Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, I would like to speak in favour of this motion. Mr. Speaker, first of all, I would like to congratulate and commend the Minister of Health and Social Services for bringing this legislation onto the floor in the relatively short time period that he has been in that office. I know this has not been easy for him and I know that it has taken strength and courage for him to go against probably some of his closest colleagues to do this. I support the Minister. I really would like to commend him for that.

Mr. Speaker, I know a lot of reasoning here has been that if we do not do this, we are going to be sued, or something like that, so that we are not working of our own volition, but we are being forced to do this.

Mr. Speaker, I would like to say that I am supporting this motion because this is the right thing to do. This is a principled thing to do. Mr. Speaker, I believe that under the Charter and Constitution, there are a lot of sections there that give us rights as a Canadian citizen that we value. One of them is equality, under section 15, which says that we are to be free from discrimination based on any immutable characteristics. We are to be free from any discrimination that is the result of immutable characteristics. Immutable meaning things that we cannot change, such as our race, our skin colour, our hair colour, our eye colour, where we are from and where we were born. Those are things that we cannot change. That is just the way they are and we should be respected for who we are and where we are and we should be entitled to the same rights that the neighbour next door or the person sitting next to me.

Mr. Speaker, also under section 7, I believe, we have the right to life, liberty and security. We have the right to not be scared about who we are, that we are not going to go out the door and that somebody will attack me for my hair colour or my eye colour or who I am as a person.

Mr. Speaker, I believe that every right that we have as a Canadian citizen and a resident of this country that are protected in the law are very fragile. They are there and they have to be protected. They are not to be trampled with because it is not convenient or it does not make sense to us or whatever.

I value my rights and I value my right to be protected under the law. There is also the section in the Charter that allows us to be entitled to equal protection under the law.

I know that as much as every right in that law is important to me, it is important that I make that available and do everything that I can as a legislator to protect that for every citizen in this Territory. It is not because I think I am going to be sued and go to jail. I think it is because the rights are there because we all spoke as citizens, we made our politicians or judges. We have our opinions known about it and these other things that we value. We value equal rights, equality. We value the right to be secure from threats and being treated like we are second-class citizens.

The minute you say that one group of you can do this but another group of you cannot, that is inequality. You have to always make sure that no identifiable group in our society is subject to that sort of discrimination.

Mr. Speaker, I do not believe the law exists in a vacuum. Law is not just lawyers making up these things. Law is not just a bunch of interest groups lobbying the judges. The law is for all of us there. It is a decision about what is important to us.

Mr. Speaker, I happen to know that in every group that I met, chances are the person sitting next to me, on the left or on the right, are homosexual, gay or lesbian. I think it is dangerous to say that it is them over there. They have different values. It is a lifestyle. It is a religious thing. I happen to know that this is something that is an immutable characteristic. I know that my friends' kids, they have...I do not even want to go there.

All I know is that I am here as a legislator. This is not about values. This is not about religion. This is not about anything but to stand up as a legislator to say that we value the supreme law of this land, that we all have certain rights that we have to protect and that we are entitled to, that people have gone to foreign lands and fought and gave their lives to protect the rights that we have under the Constitution and Charter, that every citizen has the right to be treated equally under the law, that every citizen has the right to be free from threats, or made to feel like they are somehow an isolated group that are not the same as the rest of us. We just will not tolerate that. Anytime there is any sort of inkling of that, I think it is the responsibility of legislators and the like-minded people to speak up and say that is wrong.

For that reason, Mr. Speaker, once again, I would like to say that I commend the government and the Minister for bringing this forward, and that I will vote in favour of this motion. Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

Thank you, Ms. Lee. To the principle of the bill. The honourable Member for North Slave, Mr. Lafferty.

Thank you, Mr. Lafferty. To the principle of the bill. The honourable Member for Tu Nedhe, Mr. Nitah.

Thank you, Mr. Nitah. To the principle of the bill. The honourable Member for Yellowknife South, Mr. Bell.

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. I stand here today in support of this bill. For me, I guess it is pretty cut and dry, Mr. Speaker. As Mr. Dent and Mr. Braden have indicated, clearly we can change our legislation or we can go to court, spend a couple hundred thousand dollars and be forced to change our legislation by the courts. I personally would rather see us spend the money on the programs and services, Mr. Speaker.

I have heard some comments here today made by my colleagues. I think we have to be practical in what we are talking about here. This may seem funny, but I do not think if we ignore same-sex couples or we decide we are going to discriminate against them, they are all of a sudden going to throw their hands up and say "You know, this is just too much work and too much effort. Forget it, we are going to go on to heterosexual relationships." I do not believe that kind of thing happens, Mr. Speaker. I think it would be silly to think that would be the case.

We talk about the best interests of the child. The fact remains this child lives with parents who are of the same sex. If there is ridicule and teasing on the playground, that exists whether or not we allow both of them to legally adopt or one to legally adopt.

