): Recommendation To Issue Timber Harvesting Permits Only With Consent Of Affected Parties (carried)
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Some Hon. Members

Agreed.

Committee Motion 7-14(3): Recommendation To Issue Timber Harvesting Permits Only With Consent Of Affected Parties (carried)
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The Chair

The Chair Paul Delorey

Tab 24, total department, $1,619,000. Agreed?

Committee Motion 7-14(3): Recommendation To Issue Timber Harvesting Permits Only With Consent Of Affected Parties (carried)
Item 20: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters

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Some Hon. Members

Agreed.

Committee Motion 7-14(3): Recommendation To Issue Timber Harvesting Permits Only With Consent Of Affected Parties (carried)
Item 20: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters

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The Chair

The Chair Paul Delorey

Does the committee agree that the Department of Resources, Wildlife and Economic Development is concluded?

Committee Motion 7-14(3): Recommendation To Issue Timber Harvesting Permits Only With Consent Of Affected Parties (carried)
Item 20: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters

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Some Hon. Members

Agreed.

Committee Motion 7-14(3): Recommendation To Issue Timber Harvesting Permits Only With Consent Of Affected Parties (carried)
Item 20: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters

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The Chair

The Chair Paul Delorey

I would like to thank the Minister and his witnesses for appearing before the committee. We will move on to the Department of Education, Culture and Employment. Does the Minister have any opening remarks?

Committee Motion 7-14(3): Recommendation To Issue Timber Harvesting Permits Only With Consent Of Affected Parties (carried)
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Jake Ootes

Jake Ootes Yellowknife Centre

Thank you, Mr. Chairman. I have opening remarks for the Department of Education, Culture and Employment.

The mission of the Department of the Education, Culture and Employment is to invest in and provide for the development of the people of the Northwest Territories, enabling them to reach their full potential, to lead fulfilled lives and to contribute to a strong and prosperous society. This supports the vision of the Government of the Northwest Territories, as outlined in Towards a Better Tomorrow, that will guide the government over the next four years.

The vision document, Towards a Better Tomorrow, outlines four key goals:

  • • Healthy, educated Northerners making responsible personal choices for themselves and their families;
  • • Strong and effective aboriginal and public governments operating cooperatively with no reduction in program and service levels as a result of implementing self-government agreements;
  • • A healthy and diversified economy providing employment opportunities for Northerners in all communities;
  • • An effective balance between development of our resources, socio-economic impacts, and preservation and protection of our natural environment.

These goals fit in with the five overall goals identified in the department's strategic update. These are:

  • • strengthen and build overall knowledge and skills of northern people;
  • • support economic development by preparing Northerners for all levels of employment:
  • • enhance and protect aboriginal culture;
  • • facilitate and contribute to community wellness;
  • • promote participation in community and territorial governance.

To work toward these goals, the Department of Education, Culture and Employment proposes to spend $173,422,000 on programs and services for the 2000-01 fiscal year. These programs and services ensure that Northwest Territories residents have opportunities for life-long learning, beginning in early childhood and continuing on through the adult years. Our training programs prepare Northerners to take advantage of job opportunities in the resource sector and in the communities. Our income support programs help ensure a basic level of income for all Northerners, and our cultural and language programs help Northerners to retain their unique languages and identities.

The development of a healthy and educated population starts in the earliest childhood years. The earlier enrichment begins, the better prepared a child is for lifetime learning. The department is committed to developing a collaborative approach to children's programming which involves parents, the family, the community and other agencies and departments. To this end, we will work with the Department of Health and Social Services to develop and implement a territorial agenda for children.

In 2000-01, we will continue to participate in the National Child Benefit Program. As a result of increased federal funding in the NCB, an additional $210,000 investment in the Healthy Children's Initiative will help children reach their full potential by beginning life in as healthy a manner as possible. The money will be available to community groups to design and deliver integrated programs for children up to the age of six.

The next step in building a healthy and educated population is the school system. A responsive and vibrant school system forms the basis of culturally, socially and economically strong northern communities. Beginning this year, the department will implement a plan that will, over the next four years, reduce the pupil-teacher ratio in the NWT from 18:1 to 16:1. This alone will significantly enhance the quality of education available to students in Northwest Territories schools. At the same time, funding for student support will rise from its current level of 8.5 percent of the school contribution budget to 15 percent. This will enhance our ability to respond to student needs. These two initiatives will result in an additional $12 million investment in learning over the next four years. These changes were approved by the Assembly in legislation during March.

