The Standing Committee on Governance and Economic Development recommends that the government introduce legislation requiring a minimum notification period of one year when the government is planning to reduce funding targeted for specific communities.

The committee also observed that well managed communities might be penalized for good administration. Less well managed communities are given extraordinary funding to balance their budget. Extraordinary funding in these cases does not encourage good municipal management. However communities that live within their means are not given any additional funding. Committee members encouraged the Minister to work with communities to standardize community financing to ensure that the funding process is clear and equitable for all municipal governments. The Minister agreed. The committee understands the review is underway and looks forward to reviewing the report in the fall.

Committee members pointed out that although operational expenditures for non-tax-based communities increased marginally, this proposed increase is more than offset by substantial decreases in proposed capital funding. In addition, as funding continues to be reduced to communities, the community's ability to deliver essential programs and services as well as operate its facilities effectively and safely may be compromised. The committee holds the position that public health should be the top priority in any funding changes or transfers of infrastructure, program or service. In concurrence with recent observations by the Auditor General, a third party accountability framework should also be adopted. This framework will ensure that communities continue to deliver high standards of programs and services, while ensuring economic, effective and efficient community spending.

Self Government

Committee members pointed out to the Minister that while the department has increased funding and its level of participation at self-government talks, reductions in the department's overall capital and operational expenditures are projected to decline. Funding for the department's self-government participation may be better spent on infrastructure or other essential programs or services.

The committee noted that the structure of communities will likely change with the conclusion of self-government talks and reiterated the importance of having an effective third party accountability framework in place. The Minister agreed with the committee and stated that a legislative proposal scheduled for introduction in the fall of 2000 will address this concern. This concludes the committee's report, Mr. Chairman.

Thank you, Ms. Lee. At this time, I would like to ask the Minister if he would like to bring in any witnesses.

Does the committee agree?

Can the Sergeant-at-Arms escort the witnesses in? Mr. Minister, for the record, can you introduce your witnesses?

Thank you, Mr. Minister. Welcome, witnesses. General comments? Mr. Roland.

Thank you, Mr. Chairman. Mr. Chairman, some of the biggest changes the government has gone through, especially dealing with communities, have been through the Department of Municipal and Community Affairs. We continue to see some of the changes during review of the business plan and main estimates, and with the Minister and his staff in committee. There were a number of issues raised of concern. One was around the reductions to communities in the Northwest Territories. This is one of the few departments that deal directly with the communities and community infrastructure.

We have seen the putting off of more capital again to communities, as well as reductions to block funding, that primarily impacts tax-based municipalities. Myself, coming from a community that is tax-based, I have concerns with that, because I have seen over the years the continuing rise of costs of services all in the name of efficiency, as government has put it. For example, I was on the town council when this department forced the hand of the town council by installing water meters. Over the years, we have seen the impact of water meters being installed. Most of the communities have gone on to save a lot of water, and we have found the reserve fund for the utilidor in Inuvik dropping well below what was stated it was supposed to get on a yearly basis. The amount set out initially was $750,000 that was to be put into this CRFF fund, but it is a replacement fund for the utilidor system. After the water meters were installed, it went down to $250,000 because so many people had cut back on their water usage. Because of that, increases had to come and people went from a flat fee of $55 to in some cases well over $100.

As the community talks about taking over the system, there is talk about rates and are they stabilized, or will they go up once more? So the news of a 4.73 percent reduction did not come as good news to the committee during the interim appropriation. Once again, the Minister informed us that he had to bring it forward this time because he was given targets to meet, and that is the way they chose to meet them. No matter what area you would go into, it would impact the communities. I guess I would like to raise with the Minister and his staff the ongoing changes. We know, for example, the formula funding situation of how they fund the communities, whether it be in the water and sewer program or other transfers. We know there is some ongoing work. They were supposed to meet with tax-based municipalities during this month. I would like to know from the Minister, has that been going on and how far along are they in that process? Thank you.

The Minister responsible for the Department of Municipal and Community Affairs, Mr. Antoine.

Mr. Roland.

Thank you, Mr. Chairman. The point the Minister brings up is a good one, the timing of funding to tax-based communities. Most communities go on a calendar year when it comes to setting budgets. We go on a fiscal year. They do not meet. Communities have already, because it is summer, had things in place, projects ready to go. Hopefully, in your review, you will look at bringing those two together, and allowing the timing of the budgets to be together or building in allowances. With that, as well, we have a committee motion regarding the notification and timing of any further reductions or changes to specific communities. It is good to hear that the...inaudible...is going on, but we would like to make sure that this thing moves along and moves along quickly. I know the Minister offered to provide the committee with the binder on what the formula is like and he told us that it is quite a large binder. We thanked him for not providing it to the committee, because as we hear it, it is very convoluted. My work in the past, when it comes to water meters, is that it is a yardstick of efficiency. That term was used a number of years ago. I think we all would have a definition of that yardstick of efficiency, Mr. Chairman.