There certainly are concerns for those parents and that child when only one is the legal guardian. For instance, if the child goes for medical attention and it is something that needs permission of the legal guardian, if the one legal guardian is not available, there could possibly be delays. The child may have a hard time travelling outside of our country's borders and may not be able to do so without their legal guardian in tow.

Well, there has been a lot of discussion about morality here today, Mr. Speaker, and I really do not think that is where we need to focus our attention on. I think we need to focus our attention on the legality of what we are doing here today. I am interested to see what kind of things the public has to suggest when we have our public hearing and I look forward to that. Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

-- Applause

Thank you, Mr. Bell. To the principle of the bill. The honourable Member for Hay River South, Mrs. Groenewegen.

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Quite a few of the points that I would have made have already been made by my colleagues, but I just wanted to be on the record today to stand and say that I cannot support this bill. I could not even support it if I went back to my constituency and every single one of them told me they wanted me to support it, because for me, this begins to encroach on something which is my own personal belief and my own personal commitment.

I mean, we do a lot of things in politics in terms of representing the interests of our constituents, but there are sometimes things which arise which we -- it is just a line we cannot go over. It is a line we cannot cross because of our own personal convictions.

I want to say that I do not hold any ill will towards the people who make choices different than mine, but I am held to a standard for what I believe in. If I do not respect that, if I do not stand for that, I do not stand for anything. This is probably more of a personal issue to me.

In this Territory, we stand to pray in this Legislature. We pray in our committee meetings. We pray to the Creator. I believe that the relationship that holds life between a man and a woman, that creates life, is a mystery. It is a beautiful thing. I think that as legislators, to enact laws that would contradict that shows disrespect to the Creator. Life continues on the basis of the way things were created. I believe it is a beautiful thing. I cannot personally be involved in an action I perceive to make a mockery of that or to show disrespect for that.

I cannot support the bill. Like I said, people make choices based on their own view of the world and how they see things. I want to emphasize that I do not hold these people in ill regard. I do not doubt that they love their children. I do not doubt that they are good caregivers. I recognize people make different choices in life, but this is a personal issue for me. I cannot support this bill. Thank you.

Thank you, Mrs. Groenewegen. To the principle of the bill. The honourable Member for Deh Cho, Mr. McLeod.

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, this is a very difficult issue to discuss. It surprisingly is an issue where a question was asked of me immediately after getting elected. A constituent came up to me and asked me my position on it, same-sex couples. I realized then that it was not something I knew a whole lot about, so I have spent a lot of time listening and trying to develop an opinion on this issue. It has been on the table. It has been in our committees for quite some time now. I have heard arguments for and against. I have heard even today, as the Minister presented the bill, he spoke of statutes and laws and constitutional rights that were violated.

We also heard some of my colleagues here say that if we do not pass this, we will be challenged in court. We also heard other arguments that this bill is not necessary. It is against religious beliefs. We hear a lot being spoke here today about rights.

What really bothers me is that we have a number of aboriginal governments out there. We have said many times that we will operate government to government to government. Yet on this issue, an issue that affects everybody in the North, there is no consultation. What does that say about the people of the Beaufort-Delta who have worked hard for self-government? To the Dogrib Nation? To the Sahtu? I cannot believe we are proceeding to this point without a process for them to get involved.

The Deh Cho is now in the negotiating process. They are working hard to be recognized as a primary government, yet we do not have the courtesy to extend an invitation to them. I am appalled that this Minister did not go to any of the communities in the North to discuss this.

To pass this bill, to support any bill, in my opinion, without proper consultation with aboriginal governments, without the aboriginal government's involvement is a slap in the face to them. Putting an ad in the newspaper is not adequate consultation. I have said it before in terms of resource development in community projects and I will say it again. It is not acceptable to me.

I realize that should this bill go forward and get the majority of the votes here today, it will go to committee and there will be a hearing. That hearing will be here in Yellowknife and not in any of my communities and not in any other aboriginal communities of the North, that is for sure.

Mr. Speaker, we talk about rights, yet my colleagues on the other side of this room, I do not believe they will have a free vote. I do not believe they will be able to stand up to speak their true feelings on this issue, feelings that their constituents are expecting them to defend.

I have to request that the Premier allow his Cabinet to have a free vote on this. I would also like to request that this vote be recorded.

Mr. Speaker, I am not against this bill totally in principle, but rather on process. I will not support this bill as it stands. Thank you.

-- Applause

Thank you, Mr. McLeod. To the principle of the bill. The honourable Member for Nunakput, Mr. Steen.

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, my name is already on as the seconder of the bill, so it is not a question of whether I support it or not. I would like to speak to the principle of the bill. The principle of the bill is not whether somebody has the right to adopt. The principle of the bill is whether they have equal rights. There used to be a question of whether I as an aboriginal had an equal right as a non-aboriginal. It is not a question anymore. The Charter of Rights says we all have...