In conjunction with the increase in expenditures for student support services, the department undertook a needs assessment survey which is now nearing completion. The results of the survey will assist divisional education councils and school boards in identifying areas of greatest need and help ensure that the money being re-invested in education will reap maximum benefits.

For the last decade, the department has pursued a policy of implementing grade extensions In Northwest Territories schools. Northern students can now complete Grade 12 in the vast majority of Northwest Territories communities. This initiative has improved participation rates and graduation rates. We are now challenged with increasing course options at the community level. As a result of a Memorandum of Understanding I was pleased to sign last month with the Calgary Board of Education, an additional 30 online courses will be available in Northwest Territories schools this fall. Mr. Chairman, I expect this exciting development to be enhanced in the years to come.

Post-secondary studies are also an important element in building a healthy and educated society. As a result of changes approved by the Assembly in March, I am pleased to implement the re-design of the Student Financial Assistance Program. The revamped program will support efforts to develop a skilled and professional workforce by putting more money into the hands of Northwest Territories students. The revolving loan fund has been increased from $22 million to $33 million and the budget for the program has been increased by $500,000.

A healthy, educated northern population is an employed population. The career development directive, to be implemented in 2000-01, will ensure a seamless system of programs and services that allow individuals smooth and successful transitions from school and training into the workforce.

Mr. Chairman, there is no doubt that this is a very exciting chapter in the history of the Northwest Territories. Diamond mining and a renewed interest in oil and gas development are both having a significant impact on the northern economy. The GNWT, in concert with the private sector and aboriginal organizations, is supportive of development in the non-renewable resource sector. However, the government has made it clear that certain conditions must be met, if that development is going to take place. These conditions include maximizing employment and training opportunities for Northerners. The Department of Education, Culture and Employment will invest $1.3 million in programs that will provide training for entry-level jobs for Northerners in diamond processing and in oil and gas exploration and production.

One of the major challenges we face in preparing Northerners for employment is that many lack the basic educational and literacy skills needed to participate in training programs. I was pleased to have discussions with the Standing Committee on Social Programs on this important issue, and the committee's comments assisted me in going forward to obtain additional funding. To address this, we propose a $650,000 expenditure for the Community Skills for Work Program. This will be an amendment to the main estimates and I intend to introduce a motion to this effect at the appropriate time.

Youth employment is another priority of this budget. There is a $1 million expenditure for the continuation of a program many of you will have come to know as Working Together.

This budget also includes significant increases necessary to meet the growing needs of existing programs. These include:

  • • $3.1 million to fund pay increases in the collective agreement signed with our teachers;
  • • $3.2 million for increased superannuation payments;
  • • $400,000 to pay for growth in income support programs;
  • • $600,000 to pay for increased utility costs;
  • • $600,000 to pay the lease for the student family-housing complex recently opened in Fort Smith.

Mr. Chairman, this budget reflects the commitment of the Department of Education, Culture and Employment to further the vision set out in Towards a Better Tomorrow. The mandate of the department is broad, with programs that take a person through a lifetime. I am confident that with these programs and proposed expenditures, this department can do its part in achieving our common vision. Thank you, Mr. Chairman.

Committee Motion 7-14(3): Recommendation To Issue Timber Harvesting Permits Only With Consent Of Affected Parties (carried)
Item 20: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters

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The Chair

The Chair Paul Delorey

Thank you, Mr. Ootes. Does the chairman for the Standing Committee on Social Programs have any comments on the review of the department? Mr. Miltenberger.

Committee Motion 7-14(3): Recommendation To Issue Timber Harvesting Permits Only With Consent Of Affected Parties (carried)
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Michael Miltenberger

Michael Miltenberger Thebacha

Thank you, Mr. Chairman.

General

The Department of Education, Culture and Employment supplies a wide range of services. These include early childhood programs; school services; education, careers and employment for adults; income support; culture, heritage and languages; and the directorate, regional administration and information networks.

