Thank you. Item 2, Ministers' statements. Mr. Miltenberger.

Thank you, Mr. Chairman. Mr. Speaker, next week is NWT Social Work Week. Today I rise to recognize the valuable contribution of social workers to children, families and communities in the NWT.

Mr. Speaker, the strength and wellness of a community is most clearly reflected in the care and concern it places on the most vulnerable of its residents. The practice of social work in the NWT reinforces this premise as the profession is dedicated to building community connections and family supports that ensure our most vulnerable individuals, including children, seniors, persons with disabilities and people in crisis, have safe, respectful and nurturing environments.

The social work profession is as diverse as the people who fill the positions. Social workers bring their strengths, their skills, their education and their life experiences to their work. In addition to child protection services, social workers provide services in a variety of specialty areas including:

• • community corrections;
• • community development;
• • addictions services;
• • seniors and disabilities services;
• • mental health services;
• • adoption services;
• • family counselling; and,
• • crisis intervention counselling.

As you can see, the social work profession offers much to the well-being of our communities and to the NWT society as a whole. The profession, particularly here in the NWT, is all about working with communities in partnership with other frontline

professionals and support workers. This partnership is key to building on family and community strengths in a proactive manner and to providing the necessary supports during times of crisis or need.

The Department of Health and Social Services has a leadership role to promote and nurture the profession of social work within the health and social services system. As Members know, Mr. Speaker, the department continues to work in partnership with health and social services authorities to implement an action plan that responds to recommendations of the child and family services review done in May 2000. Our accomplishments include:

• • providing funding for social workers to access professional development;
• • increasing the number of social workers in the GNWT workforce by 20 positions in the past two years;
• • creating a new mentorship program for the social work profession;
• • improving the electronic information system that social workers use to deliver child and family services;
• • developing system-wide standards of practice as well as guidelines of best practices;
• • supporting the development of a territorial Foster Parent Association; and,
• • supporting non-government organizations to provide services and to advocate for community members.

I am also pleased to announce, Mr. Speaker, some new resources that are being released as part of Social Work Week. The department partnered with the Association of Social Workers in Northern Canada and Aurora College to develop career booklets, an interactive CD and a toolkit to market the profession of social work in the NWT.

These resources are being highlighted during the social work conference and AGM that's being held today and this weekend.

Mr. Speaker, this year's theme for Social Work Week is aptly titled "Social Work - Leaders for Social Change." Join me in recognizing social workers throughout the NWT who bring positive social change to NWT families and communities every day. Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

---Applause

Item 2, Ministers' statements. Item 3, Members' statements. Ms. Lee.

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, I recently had a chance to visit the staff and students of Koinonia Christian School in Yellowknife and I invited them to visit our Legislature and I am pleased to see them with us today. In their honour, I would like to say a few words about this unique school.

Koinonia opened its doors in August 1996, only weeks after legislation allowing for its development became law. The founders of the school were seeking alternate Christian-based education for their children. From those small beginnings of six students to a high of 28 in 1998, the school has continued in Yellowknife. This year, the school has 12 full-time students in grades one to eight. The school's motto is excellence in education, excellence in living, excellence in service. Their goal is to educate children in a way that emphasizes the need to do their very best in what they pursue, in the adults they grow to be and in their service to the community and country.

Mr. Speaker, it is obvious that the staff and students at that school take that motto seriously judging from some of the activities the school has taken part in. In 1998, and again in 2002, students from the school have won the Heritage Day contest and they have represented their school in the NWT at Canada Day celebrations in Ottawa. Almost without exception since 1996, the students have won or placed at various levels of the Royal Canadian Legion Remembrance Day Contest. Most recently students were involved in the Queen's Jubilee Commemorative Book presented to Her Majesty in 2002.

Mr. Speaker, this unique school also attempts to stay on the cutting edge of education delivery. This year, it embarked upon a new pilot project in virtual education. Students in grade six and eight participated in some of the traditional classroom programs and received their major instruction online through North Start Academy Canada online programs, although supervised in-house, teachers based out of Alberta are available to students online at any time. Recently, North Star Academy Canada has signed an agreement for a pilot project with the Alberta Distance Learning Centre whereby that centre is contracting with the academy to deliver its Christian alternative program for grades 11 to 12. If this pilot project proves successful, the centre will contract the academy in the coming years to deliver grades 6 to 12 Christian alternative programs as well as other grades as they are developed. Mr. Speaker, may I seek unanimous consent to continue?

The Member is seeking unanimous consent. Do I hear any nays? You have unanimous consent.