Mr. Steen, may I just interrupt for a moment and ask a member of the audience not to lean on the glass? Thank you.

Mr. Speaker, there is a question from some Members as to whether we did proper consultation as a government. I wonder whether this is the type of bill that you would really consider taking to aboriginal groups for consideration before second reading, because it is something that is almost compelled to us by the Charter of Rights. We really have no option but to put this forward, as some Members have said.

However, we should keep in mind that as aboriginals, we do have people representing us. I am not the speaker for the Inuvialuit. I have people who speak for my group. They will have the opportunity through the consultation process that is to follow through the standing committee to make their views known as to whether the Inuvialuit really support this concept of adoption by same-sex couples.

I know that in my land claims, there is a clause there that says this government cannot make a law of this nature without consultation with us. So I expect that there is going to be consultation. I also know that in the existing Adoption Act, there are requirements that people who are involved in the authorities of adoption take into consideration the ethnic origin of the child when adoption is being requested or being put forward.

I presume that my groups will make it known whether or not they think that aboriginals such as us should be adopted by same-sex couples, or our children from us. I assume my aboriginal group will put their position known on this. I do know that in the legislation that governs adoption, like the Member for North Slave says, the best interest of the child is taken into consideration. If the best interest of the child is to be taken into consideration, I would hope that this type of legislation would state whether or not the ethnic origin of the child would have to be taken into consideration when same-sex couple adoption is being considered. I think that type of legislation would allow for this thing to proceed without interfering with anybody's rights under the Charter.

I am not a lawyer, the same as my colleague from North Slave said, but on the other hand, I believe there are ways to compromise around this and still allow people their rights under the Charter. I am not being forced by anyone to support this thing. I think people have to realize we live in Canada and we have a law that we have to abide by. Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

-- Applause

Thank you, Mr. Steen. To the principle of the bill. The honourable Member for Yellowknife Centre, Mr. Ootes.

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, the issue of property rights for same-sex couples was an issue during the 13th Legislative Assembly and it was discussed at that time at length, and there was a great deal of opposition. There was a motion in this House to support that move and it was defeated at that time, Mr. Speaker.

Today we have heard a lot of references to the Charter of Rights and legal opinions, and I think it comes down to a question of what is the right thing and what is the wrong thing to do? It is my belief that we have a responsibility here to address this issue, to make some decisions and to move forward. I feel we should act now and it is incumbent upon us to move this along. It is cut and dry to me. When it occurred in the 13th Legislative Assembly strictly with the property rights issue, I remember that was very contentious. Yet I do not believe that is very contentious today anymore.

Mr. Speaker, I think we have all come to realize that was the right thing to do, even despite the fact it was defeated in this House. I am certainly in support of moving this along and in support of this bill, and I will be voting in favour of it. Thank you.

Thank you, Mr. Ootes. To the principle of the bill. The honourable Premier, Mr. Kakfwi.

Thank you, Mr. Speaker, my comments will be brief. I believe that as a government and as legislators, it is our duty to reviews the bills that we have and the laws, and if they are found lacking or to be discriminatory by the laws of this country, then it is our duty to address that. This is what I believe the issue is today. I do not believe I feel I am being forced to do anything against my will. I truly believe discrimination in any form has to be addressed and should not be in any laws in any legislature in this country. That would apply equally to public governments, to municipal governments, to aboriginal governments, as to federal, provincial and territorial.

This is our work. The lawmakers of this country have made rulings and we are obliged to accept that and to have it reflected in the legislation that we have. This is what we are doing. This is not something that should be subject to what is popular and what the current mood of the public is. This is about the rights of people and the right to be treated fairly and equally. That is what the issue is, and therefore, we have discussed it as Ministers and we have agreed that we will vote fully in support of this legislation. Thank you.

-- Applause

Thank you, Mr. Premier. To the principle of the bill. There are no other Members. The mover has the right to have the last comment on it, Mr. Miltenberger, if you choose.

Thank you, Mr. Speaker, I as well will be very brief. In this House and in this Legislature where we represent the people is where we have to make choices that are sometimes very difficult. Sometimes they cause us much soul-searching, but the reality is, as the Premier indicated, that the law of the land, that legislative landscape, is clear that we have an obligation as legislators to make sure that our laws are not found wanting and that our laws do not discriminate and do not detract from the quality of people.

I thank all my colleagues for their comments. I know the importance of this issue to all people, but I would ask that we consider moving this bill forward, that we approve second reading and then into committee, and allow this House to make sure that our laws in fact are no longer found wanting in this area. Thank you.

Thank you, Mr. Miltenberger. There is no further debate on the principle of the bill. The Chair recognizes the honourable Member for Mackenzie-Delta.

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, at this time I would like to request a recorded vote on this.

Thank you. A request for a recorded vote has been made. Is the House ready for the vote? Question has been called. All those in favour, please rise. Mr. Clerk.