The Business Plan

During the review of the business plan, it was observed that, over the past three years, the department has had little consistency in its strategies, outcomes and outcome measures. This, compounded with the majority of the targets being vague, make it extremely difficult for the department, let alone committee members, to evaluate progress.

This is not the first time that the department has been cited for the lack of detail in the department's plans. In the committee's Report on the Review of the 1999-2002 Business Plans and 1999-2000 Main Estimates, the committee expressed concern regarding the lack of detail in the goals, measures, targets and strategies in the Department of Education, Culture and Employment's business plans.

The 2000-2003 departmental business plans stated:

"The department's strategies and objectives have been updated in the 2000-2001 business plan to reflect the input that the department received in updating its strategic plan in 1999. They have also been updated to reflect linkages to the broad goals of the Government of the Northwest Territories as outlined in Towards a Better Tomorrow (page 55; 2000-2003 business plans)".

Again, the department was vague when stating their new targets and outcome measures leaving the committee unsure of what it was the department was trying to achieve. Further, in reference to the department's comment about the "2000-2001 business plan", business plans are for a three-year period, yet the department is approaching planning as a one-year process. Over time, Ministers will change. Long range strategies and targets must be in place and worked toward regardless of Ministerial changes.

Outcomes and Outcome Measures - Aboriginal Teachers

Members noticed that the department did not supply a hard figure in the target for the number of aboriginal teachers in northern classrooms. The committee is of the opinion that the department must reinstate a target number for aboriginal teachers in Northwest Territories classrooms and this should be representative of the population it serves. Further, the committee expressed concern that Aurora College should also be trying to increase the number of aboriginal instructors in their programs.

Early Childhood Programs

During the review of the Department of Education, Culture and Employment, the Minister stated that the department was working with the Department of Health and Social Services in a framework for the review of the Healthy Children's Initiative and the development and implementation of an inter-departmental territorial agenda for children.

In presentations made to the committee by the Department of Health and Social Services and the Department of Education, differences in terminology and direction between the two departments were noted. Because of this, the committee wonders whether there really are meaningful discussions taking place between the two departments. The Members need to see demonstrable proof that the departments are indeed working together.

School Services - Student Support and Pupil-Teacher Ratio

In March of this year, the Legislative Assembly of the Northwest Territories passed amendments to the NWT Education Act to supply additional funding for student support services. Subsequently, a student needs assessment survey is being conducted to identify the scope of individuals requiring assistance. The public and educators have identified student support as a critical area that needs to be addressed. The committee was disconcerted that the department had not identified student support services as a critical issue and failed to address it in their business plans.

Members are concerned that the pupil-teacher ratio reduction accomplished by the recent amendments to the Education Act will not actually impact on the number of students in the classroom or provide any extra assistance for special needs. Members will not be pleased if these amendments result in more administrators rather than actual assistance in the classroom.

The department informed the committee that the School Planning and Resource Committee would be making recommendations for disbursement of special needs funding. The department further indicated that it did not see student support funding being linked to individual students. Recognizing the existence of magnet communities, the committee is concerned that a per capita only funding formula for special needs funding may be used.

It is the opinion of the Members that funding must match community requirements; per capita only funding would be unacceptable unless it can be proven to be fair.

Number of Grade 10 Students

The committee reviewed enrollment numbers for the past ten years and noted that there is constantly a "bulge" in the enrollment at the grade 10 level. There are consistently more students in grade 10 than in grade 9 in the previous year. It is also observed that there is not a corresponding increase in grade 11 enrollment the following year.

Committee members believe that the bulge in Grade 10 enrollment may have more to do with the lack of Adult Basic Education programs in the communities than any other factor cited by the department.

The department referred the committee to the departmental publication Towards Excellence - A Report on Education in the Northwest Territories 99. Towards Excellence cites a number of factors that contribute to the bulge: a proportion of youth re-entering the system who do not become part of a progressive group moving through the system; students who gained access through grade extensions; and students who decided to make high school their "productive choice" in order to access income support. The report also states that grade 10 reflects a shift in emphasis from placement to promotion as the basis for designating grade levels.

The department indicated that more analysis was being done on the grade 10 bulge. The committee agrees that there is a need for more analysis and looks forward to being appraised of any new findings.

Mr. Chairman, if I can ask my colleague, the deputy chair, Mr. McLeod to carry on with the report, please?

