This is page numbers 239 - 270 of the Hansard for the 12th Assembly, 6th Session. The original version can be accessed on the Legislative Assembly's website or by contacting the Legislative Assembly Library. The word of the day was information.

Topics

Item 20: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters
Item 20: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters

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Some Hon. Members

Agreed.

---Agreed

Item 20: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters
Item 20: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters

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The Chair

The Chair Tony Whitford

We have agreement. Clause 4. The chair recognizes Mr. Allooloo.

Item 20: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters
Item 20: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters

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Titus Allooloo Amittuq

Thank you, Mr. Chairman. As I said before, clause 4(2) says that, "If the provision of this act is inconsistent or in conflict with a provision of another act, the provision of this act prevails unless the other act expressly provides that it, or a provision of it, prevails notwithstanding this act."

My understanding is that if we have an act that conflicts with this act, then this act wins. Is my understanding correct?

Item 20: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters
Item 20: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters

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The Chair

The Chair Tony Whitford

Thank you, Mr. Allooloo. I shall direct that question to the Minister. Mr. Minister.

Item 20: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters
Item 20: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters

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Stephen Kakfwi

Stephen Kakfwi Sahtu

Thank you, Mr. Chairman. Mr. Mark Aitken will respond to that question.

Item 20: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters
Item 20: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters

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The Chair

The Chair Tony Whitford

Thank you, Mr. Minister. Mr. Aitken, please.

Item 20: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters
Item 20: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters

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Aitken

Thank you, Mr. Chairman. The Member is right. Once this particular subsection comes into force, which will be two years after the rest of the act comes into force, this act will prevail over any other act to the extent of any inconsistency between the two acts. However, it only prevails over other acts where there is, in fact, an inconsistency in the two acts. I would anticipate that many of those inconsistencies will, in fact, be dealt with by amendment in the period leading up to the coming into force of subsection 4.2.

Item 20: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters
Item 20: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters

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The Chair

The Chair Tony Whitford

Thank you. Mr. Allooloo.

Item 20: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters
Item 20: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters

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Titus Allooloo Amittuq

Thank you. I presume that we are talking about territorial statutes in this case. One of the acts we are so proud of is the Languages Act, where we are able to make an act that would be used by the public. If there are sections that conflict with this act, which we are so proud of as a people in the Northwest Territories, then would that act be struck down if it conflicts with this one?

Item 20: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters
Item 20: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters

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The Chair

The Chair Tony Whitford

Thank you, Mr. Allooloo. I shall direct that question to the Minister. Mr. Minister.

Item 20: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters
Item 20: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters

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Stephen Kakfwi

Stephen Kakfwi Sahtu

Yes, Mr. Aitken will answer.

Item 20: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters
Item 20: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters

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Aitken

Thank you, Mr. Chairman. If there is an inconsistency between the Official Languages Act and the Access to Information Act with respect to a certain provision, that provision would not be struck down. However, this provision would prevail in respect to that inconsistency and

only in respect to that inconsistency. Thank you, Mr. Chairman.

Item 20: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters
Item 20: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters

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The Chair

The Chair Tony Whitford

Thank you, Mr. Aitken. Mr. Allooloo.

Item 20: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters
Item 20: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters

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Titus Allooloo Amittuq

Thank you, Mr. Chairman. Then, when it prevails, that act or section of the act is no longer effective and that act would have to be amended. My understanding is that our Languages Act is protected by the Northwest Territories Act which ultimately cannot change in this Legislature alone. It would have to go to the federal government to get changed. With this bill, we don't have to go and ask the federal government for permission to make this kind of legislation. I understand they have a year to strike this kind of deal down if it conflicts with what they call a proper bill, I guess -- I don't know; whatever you call it. How could we make a section in our act that would be stronger than the legislation that is protected by our constitution?

Item 20: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters
Item 20: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters

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The Chair

The Chair Tony Whitford

Thank you, Mr. Allooloo. I will direct the question to the Minister.

