Thank you, Mr. Chairman. I am sure that our honourable colleague, Mr. Lewis, will be on our side when we build the bridge on the Mackenzie Highway.

(Microphone turned off)

---Laughter HON. JOHN TODD: We will also build the one to Edmonton. Mr. Chairman, with respect to the upgrading of the Dempster, as Mr. Koe has talked about, there is additional maintenance money into the maintenance of that highway and we are doing the best job possible given the resources we have. It is recognized as important and there is some additional maintenance money already allocated.

Regarding the Peel River crossing, there has been some work done looking at the possibility of a bridge there, but the initial engineering studies and consultants indicate that it is a $20 million exercise. That is a great deal of money, no matter how you look at it. We could probably go back to that issue, but with those kind of numbers, even though it is 15 or 20 per cent off, you are still talking about $10 million to $15 million. Again, the reality is we have $20 million to do all these projects and it makes it a little out of reach with respect to that particular issue.

Looking at the possibility of an alternative small airstrip at Arctic Red, particularly during breakup, no work has been done on that issue. I will undertake, if Mr. Koe wants me to, to review it and look at the possibility of costing out the difference between what it would cost for an airstrip and a bridge. I will undertake that right away. I am told by Mr. Gamble if we did have the capacity to put in a bridge to Arctic Red, it would also give us access to the Fort McPherson airport. That may be the kind of alternative we can look at.

However, for the Peel River crossing, we are looking at a huge chunk of change. I suggest to you at this time, given the limitations, that is unrealistic.

Thank you. Mr. Koe.

Thank you very much. I am sure the residents of the area would appreciate a cost-benefit analysis of a bridge versus an airport at Arctic Red.

I would also like to put another plug in for the development and construction of the Mackenzie Highway from Wrigley through to Inuvik and possibly through to Tuktoyaktuk. I know that is in the current transportation strategy and that there are many benefits for residents of the communities along the proposed highway. There will be benefits of employment, creation of employment, and the jobs that go with maintaining and constructing a highway. I think it would open up the tourism aspects and the oil and gas potential along that route. There is a great deal of exploration that has gone on and my feeling and knowledge is that there are many areas waiting to be developed once companies have access to less expensive transportation linkages. So, I think the benefits, once studies are done, would be quantifiable and a tremendous boost to the economy of the north.

I know there is a road to Inuvik that ties in with the winter roads, but if you had a loop like you have here in terms of the Simpson and Alberta linkage, you would probably see a huge increase in the numbers of vehicles and visitors which come to our area. I would just like to make those comments.

I would like to support the Minister in terms of maintenance contracts. We have to use local groups and contractors. We have to get away from the multi-million dollar contracts. We have to break them down or encourage local companies to join forces to enable them to bid and do the work required on some of these highways for construction or upgrading. The same with brushing, continually we need to keep the brush down on the sides of the roads. There are community groups that can do this work without a great deal of expense. If we are going to spend the money, I encourage the department to negotiate and continue the program of negotiating with local groups.

I do have a question in terms of highways. When the federal government announced their billion dollar highway initiative, the Dempster Highway was not included in their national highway system. How do highways get a national rating?

Thank you. Minister of Transportation, Mr. Todd.

I am not familiar with that issue, Mr. Koe. I would ask if Mr. Gamble could answer that question.

Mr. Gamble.

In establishing the national highway system, most of the highways were based on traffic. In the federal/provincial committee, we did manage to get the highway to Yellowknife included on the basis that it was a highway to a national capital. That was one of the criteria. None of the other highways in the Northwest Territories met the established criteria for traffic volume.

If I may, Mr. Koe, I also want to reassure you with respect to maintenance et cetera, the philosophy of the department is no different than the philosophy of Public Works. That is, we will look at the types of joint ventures and negotiated contracts which meet the fiscal needs of the department and the economic needs of the people in the area. I intend to monitor, very closely, the negotiated contracts to ensure that the net benefits are accrued to those who most need them. That is, the groups and the community groups which are put together. Yes, we will continue with that.

The intent of that would be to go on forever, that it would provide the kind of expertise and knowledge which would then make people more competitive and provide the opportunity for people to bid in a normal tender process. It would be on a project by project basis, but at some point it would have to bring about the skill and knowledge which would make those groups have more ability to tender and compete. We are currently looking at operations, for example, in Lutsel K'e, Lac La Martre, possibly in Fort Providence, et cetera. I want to ensure him that we will continue to approach that in his riding as well. Thank you.

Thank you. General comments. Mr. Koe.

I would like to thank the Minister for being direct and forthright. I encourage him to continue and to ensure that the issues I raised and the projects which have been raised by my colleagues get a high priority on his new transportation strategy.

Thank you. Mr. Minister, do we have your assurance?

Yes. Thank you.

Thank you. Line by line.

Agreed.

---Agreed

Directorate

Thank you. Page 09-8, directorate. This is the activity summary of the 1993-94 Main Estimates. Total O and M, $2.314 million. Agreed?

Agreed.

---Agreed

Transportation Engineering

Thank you. Transportation engineering. Total O and M, $3.098 million.

Agreed.

---Agreed

Marine Services

Thank you. Page 09-10, marine services. Total O and M, $4.019 million. Mr. Koe.

Thank you, Mr. Chairman. I have a question in terms of ferry operations. Who regulates the hours of operation of the ferries?

Mr. Minister.

Thank you, Mr. Chairman. The department regulates the hours of operation of the ferry.

Thank you. Mr. Koe.