Committee Motion 7-14(3): Recommendation To Issue Timber Harvesting Permits Only With Consent Of Affected Parties (carried)
Item 20: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters

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The Chair

The Chair Paul Delorey

Thank you, Mr. Miltenberger. Mr. McLeod.

Committee Motion 7-14(3): Recommendation To Issue Timber Harvesting Permits Only With Consent Of Affected Parties (carried)
Item 20: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters

June 27th, 2000

Page 220

Michael McLeod

Michael McLeod Deh Cho

Thank you, Mr. Chairman.

Education, Careers and Employment for Adults - Apprenticeship Training

The department has identified a need for skilled trade persons in the Northwest Territories. The committee noted that over $400,000 was lapsed in the area of apprenticeship. The department indicates that one of the contributing factors for a decrease in demand for apprenticeship was that many people do not have the education levels necessary to enter into the programs.

Committee members also understand that many companies are reluctant to commit to apprentice programs targeting Northerners because of the low education level of residents. The members of the standing committee believe that the Department of Education, Culture and Employment must work closer with industry in identifying and getting Northerners into apprenticeships. There is also a need for the department to concentrate on adult basic education so that Northerners can take advantage of the apprenticeship program.

Adult Basic Education and Literacy

In the area of support for adult basic education and literacy, the department has dropped the ball. The committee is concerned with the reduction in financial support for adult basic education programs. For a number of northern residents, adult basic education must be taken before they can access apprenticeship programs. How is it possible for people to move into apprenticeship training and trades if they cannot get upgrading?

The committee was upset with statements the Minister made regarding the value of adult basic education programs and the lack of statistical support for his comments. In order to make informed decisions regarding programs, the department must have data on the success rate and value of these programs; statistics that are presently not in existence.

Committee members have received correspondence, filled with statistics, from non-governmental organizations that contradict the Minister's assertion that statistics are not available. Regardless, committee members agree that there is a definite need for data collection and tracking with respect to the value and success of adult basic education programs.

The committee brought to the attention of the Minister that many adult basic education courses are only offered during the daytime hours. In such cases, some adults wishing to pursue upgrading are not able to maintain daytime employment. Members would like to point out that by only offering adult basic education during the day the department is in fact, encouraging residents to quit gainful employment and go on income support in order to better themselves.

The committee also noted that in some regions adults are returning to high school for upgrading. This may be due to the diminished offering of adult basic education programs. The department was requested to do a cost comparison between the delivery of upgrading through high school and through adult basic education programs.

Oil and Gas Training

Members of the Standing Committee on Social Programs were pleased to see that the government has placed some priority on this activity by identifying ongoing funding and providing it to the department as part of its base funding.

The Department of Education allowed some committee members a cursory glance at material that was produced in co-operation with the Department of Resources, Wildlife and Economic Development for oil and gas training. Members would like to acquire copies of this material as soon as possible.

The committee holds the opinion that it is better to be proactive rather than reactive and encourages the department to move on this initiative now. Members caution the department that there is a need for identification and training for long-term job opportunities in the oil and gas sector, in addition to the short-term construction and exploration jobs that the proposed oil and gas training program seems to focus on.

Student Financial Assistance

Although the Student Financial Assistance Act was amended in the past Session, the committee feels that there are still some parts of the program that need to be changed to suit the needs of students. The department is investing in distance learning so that individuals may access post-secondary courses over the Internet. Presently, no section of the Act offers support for learners enrolling in distance education courses.

Currently, the department has one central agency for the disbursement of student financial assistance. The department agreed to look at community control of SFA disbursements.

Committee members are being made aware of many problems with the regulations that implement the redesign of the Student Financial Assistance Program. The application form itself is bulky because of income information required to determine whether a student is eligible for the Millennium Scholarship Fund. Some members of the committee have questioned the ability of most people to comprehend the questions asked in the application form and whether it is necessary for all students to fill out the section that addresses Millennium scholarships.

Members are concerned that the policy covering disabled students and the funding available to them may not be sufficient to meet the needs of particular students. The Minister may need the latitude to increase the amount available to a disabled student. It is not clear to members that the Minister can make exceptions on available funding.

Members were also concerned with the Minister's reply to the committee on grandfather rights for eligibility of the students presently accessing the Student Financial Assistance Program. This was provided in response to the committee questions during the review of the proposed redesign of the Student Financial Assistance Program.