Item 20: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters
Item 20: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters

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Stephen Kakfwi

Stephen Kakfwi Sahtu

Mr. Chairman, the point that Mr. Allooloo makes was addressed, I think, by Mr. Aitken, in that, only where there are conflicts does this act prevail. So, the Languages Act, itself, will continue to stand in its entirety. It is just that when the two acts don't mesh, this act will prevail. It gives you a few years to figure out, in the public interest, how to reconcile that.

Item 20: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters
Item 20: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters

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The Chair

The Chair Tony Whitford

Thank you, Mr. Minister. The chair recognizes Mr. Allooloo.

Item 20: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters
Item 20: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters

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Titus Allooloo Amittuq

Okay, I will put it in a little scenario. If the languages act allows me to get certain information from the government and this act doesn't allow me to get that same information, ultimately, this act would win. I would not get the information, right? Or, if I chose to use a certain official language, my understanding is that the working language of this government is English only, according to the government's response from one of their tabled documents. If I have the right to ask the government in my own language, in Inuktitut, which a certain act allows me, if this act doesn't allow me, then I don't get that information in my language. Is that correct?

Item 20: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters
Item 20: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters

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The Chair

The Chair Tony Whitford

Thank you, Mr. Allooloo. Minister Kakfwi.

Item 20: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters
Item 20: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters

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Stephen Kakfwi

Stephen Kakfwi Sahtu

Mr. Chairman, one of the amendments that was asked for -- I think their number 1 recommendation -- is one that we are going to address, and that basically will deal with making sure that, for instance, a deputy minister shall give access to a record in a particular official language as requested by an applicant and to make it available in that official language, and it is just qualified by saying that where the head of a public body or a deputy minister, for instance, considers it in the public interest to have that translation prepared. So, the amendment, when we get to clause 7, I think, will address that and it will even go beyond that to address, suggesting that no fee will be charged for the translation of that record. So, as I say, there is a clause that says, in a point raised by Mr. Patterson earlier, this act is intended to enhance and be an addition to existing procedures in place for accessing government information. It is not to restrict it.

Item 20: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters
Item 20: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters

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The Chair

The Chair Tony Whitford

Thank you, Mr. Kakfwi. The chair continues to recognize Mr. Allooloo.

Item 20: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters
Item 20: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters

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Titus Allooloo Amittuq

Mr. Chairman, my question is not being answered. Let's say that even after the amendments are made, this act prevails over any other act. If I have the right to ask for certain information in a different act, and this act doesn't allow me, then I will not be able to get it in the form that I requested because of this act, right? I am trying to make a point that in that way, my right as an individual that I enjoy today, if it conflicts with this act, then I will not be able to get that information any more. That's my understanding. So this act prevails over any other act that exists today unless the other act expressly provides that it or a portion of it prevails notwithstanding this act. So my understanding is that all the acts and statutes that we have don't make any reference to any part of this act because it's new, none of it.

Item 20: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters
Item 20: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters

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The Chair

The Chair Tony Whitford

Thank you, Mr. Allooloo. I shall pass this on to the Minister and see if we can get some answer to that. Mr. Minister.

Item 20: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters
Item 20: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters

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Stephen Kakfwi

Stephen Kakfwi Sahtu

Mr. Chairman, as I understand it, if a member of the public asks for a copy of Hansard in one of the Denendeh dialects right now, the Official Languages Act doesn't provide that it should be provided in that particular language. The Access to Information legislation, as we have it with the amendment that we are going to propose, will provide for that so I would suggest the Member is not going to see a restriction or a reduction in the level of access that he thinks the Official Languages Act gives. The Official Languages Act gives access right now, but it doesn't greatly enhance it. The amendment we're proposing says if you ask for it and it's available as a public record, then it can be provided in an official language in a form that is useable for the applicant.

Item 20: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters
Item 20: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters

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The Chair

The Chair Tony Whitford

Thank you, Mr. Minister. Mr. Minister.