Thank you. Grants and contributions. Mr. Steen.
Debates of May 21st, 1996
Topics
Committee Motion 7-13(3): Priority Hospital Facilities In Inuvik And Iqaluit, Carried
Item 19: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters
Page 528
The Chair John Ningark
Committee Motion 7-13(3): Priority Hospital Facilities In Inuvik And Iqaluit, Carried
Item 19: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters
Page 528
Vince Steen Nunakput
Mr. Chairman, I hope this is my last question. Could the Minister indicate to me whether this government has a policy that would forbid profit off of health and social services facilities, grants or operations of any kind? Do we have a policy in place that would forbid us to allow people to make a profit off of the problems of others?
Committee Motion 7-13(3): Priority Hospital Facilities In Inuvik And Iqaluit, Carried
Item 19: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters
Page 528
The Chair John Ningark
Thank you. Mr. Minister.
Committee Motion 7-13(3): Priority Hospital Facilities In Inuvik And Iqaluit, Carried
Item 19: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters
Page 528
Kelvin Ng Kitikmeot
Thank you, Mr. Chairman. No, we don't, Mr. Chairman. Thank you.
Committee Motion 7-13(3): Priority Hospital Facilities In Inuvik And Iqaluit, Carried
Item 19: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters
Page 528
The Chair John Ningark
Thank you. To the same area, Mrs. Groenewegen.
Committee Motion 7-13(3): Priority Hospital Facilities In Inuvik And Iqaluit, Carried
Item 19: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters
Page 528
Jane Groenewegen Hay River
Thank you, Mr. Chairman. This area that Mr. Steen has raised is one where there seems to be some controversy or misunderstanding. If Trail Cross is privatized, then it's operated by a private contractor an
what they are compensated for running that contract in that facility; people are calling it profit but it is, in fact, what they're being paid to do. When a government worker goes to work and collects their pay cheque every two weeks, that's their pay cheque, that's what they get paid for doing that; it's not a charitable organization where the government runs it. People get paid to run it. When it's a private contractor, the contractor gets paid, the staff get paid and they cover their overhead.
There are private contractors and then there are charitable, non-profit organizations. The hospital in Hay River was run by a charitable, non-profit organization on a contract basis but sometimes people get those all mixed in together. The Minister can clarify this, but I think that when a health or a social service facility is operated by a private contractor, it might be wrong to say profit. They may be remunerated for providing that service as a private individual as opposed to the government paying people in the public service to do the same thing.
Committee Motion 7-13(3): Priority Hospital Facilities In Inuvik And Iqaluit, Carried
Item 19: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters
Page 528
The Chair John Ningark
Thank you. Mr. Minister, do you agree?
Committee Motion 7-13(3): Priority Hospital Facilities In Inuvik And Iqaluit, Carried
Item 19: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters
Page 528
Kelvin Ng Kitikmeot
Thank you, Mr. Chairman. Generally, yes, because it would be no different than physicians having a contract or being paid a per them for seeing so many clients; there's a return for their time in there, as well, in that type of a situation; so it depends on how you look at the profit, the return or whatever you want to call it. Thank you, Mr. Chairman.
Committee Motion 7-13(3): Priority Hospital Facilities In Inuvik And Iqaluit, Carried
Item 19: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters
Page 528
The Chair John Ningark
Thank you. On the grants and contributions. Mrs. Groenewegen.
Committee Motion 7-13(3): Priority Hospital Facilities In Inuvik And Iqaluit, Carried
Item 19: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters
Page 528
Jane Groenewegen Hay River
Thank you, Mr. Chairman. The Minister has just raised a perfect example of it where you have a salaried doctor who works for the government; they get paid to provide their services. Then you may also have
a fee-for-service doctor who runs their practice as a business. You could say that is for profit but it's just a different method of payroll. Thank you.
Committee Motion 7-13(3): Priority Hospital Facilities In Inuvik And Iqaluit, Carried
Item 19: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters
Page 528
The Chair John Ningark
Thank you. I believe that Mr. Steen is well informed of what is a profit or non-profit organization. If you'll move back to 11.21. Thank you. Total department is $5.892 million. Agreed?
Committee Motion 7-13(3): Priority Hospital Facilities In Inuvik And Iqaluit, Carried
Item 19: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters
Page 528
Some Hon. Members
Agreed.
--- Agreed
Committee Motion 7-13(3): Priority Hospital Facilities In Inuvik And Iqaluit, Carried
Item 19: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters
Page 528
The Chair John Ningark
Thank you. Back to summary. Program summary, health and social services, on page 11-9, operations and maintenance, total operations and maintenance, $234.727 million. Agreed?
Committee Motion 7-13(3): Priority Hospital Facilities In Inuvik And Iqaluit, Carried
Item 19: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters
Page 528
Some Hon. Members
Agreed.