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Thank you, colleagues. Mr. Speaker, the school staff comes to the school not merely as employees seeking employment, but as people who feel that teaching at Koinonia is their calling. Their investment shows in their children, in the quality of education that is provided and the spirit in the classroom.

The students at the school come from a mixture of ethnic backgrounds, Aboriginal and non-Aboriginal. Currently, the school is looking to acquire property in which to place the portable classrooms obtained through government tender 18 months ago. Also, this is a high priority for the school to go and develop and they need to have a permanent home. They have been operating out of a classroom in Mildred Hall School. I know this is how Ecole Allain St-Cyr had its beginning and we now know that dreams like this do come true with dedication, commitment and perseverance.

Mr. Speaker, I applaud the work the staff and students of the school have been doing and I ask my colleagues to wish them continued success in the future. Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

---Applause

Item 3, Members' statements. Member for Inuvik Boot Lake, Mr. Roland.

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, I rise today to speak about an issue that affects our constituents' right in their pocketbooks. Mr. Speaker, the cost of getting electricity pumped into people's houses has continued to grow throughout the Territories and I refer specifically to my constituency. Mr. Speaker, just over the Christmas break and into the new year, I was contacted by a number of concerned constituents and businesses in the community about the increased power bills they were starting to receive. There was a short fall rate rider that showed up on their bills plus a demand charge that was there and bumped the power cost significantly in my constituency. I raised this issue with the Minister responsible for the Power Corporation and I have to thank him for getting back to me with some information.

Mr. Speaker, I am still concerned with the increased cost of power in my community. For example, right now for residential use in Inuvik, 38 cents per kilowatt hour and on top of that, the monthly service charge and if you're a general user, there is another demand charge. Mr. Speaker, when the community of Inuvik switched over its generators to gas turbines, there was talk of saving money because the big cost of providing for fuel for those generators would drop significantly from that of the bunker C fuel they were using prior. Mr. Speaker, we were told at that time that there would probably be no reduction in cost because we had to pay for the cost of replacing the old generators with the new ones. Mr. Speaker, in the information provided it says, through those gas turbines, we've probably lowered the cost of service in Inuvik by 15 percent.

So, Mr. Speaker, even though we were told we are saving money and it is costing less to generate that power, residents of Inuvik are finding they are having to pay more for the same service. So, I will be asking the Minister which is it? Are we

actually saving money and, if so, why isn't that being passed on to the customers? Thank you.

---Applause

Members' statements. Member for Hay River North, Mr. Delorey.

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, as this is Education Week throughout the Northwest Territories, I thought I would keep with that theme and bring acknowledgement to a wonderful event held this past Tuesday in Hay River. Mr. Speaker, I am referring to the 24th annual Hay River science fair. This science fair is an event that attracted science projects from 80 students from four Hay River schools. The Hay River Science Fair is an annual event that has always been eagerly anticipated by a number of budding Einsteins in Hay River for many years.

Mr. Speaker, the format for the science fair this year was a little different from past years, in that students' participation was not mandatory. The fact that 80 students chose to participate in the science fair was fantastic, Mr. Speaker, and the organizers' hope is to reach a participation rate of 100 students for next year. This is so encouraging, that our young people are choosing to enter their science projects in an event like the science fair, when there is no pressure to do so.

Mr. Speaker, I would like to take this opportunity to thank the organizer of the Hay River Science Fair, the assistant principal of Princess Alexandra School, Mr. Chuck Lirette and the many volunteers that commit countless hours to the success of the science fair in Hay River. The names of the winners are too numerous to mention here, Mr. Speaker, but I would like to sincerely congratulate all the participants in the 24th annual science fair in Hay River. Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

---Applause

Members' statements. Member for Hay River South, Mrs. Groenewegen.

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, yesterday I started to give a rather lengthy statement and I decided not to conclude it. So I would just like to recap a little bit of what I was trying to say. A number of weeks back, this government signed an MOU with the Gwich'in and, at the same time, announced the appointment of a regional director for the Beaufort-Delta. In these two items, which were perceived as changes in the way this government does business, in my statement yesterday, I was trying to say that we shouldn't be surprised by that because we've been on a long continuum of political evolution, and these things should make sense.

So, when I conclude my statement today, I would just like to speak to those issues again and just try to bridge the gap, I guess, to show that it really isn't that big of a change but with proper communication, people would see that and not be alarmed by them. So, Mr. Speaker, I will just continue with my statement.

