Thank you. Please be seated. Good afternoon. Item 2, Ministers' statements. The honourable Minister responsible for Housing, Mr. Allen.

Thank you. Mr. Speaker, it is a simple truth to say that we all want safer communities and we all have a role to play in achieving this. The RCMP have a significant role which creates high expectations. We expect the RCMP will respond to our calls for help. We expect them to take action when we are victimized by crime. We expect them to get involved in programs that reduce crime.

Mr. Speaker, the Government of the Northwest Territories has a vision for the future of policing in the NWT. It is one that includes improved access to police services and better coordination of restorative justice activities between the police and communities.

To achieve this vision requires a solid partnership between communities, the government and the RCMP. I believe that the Department of Justice has always had a positive relationship with the RCMP. I also believe that we are building good relationships with communities through our support for local justice activities. However, I do believe that we can do more to deal with the many policing issues facing us.

Mr. Speaker, officials from the department are working on a plan to deal with these issues and enhance the law enforcement capabilities of our communities. As part of this plan, we are examining ways to improve safety on the highways and to keep detachments in communities like Holman, Wha Ti and Paulatuk that only have one officer. We are also considering ways to improve the law enforcement capability of communities that do not currently have resident RCMP officers. As part of this process, we are looking closely at the needs of all communities. In the interim, the RCMP has assured us that they will increase the number and duration of their patrols to these communities.

Mr. Speaker, recently there have been reports that the Yellowknife detachment of the RCMP was not able to meet certain needs of the citizens of Yellowknife. In response to this report, a meeting was held last Friday between a senior official from the Department of Justice and the commanding officer of the RCMP "G" Division. I can report that this meeting was very positive. People will be pleased to hear that as a result of this meeting, there will be no immediate changes to the level of

policing provided in Yellowknife. This includes continuing to operate the DARE program.

The Government of the Northwest Territories is a strong supporter of DARE, which is the RCMP's Drug Abuse Resistance Education Program. This program is designed to give fifth and sixth grade students the skills they will need to help them stay away from cigarettes, alcohol and drugs. It also helps children deal with and avoid violence. This program is an excellent example of how police can work to reduce criminal behaviour before it starts. There is also a plan to bring this program to Hay River in the next few months.

While this addresses immediate concerns in Yellowknife, there remains a need to examine the resources dedicated to policing in all communities in the Northwest Territories. The Department of Justice will dedicate the necessary time and resources to come forward with a plan to deal with the many policing issues facing us. I expect to have this plan ready for Cabinet this June.

Mr. Speaker, I want to assure the residents of the Northwest Territories that we will continue to work closely with the RCMP and with communities to make the Northwest Territories a safer place to live and work. Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

-- Applause

Thank you, Mr. Minister. Item 2, Ministers' statements. The honourable Minister responsible for the Department of Education, Culture and Employment, Mr. Ootes.

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, February 6th marked the 50th anniversary of Her Majesty The Queen's accession to the Throne. The Northwest Territories is pleased to join other provinces and territories across Canada in marking this Golden Jubilee year.

To celebrate this anniversary, and in keeping with our priorities and a desire to focus on youth and literacy, the Department of Education, Culture and Employment will be supporting a book project to stimulate children's imaginations and creative writing skills. Students from grades 1 to 12 will be invited to write a story they wish to share with Her Majesty. The best stories will be selected and published in a book that will be given as a gift to the Queen.

Mr. Speaker, I would like to add that a book of congratulations and a pictorial display, along with memorabilia of past royal visits, have been set up in the Great Hall for public viewing. On behalf of the Department of Canadian Heritage, we will be distributing 300 portraits of the Queen to public agencies and organizations across the Northwest Territories.

Later today, Mr. Speaker, I will be moving a motion of congratulations to Queen Elizabeth.

Lastly, Mr. Speaker, I invite Members of this House to join us and Commissioner Hansen at our break this afternoon to launch these initiatives marking the Queen's Jubilee. During this break, Commissioner Hansen will announce an additional initiative by her office to commemorate the Jubilee. Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

-- Applause

Thank you, Mr. Minister. Item 2, Ministers' statements. The honourable Minister responsible for the Department of Justice, Mr. Allen.