--- Agreed
Committee Motion 7-13(3): Priority Hospital Facilities In Inuvik And Iqaluit, Carried
Item 19: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters
Page 528
The Chair John Ningark
Thank you. Capital, total capital, $13.631 million. Agreed?
Committee Motion 7-13(3): Priority Hospital Facilities In Inuvik And Iqaluit, Carried
Item 19: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters
Page 528
Some Hon. Members
Agreed.
--- Agreed
Committee Motion 7-13(3): Priority Hospital Facilities In Inuvik And Iqaluit, Carried
Item 19: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters
Page 528
The Chair John Ningark
Thank you. Total expenditures for this activity is $248.358 million. Agreed?
Committee Motion 7-13(3): Priority Hospital Facilities In Inuvik And Iqaluit, Carried
Item 19: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters
Page 528
Some Hon. Members
Agreed.
--- Agreed
Committee Motion 7-13(3): Priority Hospital Facilities In Inuvik And Iqaluit, Carried
Item 19: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters
Page 528
The Chair John Ningark
Does the committee agree that consideration of the Department of Health and Social Services is concluded?
Committee Motion 7-13(3): Priority Hospital Facilities In Inuvik And Iqaluit, Carried
Item 19: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters
Page 528
Some Hon. Members
Agreed.
--- Agreed
Committee Motion 7-13(3): Priority Hospital Facilities In Inuvik And Iqaluit, Carried
Item 19: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters
Page 528
The Chair John Ningark
Thank you. On behalf of the committee, I would like to thank the honourable Minister and the witnesses for appearing before the committee.
What is the wish of the committee? Mr. Krutko.
Committee Motion 7-13(3): Priority Hospital Facilities In Inuvik And Iqaluit, Carried
Item 19: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters
Page 528
Committee Motion 7-13(3): Priority Hospital Facilities In Inuvik And Iqaluit, Carried
Item 19: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters
Page 528
The Chair John Ningark
Thank you. There is a motion on the floor to report progress. We will wait until the witnesses leave the table. There is a motion on the floor to report progress which is not debatable. All those in favour of the motion? All those opposed? The motion is defeated.
--- Defeated
In line with the announcement made by the Speaker last week regarding the hour, I will recognize the clock at 6:00 p.m. We'll come back at 6:30 p.m. Thank you.
--- DINNER RECESS
Department Of Finance
Committee Motion 7-13(3): Priority Hospital Facilities In Inuvik And Iqaluit, Carried
Item 19: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters
Page 529
The Chair John Ningark
I would like to call the committee back to order. We are considering the Department of Finance. Mr. Todd, do you have any opening remarks?
Minister's Introductory Remarks
Committee Motion 7-13(3): Priority Hospital Facilities In Inuvik And Iqaluit, Carried
Item 19: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters
Page 529
John Todd
Mr. Chairman, I am pleased to present the 1996-97 budget for the Department of Finance.
For 1996-97, the department is requesting an expenditure budget of $10.171 million and a revenue budget of $984,701. The department has no capital funding.
Expenditure Budget
Salaries and wages make up 25 per cent of the budget of the Department of Finance. Together, the expenditures for salaries, wages and associated other O and M are 5.9 per cent lower than they were in 1995-96.
Three areas of uncontrollable other O and M expenditures, all within the treasury division, make up over 65 per cent of total departmental expenditures.
First, borrowing costs are estimated to be $3.25 million based on the projected $40 million operating deficit in 1996-97. In previous years, these costs were authorized through supplementary appropriations, which means that the full 1996-97 borrowing cost of $3.25 million is an increase over the 1995-96 main estimates.
Third, the budget includes the interest costs of $1.313 million for Northwest Territories Power Corporation bonds. Each year, this cost is reduced as the outstanding debt decreases. The 1996-97 interest cost is $588,000 less than in 1995-96.
Revenue Budget
The revenue budgeted in the Department of Finance represents 84.3 per cent of total government revenues. The largest component of this revenue is the grant from Canada which is forecast to decrease by $66.6 million in 1996-97. The majority of this decrease results from the five per cent cut to the gross expenditure base imposed by the federal government.
An increase in revenues as a result of the 10 per cent increase to the education tax rate that applies to tax-based municipalities and the 10 per cent increase to the property and education tax rates that apply to the general taxation
area. This is only the third increase to the property and education tax since it was implemented in 1967. The annual increase for an average single family home will be less than $30 per year.
1996-97 Outlook
The fiscal year 1996-97 will offer a number of significant challenges to the Department of Finance.
The department will be aggressively examining all tax and investment policy options to determine the best manner to encourage investment and business growth in the Northwest Territories.
Outstanding taxes and penalties will need to be pursued, to ensure that all sectors are supporting the government.
The department will provide statistics and analysis in support of formula funding negotiations and for government initiatives such as division of the Northwest Territories and community empowerment. Thank you, Mr. Chairman.