We are all here to do a job. Leaders of community at regional levels are also trying to do a similar job serving the people that they represent. Sometimes we need to think about how these functions can be accomplished in an efficient and transparent way that ensures the decisions are responsive to the needs of the people. I don't think we should turn it into a turf war or contest that leaves some people feeling that the effectiveness of their input might somehow be less important or threatened.

With respect with to the contracting portion of the MOU, again, this government has a fairly long standing precedent of negotiating contracts. It's maybe not as pure a form of economics as supply and demand and let the market dictate the price but, in the past, if there were arguable benefits, such as promoting economy and commerce in smaller communities and regions and there was political support and it wasn't going to bring a project in at a significantly higher price, negotiated contracts were employed as a means of accomplishing a goal. The MOU may formulize and articulate that concept but it certainly cannot be argued as being new or foreign to this government's way of doing business.

As for the hiring of the new regional director, in consultation with various governments that need to serve a cohesive way in the Beaufort-Delta, again, this government has a longstanding practice of using public service employment as a means of achieving a goal. It's been called the Affirmative Action Policy and Direct Appointments. It has caused its share of concern because, again, it's probably not as pure and as objective as hiring the most qualified person. However, it has been a policy of this government and, in many instances, it has achieved what it set out to accomplish. Our public service has become more representative of the people it serves, so it is not a huge leap from selecting and approving affirmative action candidates or direct appointing senior officials for government positions to consulting with Aboriginal government on who they think could best serve at a senior level of government to fulfill a particular mandate. Mr. Speaker, I am really almost finished. I would like to seek unanimous consent to conclude my statement, please.

Member seeking unanimous consent. Are there any nays? You have unanimous consent, Mrs. Groenewegen.

Thank you, Mr. Speaker and thank you colleagues. I would like to refer to that kind of consultation as the politics of inclusion and yet, when these items became public knowledge several weeks back, there was little if any attempt to explain what was happening and put them in context of where we've been or where we are going. Granted, it is everyone or anyone's right to disagree or argue about any government policy or direction and even seek to change it if they have a better idea. But, in fairness to the people who are often left to speculate or draw their own conclusion about what this government is up to, I would like to see a more proactive effort in communicating broad strategic directions by this government. Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

---Applause

Members' statements. Member for Nunakput, Mr. Steen.

Thank you, Mr. Speaker and good morning. Mr. Speaker, on February 26, 2003, the Northwest Territories Status of Women Council announced the winners of the Wise Woman Awards for 2003. Mrs. Lena Anikina, late of Tuktoyaktuk, was selected for the Beaufort-Delta region. Mr. Speaker, Lena was a highly respected and knowledgeable elder in her community of Tuktoyaktuk, who dedicated her time to the preservation of her culture and the Inuvialuit way of life. She assisted with translation of oral history documentation, traditional place names and assisted with the Inuvialuit dictionary as well. Mr. Speaker, Lena will be dearly missed by her family, friends and relatives. She passed away on February 15, 2003 but will always be remembered as a kind, gentle and wise woman. Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

---Applause

Thank you, Mr. Steen. Members' statements. Member for Great Slave, Mr. Braden.

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Today marks the last day of Education Week in the NWT and earlier this month, I accepted an invitation from the NWT Teacher's Association to job shadow. I had the good fortune to spend the day with the principal of Mildred Hall School, here in Yellowknife, Adrien Amirault. Working that day with Mr. Amirault and his vice-principal DiAnn Blesse, a Dene teacher with a Master in Education, I found that they lead a very strong team of teachers and classroom assistants and administrators in a school of about 300.

I certainly found that the school environment has changed a lot since I went to school, here in Yellowknife in the 60's and 70's, Mr. Speaker.

One of the things that's really changing, especially in Yellowknife schools, is the turnover. This school, even though it has a relatively small population compared to other schools, has a very high turnover. There is a turnover of 100 percent in the school population. This does not mean that all the kids are changing every year, but there is a small number of students who are turning over many times within the year. This is driven by people who have to come to Yellowknife and are perhaps taking courses at Aurora College or they are here for medical reasons and need to bring their families along.

So this is one of the things that's making conditions in that school very dynamic and quite complex for the teachers and the students who are there.

I found, too, Mr. Speaker, that these schools are assuming a far greater role in the daily lives of the students and the families, doing things that range from serving breakfast to a much, much broader curriculum and sports program and also trying to make the best of the policy of inclusion that this government is adopting which I believe is the right one. It certainly does make for a lot of changes in dynamics in the classroom.

The school is an old one, Mr. Speaker, and is one that I am very thankful is up for renovation over the next couple of years. This is something that means a lot.