I look forward to further work with the Minister and his staff in this area. I raise the concerns of the committee that in fact we would like to stem the tide in a sense of more reductions to communities and community infrastructure. Finding out that everything is just getting old in all communities in the Northwest Territories, we are going to find ourselves in a real crunch here when it comes to replacing major infrastructure in the communities. Thank you.

Mr. Minister.

Mr. Miltenberger.

Thank you, Mr. Chairman. Mr. Chairman, I would like to start my comments with a question on the issue of accountability. It is a question I have asked both the Minister of Resources, Wildlife and Economic Development and the Minister of Education, Culture and Employment in relation to the statement made in this House by the Premier that there is no clear measurable way to make government Ministers and deputy ministers accountable for not meeting targets.

The Minister is here with the staff with a $58 million budget. I would like the Minister to speak to the issue of accountability as he sits here in the Legislature with a request for that amount of public money and his thoughts on his accountability, and the accountability of his staff in terms of meeting the commitments that they have outlined for us in this budget. Thank you.

Mr. Minister.

Mr. Miltenberger.

Thank you, Mr. Chairman. It is good to hear the Minister say we have the need to work with communities, municipalities, SAOs, and such, but that as a Minister sitting in this House at present that he is ultimately accountable for this budget and the goals and objectives with it. That makes three Ministers so far. It is reassuring that there does seem to be the accountability factor taken care of.

Mr. Chairman, I want to make some comments that are going to highlight some of the issues I would like to address. I intend to save the specific questions until we get to the activity section.

Mr. Chairman, I will have some questions for the Minister on the issue of the water and sewer subsidy, which I understand or I would like clarification on how it is tied into the block funding formula. The previous Minister of the Department of Municipal and Community Affairs told the community when they raised the issue of the water and sewer subsidy that they should address it through the block funding negotiations. Fort Smith is the only community in the Northwest Territories that does not receive any type of subsidy.

I would like to question the Minister on the issue of landfill sites and the situation in Fort Smith, which I see as an indicator of issues that all municipalities, hamlets, settlements are going to have to deal with in terms of the environment and requirements to maintain certain standards in landfill sites. There is a significant cost to that. I know in Fort Smith the town council is taking steps to add $15 a month levy on people's water and sewer bills in addition to some of the money that the Department of Municipal and Community Affairs donated. It is an issue I want to ask the Minister about and the relationship with the Department of Resources Wildlife and Economic Development. Is this a piecemeal approach or is there a strategy there, so it is a coordinated effort?

I also want to raise the issue that came up in this House earlier during the Arctic Winter Games, and the need for an objective, comprehensive review of the Arctic Winter Games, and the impact they have had over the years. In my opinion, they have a negative impact on community sport and recreation. I think there has been a tremendous lowering of the amount of community sport and recreation and an extensive focus on the Arctic Winter Games where, out of 40,000 people, a couple of hundred athletes go but where a huge amount of our budget is focused and we pay the price.

I am also interested to hear from the Minister if he could provide a bit of elaboration, at the appropriate time, on the changes he made reference to in his statement with regard to the legislative changes he indicated were well overdue and it would improve flexibility, accountability, and responsibility for the municipalities. I think, as a former mayor and councillor, I have a definite interest there. Once again, at the appropriate time, I will be asking the Minister for some specific indications as to the kind of changes that are being anticipated.

Finally, Mr. Chairman, I would ask the Minister in the communities that are tax-based, like in the community that I represent, Fort Smith, they are anticipating some major water and sewer replacement, given the fact that the system they currently operate has considerable sections that are dating back almost 50 years now, underground systems, old asbestos pipes that are breaking, sagging, are plugged up, roots growing through them. There will be a major cost. I would like to get an update, once again at the appropriate time, from the Minister as to how that would be dealt with. It also, of course, ties into the road surface above because in Fort Smith, the roads are paved. Therefore, you will have to rip up all the pavement and replace it. That is a major undertaking. I understand most communities that have underground services are dealing with that, Yellowknife, Fort Simpson, Hay River.

I thank the Minister, once again, for his comments on accountability. I will leave those comments as opening comments and will proceed with questions at the appropriate time. Thank you, Mr. Chairman.

Thank you. Mr. Minister, do you want to respond to his comments?

Thank you. Ms. Lee.