Committee members do not believe that the department has the same understanding as the committee on what grandfather clauses accomplish. To committee members a grandfather clause would mean that a student would maintain their previous eligibility under the new system. Committee members are aware that the department's new eligibility definitions reduce benefits for students already receiving student financial assistance.

This was not the understanding that committee members had when they agreed to let the Minister provide details on continued student eligibility after Members approved the amendments to the Student Financial Assistance Act. To say that committee members are disappointed would be an understatement.

Members are sure that many more concerns about the new Student Financial Assistance Program will come to light over the next few months. The committee will work to ensure that the Student Financial Assistance Program will be fair and accessible for northern students.

Integration of Income Support and Disability Pensions

The members of the Standing Committee on Social Programs are aware of programs in other jurisdictions that provide medical and financial help to permanently disabled residents. This assistance is basically a set amount, or pension, which when combined with all other sources of income allows the individual to not fall below a prescribed income.

In Alberta there is the Assured Income for the Severely Handicapped (AISH) Program which provides medical and income assistance to adults with permanent disabilities that severely impair their ability to earn a living.

People only receive AISH if they have exhausted all other possibilities for training, rehabilitation or employment. The current Income Support Program in the Northwest Territories as administered by the Department of Education, Culture and Employment makes no allowance for this possibility.

People with permanent disabilities are expected to make productive life choices, like other income support recipients, regardless of whether these choices represent any meaningful gain for the disabled persons. In some cases that members are aware of residents receive too much money from the Canada Disability Pension to be eligible for Income Support.

In Alberta, AISH clients are also eligible for medical benefits such as prescription drugs, glasses, dental work, medical travel and ambulance services. Committee members envision a similar role for the Department of Health and Social Services in an integrated service delivery model in conjunction with the Department of Education, Culture and Employment.

The Standing Committee on Social Programs recommends that the Minister responsible for Education, Culture and Employment, in co-operation with the Minister responsible for Health and Social Services, develop a model that ensures a minimum level of income for permanently disabled residents, and an assured level of healthcare benefits.

Culture and Heritage - Languages Strategy

The committee is of the opinion that the government must revitalize and enhance their efforts to preserve aboriginal languages in the Northwest Territories. The present approach is not successful. The department plans to release a draft language strategy in June 2000. A review of the Official Languages Act is to be carried out at the first Session in 2001. The committee encourages the government to assume a more constructive approach in the preservation of all official languages of the Northwest Territories.

Human Resources

The committee noted that the department lapsed over $400,000 in the Public Service Career Program. This lapse is more than the $250,000 identified for the recently announced Staff Retention Policy. Committee members are concerned that if the same conditions are attached to the Staff Retention Policy as are attached to Public Service Career Training Program they will be asking why the funding for the Staff Retention Policy lapsed during the next main estimate review. The committee will be monitoring the situation.

Committee Motion 7-14(3): Recommendation To Issue Timber Harvesting Permits Only With Consent Of Affected Parties (carried)
Item 20: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters

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The Chair

The Chair Paul Delorey

Thank you, Mr. McLeod. Before I go on, I would like to recognize a Hay Riverite in the crowd, the brother to the distinguished Mike Miltenberger, Mark Miltenberger. Welcome to the Legislative Assembly.

-- Applause

We are on page 9-9, Education, Culture and Employment. Would the Minister like to bring in witnesses?

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Jake Ootes

Jake Ootes Yellowknife Centre

Thank you, Mr. Chairman. Yes, please.

Committee Motion 7-14(3): Recommendation To Issue Timber Harvesting Permits Only With Consent Of Affected Parties (carried)
Item 20: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters

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The Chair

The Chair Paul Delorey

Thank you, Mr. Ootes. Does the committee agree?

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Some Hon. Members

Agreed.

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The Chair

The Chair Paul Delorey

Would the Sergeant-at-Arms please escort the witnesses in?

Mr. Ootes, would you please introduce your witnesses for the record?

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Jake Ootes

Jake Ootes Yellowknife Centre

Thank you, Mr. Chairman. With me are Mr. Mark Cleveland, deputy minister of the Department of Education, Culture and Employment; and Mr. Paul Devitt, director of management services. Thank you.