I wanted to acknowledge the good work of the people of Mildred Hall School, of the invitation I got to job shadow and wish them all the luck in the coming school year. Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

---Applause

Item 3, Members' statements. The Member for Frame Lake, Mr. Dent.

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Being Education Week, I thought I would speak about a topic that I have spoken about many times in this House relating to education, and that is the adequacy of student support funding.

Mr. Speaker, I recently had the opportunity to review the latest Towards Excellence report put together by the Department of Education, Culture and Employment. In it, I read some fairly disturbing statistics.

Mr. Speaker, we are still failing far too many children with special needs. The report reads that of the 9,619 students for whom data were collected, teachers reported that 47 percent or 4,487 needed one or more supports. However, 26 percent, or more than 1,000 of all students who needed some type or level of additional support, were not receiving any support or service beyond that provided to students as part of the regular classroom program.

Mr. Speaker, of the number of students needing specific supports, roughly 10 percent of them were falling through the cracks and receiving no support. Ten percent of all the students who need support aren't getting anything.

Mr. Speaker, in assessing the adequacy and effectiveness of the supports provided to children with behavioral issues, those requiring the most time, energy and resources to support, almost 2,872 were identified. Eighty-one percent were identified as not receiving enough help. Only 13 percent are seeing substantial progress and more than 40 percent are seeing very little.

Since we have a higher proportion of students in need of special supports in the Northwest Territories, shouldn't we increase the funding to allow those special supports to happen?

Mr. Speaker, we know that inclusive schooling is the right policy, but for it to work we need to give adequate support to the teachers to make it work. We've increased our student support funding to 15 percent. Mr. Speaker, some southern jurisdictions claim they offer 24 to 25 percent of their total funding to student support.

Mr. Speaker, the U.S. is embarked on an initiative which is called No Child Left Behind. I think we have to take that phrase to heart ourselves. Mr. Speaker, I urge the government to continue finding ways to increase the funding for special supports and special needs to give all kids in the NWT a fighting chance to be the best that they can be. Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

---Applause

Item 3, Members' statements. Member for North Slave, Mr. Lafferty.

Item 3, Members' statements. The honourable Member for Yellowknife South, Mr. Bell.

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. As a couple of my colleagues have indicated, it is Education Week and we tend to think of youth when we think of Education Week, but I wanted to take this opportunity to highlight the efforts of BHP Billiton in dealing with literacy issues and challenges in the workplace.

We know that literacy is an obstacle for many Northerners looking to gain meaningful employment. BHP, on opening their mine, recognized that there were significantly lower levels of literacy in the North and 20 to 25 percent of their workforce were struggling somewhat with literacy and they decided, Mr. Speaker, to do something about that.

The program that they have embarked upon allows - and I think this is very key - employees to receive paid work release time to attend learning sessions. It's one thing, Mr. Speaker, to offer it on an employee's down time or off time and if they are so inclined, to ask them to attend, but they actually give people time off in order to study and work. I think that's very important.

BHP recognized when they were setting this up, Mr. Speaker, that it was going to be a win/win. They knew that the program would help their employees to improve their self-esteem and it certainly would help them make the transition into trades, and that's critical if we are going to get our northern people up into the more meaningful levels of employment and the more lucrative types of employment, Mr. Speaker. Success in trades and certification in trades does, in large part, require significant levels of literacy.

Mr. Speaker, of course, there is always some self-interest in industry and they knew that for their company, it was certainly going to mean a safer and more productive workplace and it would improve communication within all levels of the organization, Mr. Speaker, and productivity would also be on the rise. It would also allow them to continue to hire a northern work force from all of our northern communities and this is something that they have made a large commitment to do.

So after sitting down and discussing their program with BHP officials, I decided to nominate them for an award sponsored by the Conference Board of Canada. They have something called Excellence in Workplace Literacy. I nominated them for this award. I hope they are successful. I know they have been to many industry forums to talk to other people in industries about best practices and I think they are really doing some good work and I hope my colleagues will join me in thanking them for that good work. Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

---Applause

Item 3, Members' statements. Member for Deh Cho, Mr. McLeod.

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, public housing rent scale has been an issue that's been on the books since the 13th Assembly and was carried over to the 14th Assembly. It's a very complicated one and I have spoken many times on this issue regarding my concerns over the harmonization policy. I have taken an opportunity to look at other jurisdictions and I was quite impressed with the Government of Nunavut. The Minister has taken the approach there that they have to find an appropriate solution to reflect their unique circumstances. I wanted today, for the record, to read out some of the improvements that are going to be implemented by the Government of Nunavut to deal with public housing.

