Page 23, Municipal and Community Affairs, capital investment expenditures, community operations, not previously authorized, $624,000.

Regional operations, not previously authorized, $4.037 million.

Okay, page 23, lands administration, special warrants, $394,000.

Regional operations, not previously authorized, $4.037 million.

Municipal and Community Affairs, capital investment expenditures, total department, special warrants, $394,000.

Total department, not previously authorized, $4.661 million.

Page 24, Public Works and Services, capital investment expenditures, asset management, not previously authorized, $1.085 million. Mr. Ramsay.

Thank you, Mr. Chairman. I'm just wondering, again, I want to know why this amount, the $320,000 appears in the supplementary appropriation given the fact that it's public knowledge that now Public Works and Services has $320,000 earmarked to study office space in Inuvik and something about that just doesn't make sense to me how Public Works and Services could go out and put a number, suggest a number of $320,000, put it in a public document and then go out and issue a tender for completion of the work. To me it's saying we've got $320,000, why don't you just come and get it? It just doesn't make a lot of sense for me, nor do I believe that it takes $320,000 to complete the work that is suggested in here. That's insane that it's going to cost that much money to study office space in the town of Inuvik. I would even hazard a guess that Public Works and Services has a contractor already earmarked to complete the work and he or she has told them it's going to cost you $320,000, you'd better go out and get it because this is what it's going to cost. I'm just looking at this from the outside looking in and this is what I see, and I'd like if maybe the Minister could explain that to me. Why do we show our hand, why do we put this in a public document if we're going to go out and get this work done? Thank you.

Thank you, Mr. Ramsay. Mr. Roland.

Thank you, Mr. Chairman. Mr. Chairman, the simple facts are that the Department of Public Works can't go out there and request or go and on the sly get an amount from any contractor. The money is not there for approval to go out and spend that type of money. This is a result of the office building that the Department of Public Works, Department of Education, Culture and Employment, Transportation, Financial Management Board were in a building in Inuvik and safety concerns came up and we had to remove all personnel from the top three floors of that facility. The main floor is still being used by the Department of Public Services as a result of moving out the staff and all the materials within the upper floors of that facility. With this situation on hand -- and the landlord that we're dealing with is not moving at this time -- there has been discussions around the remediation that would be required. Structural engineers have looked at that facility both from our end as well as from the landlord's end, and there hasn't been a successful remediation plan put in place. So right now we have a number of departments in other spaces around the community. We've taken all available spaces, whether they're efficient or not for departments to use, because that's all that was available.

The community of Inuvik will only be growing and the demands for space will only be growing, as well, as we look at the issue of accommodating not only government, but the private sector within that community. The government has been hearing from departments for quite some time, whether it be Education, Culture and Employment where their main office is up there, or the Department of Health and Social Services, with their Public Works office and their location, income support and where their location is, we've had complaints in the past about adequate space, useable space. So dealing with the fact that we are now out of a space that we were occupying and the fact that we're going to have to look at some new office space, this had come to the forefront. The amount requested of $320,000 is not just for one contract. There would have to be a consultant hired to conduct planning and functional programming for the office space in Inuvik and that would involve a number of departments, as well as departments within the department. There would be some travel undertaken; there would be looking at existing land situations and once a suitable place was looked at, then we need the geotechnical work to be done. So the $320,000 wouldn't be just for a consultant. It is a request for the obvious, that we need to put a plan in place to deal with the office situation in Inuvik.

The situation we'd normally find if this was in our capital plan, for example, within Education or Health and Social Services when a project is approved, the first year of planning already has these dollars identified in it for planning and programming and a functional review. Because we don't have a capital plan in place and we need to come up with a plan that we'd have to bring forward and then put in, if there was acceptance, put it into the capital plan process. So that's why you see this one on its own, as normally it would be part of a capital plan process in your first year of expenditures. Thank you, Mr. Chairman.

Thank you, Mr. Roland. Mr. Ramsay.

Thank you, Mr. Chairman. Just a couple of other questions. I guess the first one, the obvious one, is why isn't the private sector involved in the procurement of office space? You know, if you do have office space requirements in Inuvik, why aren't you going out to the private sector to have an office building built? Why are you hiring a consultant to run out and do this work when you don't even know what you're doing?

The other thing I'd like the Minister to provide me with is a breakdown of what this $320,000 is going to be spent on, because I really am having trouble trying to understand why we would go out and do geotechnical work. Are we building an office building, or are we going to get somebody else to build an office building? Thank you, Mr. Chairman.

Thank you, Mr. Ramsay. Mr. Roland.

Thank you, Mr. Chairman. Mr. Chairman, as I stated, the money would be used for a number of areas. One is a consultant to conduct planning and functional programming. As well, we would have to, for the departments and travel for our own staff to talk with other departments that would be directly affected. As well, the surveying that would have to happen at a site, and geotechnical review. There are a number of locations of land that's owned within the community by the Government of the Northwest Territories. We have to see if they're in fact suitable sites to look at an office space.

The fact that we do have to get a plan together before we can go out to the private groups out there to see if they would be willing to enter into an arrangement where we'd see new office space, right now in fact the private sector is directly involved in the sense of accommodating the staff that were removed out of the Parry Building. For example, we've had a number of staff housed in the Mack Travel building; the Eskimo Inn; the Tuma Group Home, which was actually an owned facility that some of the staff are in; as well as the remaining left in the Parry Building itself. We cannot stay in this situation for much longer. As well, the Parry Building itself, if we have to move the Public Works staff out of there, then we would be in warehouses. That's probably the situation we'd have to go to.

The fact is, we have to get a plan together to be able to deal with whether we go out to the private sector for whether it's a lease-to-own or a leased facility, or we look at our own capital program. So there is going to be opportunity for the private sector once that decision is made. How many of our staff would we look at moving into a facility, or how many of the other landlords out there when we have agreements that are going to expire, lease agreements, those things have to be taken into consideration. So that's some of the things that we need to work on. Thank you, Mr. Chairman.

Thank you, Mr. Roland. Mr. Ramsay.

Thank you, Mr. Chairman. Again I didn't get a breakdown of what the $320,000 is going to be spent on. I'd like that. In addition to that, doesn't Public Works and Services, just as a matter of regular day-to-day business, keep track of, you know, the disposition of office space, future needs, how they're going to react? Like isn't some of this work already, or should have already been done? Isn't that somebody's job, to be looking after that type of issue? You know not just in Inuvik, but here in Yellowknife or Hay River or wherever the government leases office space, shouldn't somebody have a finger on what's going on? Again, I'm just, you know, shocked that we're going to spend $320,000 to find this information out. I don't think we've done enough homework and I don't think we're going out to the private sector, and I think the Minister and his department should look to the private sector to fill their office requirement needs. Thank you.

Thank you, Mr. Ramsay. Mr. Minister.