One of the changes is to change their monthly assessment to yearly household income assessments. This allows tenants an adequate time to adjust their budget for rent impacts due to wage increases. The tenants are also allowed to continue to request rent reductions if their income falls during the course of the year. That income will also be assessed on net household income, not the current practice of gross income.

Income support clients will no longer be assessed a flat rate of $32. They will be assessed using the same formula as all other tenants. This change is in cooperation with the Department of Education, income support division, to ensure the method of assessment will not adversely affect other benefits income support clients receive.

Minimum and maximum rent has been modified to reflect community costs. They also allow for a deduction from the base rent to be introduced for the condition of the unit, for overcrowding and community-specific cost of living.

The seniors, the students and youth have been identified as having special needs and there will be a cap on the income assessment for youth up to the age of 25 years old who are not living in their own unit. This maximum assessment allows youth to contribute to the household rent while allowing them to save on their wages.

This change also addresses the disincentive to work issue that is targeted to seasonal employment as youth begin to participate in the workforce. Mr. Speaker, the students will continue to live rent free while at full-time attendance at school and the seniors in core need will also continue to live rent free.

Mr. Speaker, we also must work together to find an appropriate solution that meets our unique northern and Aboriginal circumstances of the Northwest Territories when it comes to housing our own residents. Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

Item 3, Member's statements. Item 4, returns to oral questions. The Minister of Health and Social Services, Mr. Miltenberger.

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, I have a return to oral question asked by Mr. Delorey on February 18, 2003, regarding the GNWT's share of medical travel co-payments.

During the 2001-2002 fiscal year, the department spent a total of $8,964,218 on medical travel.

In addition, a total of $1,635,050 was spent in medical travel co-payments. This included: $1,265,697 from federal non-insured health benefits; $186,068 from NWT extended health benefits; $22,008 from NWT Metis health benefits; $20,781 from indigent health benefits; and, $140,496 in payments made by individuals, many of whom would have been reimbursed by their employers or insurance companies.

In addition to these amounts under the medical travel assistance program, the Government of the Northwest Territories pays the total cost of medical travel for its employees, including those in casual employment. As reported in the 2001 public services annual report, this represented an expenditure of $1.93 million for the 2001 calendar year. Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

Item 4, returns to oral questions. Item 5, recognition of visitors in the gallery. Ms. Lee.

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, we have an entire class of students and staff in the gallery from Koinonia School and I would like to recognize them one by one. If I could ask each student to rise when their name is called: Lydia Rabesca; Layah Rabesca; Chris McIntosh; Nadia Wilson; Nathan Rabesca; Carl McIntosh; Liam Cameron; Dawn McIntosh; Devon Alooloo; Michael Fowler; Ariel Laycock; Joanne Matthews; and, staff Gordon Johnston and Ms. Morena Feenstra. Also, my constituency assistant is up there, Darren Campbell. Thank you.

---Applause

Welcome to the Legislature. Item 5, recognition of visitors in the gallery. Member for Hay River North, Mr. Delorey.

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, today I would like to recognize my constituency assistant Ms. Deb Pottle in the gallery. She's been over here working to help me out for a couple of weeks. Thanks for coming over and welcome to the Legislature.

Welcome to the Legislature. Item 5, recognition of visitors in the gallery. Item 6, oral questions. Mrs. Groenewegen.

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, during yesterday's question period, Minister Ootes answered a question asked by Mr. Bell and he stated that the graduated rent scale and cap on rent changes under the government's harmonization initiative would apply to all individuals. Mr. Speaker, this is not reconcilable with information that was received by Members through briefings and pamphlets. I would like to ask the Minister today if he could explain this apparent shift in policy. Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

Minister of Education, Culture and Employment.

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, it isn't a shift in policy. I inadvertently stated that the graduated rent scale used under the GNWT's harmonization initiative would apply to all individuals. In fact, Mr. Speaker, the cap and the grandfathering provisions apply only to seniors and students who are currently in the housing units. Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

Item 6, oral questions. Mr. Bell.

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. This question is also for the Minister of Education, Culture and Employment and stems from a response given to Mr. Dent in committee of the whole on student financial assistance accelerated remission rates. We understood that there was going to be accelerated remission for nursing and social work students. The staff at ECE have indicated that that's not the case but, curiously, they suggested that the remission on that will be the same as it is for student financial assistance students. If they are in large tax-based communities, it will be $1,000 for every three months and if they are in non-tax-based communities, it will be $2,000 for every three months. I wasn't aware that there was a difference in remission rates between tax-based and non-tax-based communities. Could the Minister clarify?

Minister of Education, Culture and Employment, Mr. Ootes.

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. The intent behind that is to ensure that we continue to attract individuals to the small communities, to the non-tax-based communities where there is a need for social workers and health workers, Mr. Speaker. Thank you.

Supplementary, Mr. Bell.

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. So it's just for health care professionals and social workers and nurses. It's not, for instance, if someone gets a physical education degree and takes those student loans, they are going to get a different rate of remission in a tax-based and non-tax-based community. Can the Minister clarify and confirm? Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

Minister of Education, Culture and Employment, Mr. Ootes.

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. That is correct, Mr. Speaker.

Item 6, oral questions. Member for Inuvik Boot Lake, Mr. Roland.

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, my question at this time will be directed to the Minister responsible for the NWT Power Corporation in line with my Member's statement. Mr. Speaker, we also accept the fact that the first 700 kilowatt hours of usage of power in a community is subsidized to the rate of Yellowknife and we are very thankful for that, otherwise there might not be very many people living further out of the capital. My question to the Minister is how long will this rate rider stay in effect, and why is it that it seems like we have saved money by going to the gas turbine engines, but we are still seeing increases. Thank you.

Minister responsible for the Power Corporation, Mr. Handley.

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, I think the estimate is that the rate rider will stay in effect until some time in June or July. Thank you.

Supplementary, Mr. Roland.

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Can the Minister inform us as to why there is the need for the rate rider when, by the information the Minister provided, we have actually seen some savings going to the gas turbine engines? Thank you.

Minister responsible for the Power Corporation, Mr. Handley.

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, the Inuvik rates are currently about 15 percent lower as a result of the gas turbines than they would be without the gas turbines, if they were still on diesel. That works out to about five cents per kilowatt lower. On July 1, 2001, the Public Utilities Board approved a rate increase that covered approximately 35 percent of the increase that was anticipated. Then on October 1, 2002, the PUB approved a shortfall rider - and that is the one the Member is referring to - that covers about 65 percent of the 2001-2002 shortfall. So the shortfall rider was there to distribute out the increase, so people wouldn't have a huge change in their rates when we had to pick up the balance between the 35 percent approved in 2001 and what the actual end result would be. Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

Supplementary, Mr. Roland.

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Can the Minister inform us as to why there is a shortfall in earnings if there seems to be a savings going to these gas turbines? Thank you.

Minister responsible for the Power Corporation, Mr. Handley.

Mr. Speaker, the savings on the gas turbine is not as great as are the increased costs in providing power. So there is still a shortfall in Inuvik as there is right across all of the Territories when we work out the cost of operating the Power Corporation and the cost of fuel and capital costs. Inuvik has those same costs. Every community has the shortfall rider because this goes right across the system. If we didn't have the savings from the gas turbines in Inuvik, instead of the energy rate being 38.13 cents, or whatever it is exactly, it would be about five cents per kilowatt hour higher than that. Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

Supplementary, Mr. Roland.

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, just before the Power Corporation changed over to the gas turbines, there was a great jump in power again because the territorial government got away from where it picked up its bunker C. It used to be out of Norman Wells and now it's out of Edmonton, I believe. That caused us to go to this area. The community has been paying a higher rate because of the capital replacement costs. When would those be done with so that we might actually see a drop or is there not going to be a drop and they are going to continue to grow and add on charges?

Minister responsible for the Power Corporation, Mr. Handley.

Mr. Speaker, I think eventually there will only be a substantial drop if the price of fuel goes down. I don't know how likely that is or if we are able to switch the whole system in the Power Corporation to gas-fired generators or, better yet, over to hydro. As long as we are relying on diesel fuel, we are always going to be subject to whatever the prices are. As well, the cost of operating the Power Corporation continues to be high as long as we are on diesel. The important point is, Mr. Speaker, that the territorial power support program does level this all out back to a Yellowknife rate. So even though we talk about a 38 cent per kilowatt rate, that's not what people are paying for the first 700 or first 1,000 kilowatts depending on their situation. Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

Item 6, oral questions. The Member for North Slave, Mr. Lafferty.

Minister of Health and Social Services, Mr. Miltenberger.

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, if there are specific circumstances like the Member has raised, I will be happy to get those details from him, to ensure we take the steps to assist all the NWT residents in renewing their health care cards and there should be forms available. If there isn't, we will make sure that they are made available. Thank you.

Supplementary, Mr. Lafferty.

Minister of Health and Social Services, Mr. Miltenberger.

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, if the deadline is missed, then people will have to reapply, but no one will be denied services if they are in need. The issue will be sorting out and making sure Northerners have appropriate health care cards. Thank you.

Supplementary, Mr. Lafferty.

Minister of Health and Social Services, Mr. Miltenberger.

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, every effort has been made through mail-outs to families, to ads in the paper regularly. We have modified things as we go because we know that it hasn't been a perfect process, so we have been trying to make every effort to notify everybody. Thank you.

Supplementary, Mr. Lafferty.

Minister of Health and Social Services, Mr. Miltenberger.

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, this is an administrative process and not an attempt to deny any Northerners legitimately due or necessary medical treatment. No one will be denied and no one will be sent a bill. If there is a problem with renewal of health care cards, we will work with the individuals to make sure they get the proper card and they are in the system as they should be. Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

Item 6, oral questions. The Member for Great Slave, Mr. Braden.

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. My question this morning is for the Premier. It's with regard to the success that we had in the past few weeks with Ottawa and with our sister territories on the heath care funding deal. Mr. Speaker, last Thursday, while the Premier was concluding those arrangements, the Deputy Premier, Mr. Antoine, made a statement in the House. I will quote from that statement: "That the Prime Minister has directed the Clerk to develop a process for addressing per capita funding inequities by April 1, 2003, and the fiscal challenges facing the territories generally by April 1, 2004." What I wanted to see is if the Premier could give us more explanation of the approach that we might be looking at, especially in terms of the idea of fixing the financial challenges that we face in general. How are we going about that? Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

Premier of the Northwest Territories, Mr. Kakfwi.

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, last week following my return to Yellowknife and to the legislature, the Secretary to Cabinet, Liz Snider, had the first face-to-face meeting with the Clerk of the Privy Council Alex Himelfarb in Ottawa and had the first discussion with the federal official at that time. There is an agreement that, by the end of March, we will know the details of the process that will be used to address the fiscal challenge that the North faces as acknowledged by the federal government and how that's going to be done. Keeping in mind that we have formula financing negotiations coming up, there's an agreement to meet again in about two weeks, on March 10th. They have confirmed the substance of the meeting that we had with the Prime Minister, because there were none of our officials present at that time, just political people; the first face-to-face was held to confirm what was discussed there. That the $60 million is, at this time, understood to be available over five years in the three territories but, the discussion is still open to possibly three years. It is a full amount but it could be topped off in the coming year pending the discussions that we are going to engage in. The Prime Minister has committed to being kept informed of the discussions and that we will be meeting again in the next two weeks. The Minster of Finance, Mr. Handley, is also engaging in the discussions because of the tie-in to formula financing negotiations. Thank you.

Supplementary. Mr. Braden.

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. I guess through this, can we anticipate or should we be anticipating a major restructuring of the financing deal that we now have with Ottawa? Thank you.

Mr. Premier, Mr. Kakfwi.

Mr. Speaker, we hope that many of the shortcomings that we have in the formula financing arrangements and the funding arrangements that caused difficulties with the federal government over the years will finally be addressed. As to whether or not we will be totally satisfied will remain to be seen. We are optimistic because the Prime Minister has personally made a commitment to initiate this process by asking the clerk of the Privy Council to lead discussions on it, and he has asked to be personally informed of the discussions that will lead to some changes. Thank you.

Supplementary, Mr. Braden.

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. You know, over the years at one time or another, certain aspects of this deal seem to come up and be problematic. The per capita issue is probably the most recent one. We've also dealt with what some people fondly or otherwise know as the perversity factor. We've had difficulties with Canada and the census numbers and there is kind of a litany of things that, at one point or another, collide. I'm wondering if the Premier would give us a sense of the top two or three issues that he sees that need to be addressed and resolved. Thank you.

Mr. Premier, Mr. Kakfwi.

Mr. Speaker, we have initially set out to show the priority that health funding has to this government and to the people of the Northwest Territories and I think that message has been received in a very clear, resounding way across this country and with the Government of Canada. This will continue to be highlighted in our discussions. It has also paved the way for the federal government to acknowledge that many of the programs that are provided to us on the per capita basis simply do not make any sense. Tying in with this, will be the nature of the formula financing arrangement. Many of the elements that constitute this basis of this agreement are really at a no win for us because we end up being penalized for initiatives and don't benefit as other Canadians do when programs are initiated and funds are made available across this country.

We know that an increase is going to become more important to us. As we push major development projects we must find some way before devolution finally happens and when devolution happens that there be a net fiscal benefit to this government when we are advancing development projects such as diamond mines, and oil and gas and pipelines. This government should never have to fiscally spread its resources so thin that it affects health services and the social network that is so badly needed in our communities. So those are the prevailing thoughts that we have as we look at the upcoming discussion. Thank you.

I would just like to remind the House that we have certain rules. In regards to the Members, when you direct your question, direct your question so that you are getting an answer. Also for the Ministers on the other side, if you can be specific answering the question, keep it short, brief as I have quite a few people on the list and I know we don't have much time. So I would just like to mention that we do have other Members out there who want to ask questions, so be brief, be specific and be to the point.

---Applause

Item 6, oral questions. Member for Hay River North, Mr. Delorey.

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, my question is for the Minister of Health and Social Services on the medevacs that we have in the Territories and some of the cost drivers that affect both the cost of medevacs and the effectiveness of them. One of the things we keep hearing about is closure of the airport, the municipal airport in Edmonton. I would like to know from the Minister if you could tell us, in light of the fact that 100 percent of our medevacs land at the municipal airport in Edmonton, would the Minister bring us up to date on the closure of the municipal airport in Edmonton. We keep hearing this issue come up that they are thinking about closing it down. What is the latest on that? Could the Minister inform us? Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

Minister of Health and Social Services, Mr. Miltenberger.

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, I understand the issue is still being discussed. We, along with other jurisdictions, use Edmonton for health reasons. I've made our case but it's a significant municipal issue and it has not yet been finally resolved as far as I know. Thank you.

Supplementary, Mr. Delorey.

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. What would be the effect in the Northwest Territories on our health and social services system, if the municipal airport was to close down in Edmonton, how bad an effect would it have on our medevacs here in the Territories? Can the Minister bring us up to date on that? Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

Minister of Health and Social Services, Mr. Miltenberger.

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, we would continue to have medevacs as required to Edmonton. The difference would be the location where the plane would land and the need for a longer travel time from where the medevac arrives in Edmonton to whichever hospital the patient is being medevaced to. Thank you.

Supplementary, Mr. Delorey.

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, I guess the issue with the airport closing down is the time that it would create on the other end for patients trying to get to the hospital. Does this government have any input with the Alberta government or the city of Edmonton in expressing our views as to how important that municipal airport is for us and our medevacs? Do we play any part in that at all in any consultation? Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

Minister of Health and Social Services, Mr. Miltenberger.

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, we are one of the stakeholders and users of the service. We have an agreement with the Capital Health Authority that we just signed. As well, we have an MOU between the Northwest Territories and the Alberta Government that covers a host of issues including transportation and health ones. So, we have a venue to make the case. We have articulated our concerns, and the City of Edmonton is dealing with it as a municipal issue. Thank you.

Final supplementary, Mr. Delorey.

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, medevacs from anywhere, I guess, don't come very cheap and especially from the North getting down to Alberta. I know, in looking at some of the documents on medevacs, that we also provide medevacs for Nunavut patients. I was wondering if the Minister could inform us what kind of arrangement we have with Nunavut, as far as medevacing patients from Nunavut? Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

Minister of Health and Social Services, Mr. Miltenberger.

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, the arrangement that we have with Nunavut is if there are patients here that require further, more specialized services than can be offered here, then the medical arrangements are made through Stanton and then we have a billing back arrangement with Nunavut that covers the costs.

Thank you. Item 6, oral questions. Member for Frame Lake, Mr. Dent.

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, my question today is for the Minister responsible for the Financial Management Board Secretariat. Yesterday, in committee of the whole I was asking the Minister about loan guarantees and he advised the House that the government had to make good on a $2.6 million loan guarantee, which apparently the parent company is going to pay back over a five to 10-year period without interest. Is there a reason that the section of government that deals with loan guarantees for emerging businesses is within the Executive and within the FMBS?

Minister responsible for the FMBS, Mr. Handley.

Mr. Speaker, I would have to check back in the previous government to find out exactly why it was put in the FMBS and why it wasn't instead put into the Business Credit Corporation, for example, who also have the authority to give loan guarantees. I expect, Mr. Speaker, that the reason was that we, as a government wanted to maintain hands-on on the loan guarantees. Also the amount of the loan guarantees could quickly use up the surplus positions or money the Business Credit Corporation would have available to it. So I expect those are the reasons, but I would have to check with the previous government to find out exactly why.

Supplementary, Mr. Dent.

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. I know the Business Credit Corporation has a cap of some $50 million and I don't believe it's very close to that $50 million right now. So would the Minister look into why this is being maintained and get back to this House as to whether or not there's a reason to shift the position of the loan guarantees?

Minister responsible for the FMBS, Mr. Handley.