Thank you. Mr. Speaker, today I am very pleased to tell you about the progress that the Department of Justice is making to recruit, retain and advance priority one employees within the corrections services.

As we all know, Mr. Speaker, the vast majority of the offender population in our facilities is aboriginal. I believe that in order to provide effective and appropriate services to these offenders, the people working in our facilities should reflect the cultural diversity of the people they are working with.

Mr. Speaker, I am pleased to say we have already made significant progress in this area. There are currently seven corrections facilities operating in the NWT. In six of these, more than 50 percent of the staff are priority one. In two of these six facilities, over 70 percent of the staff are priority one. In our probation services, 63 percent of the staff are priority one employees.

I am also pleased to inform you that many of these staff are in mid management or management positions. Right now, three out of the four managers of the young offender facilities are priority one employees. This is an excellent indication that affirmative action is progressing very well within the corrections services.

Mr. Speaker, the Department of Justice wants to ensure this trend continues and that we are able to maximize the opportunities for our staff in the facilities. This is why I have asked the department to develop and implement a human resources action plan. This plan will provide our employees with training and development opportunities that will allow them to move forward in their careers with corrections. Through this plan, corrections employees will have the means to gain the skills and experience necessary to become leaders in the corrections field.

Mr. Speaker, I am very excited about this plan, as it will encourage and promote the leadership potential that our employees already have. Mr. Speaker, the development of this plan is a priority for me and for the Department of Justice. I expect to have a more detailed framework for the plan ready for discussion with my Cabinet colleagues in April 2002. Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

-- Applause

Thank you, Mr. Minister. Item 3, Members' statements. The honourable Member for Yellowknife South, Mr. Bell.

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, in the Northwest Territories, the responsibility for housing is primarily located within the Northwest Territories Housing Corporation. The mandate of the Housing Corporation is to assist communities to assume the role of providing housing to their residents and to sustain northern economic development.

Mr. Speaker, the corporation has a variety of programs that support public housing, home ownership and home repair programs. Some of the programs are the Extended Down Payment Assistance Program, also known as EDAP, the Independent Housing Program, EDAP Repair Program, Independent Housing Repair Program, Sale of Housing Materials Program, Northern Territorial Rental Purchase Program, the Sale of Public Housing Initiative, Seniors and/or Disabled Maintenance Program, and Elders on the Land Initiative.

Mr. Speaker, this is a long list of programs. On one hand, it sounds as if this government has at its disposal a variety of programs available to make home ownership and home repair affordable for many northern residents. On the other hand, Mr. Speaker, I wonder how much the average resident knows about the availability of these programs.

Mr. Speaker, there is a listing of programs of interest to seniors in the Seniors Information Handbook and there is some basic information on the corporation's website. I am concerned, Mr. Speaker, that perhaps the public is not very well aware that there are programs available, nor are they sure of who they should talk to about qualifying for assistance.

Other than news releases on programs when they are initially announced, we hear very little by way of advertising on programs that are available to assist members of the public with their housing problems. Not only do we need to advertise these programs, Mr. Speaker, but we need to let people know how to find out if they qualify. If these programs are expected to help people obtain and maintain affordable housing, Mr. Speaker, then let's go out there and let people know they exist and we are willing to help them. Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

-- Applause

Thank you, Mr. Bell. Item 3, Members' statements. The honourable Member for North Slave, Mr. Lafferty.

Thank you, Mr. Lafferty. Item 3, Members' statements. The honourable Member for Hay River South, Mrs. Groenewegen.

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, the harmonization initiative was undertaken because there was a need to make changes in how this government assessed income and set the rental rates for public housing and income support clients. The public housing program, administered by the NWT Housing Corporation, and the Income Assistance Program, administered by the Department of Education, Culture and Employment, assessed financial needs in different ways.

There is also a need to ensure that the people with the greatest need receive assistance. The harmonization initiative brochure tells us that harmonization will ensure that eligibility for government support is determined in a fair and equitable manner. As I understand this, Mr. Speaker, this means that benefits to income support clients and low-income families will be improved, and I understand that it will also mean fairer public rent scales and, Mr. Speaker, I understand that there will not be disincentives to employment.

Mr. Speaker, in Hay River, there are over 100 public housing units. People occupying these units include students, single parents, seniors and low-income families. If, in the implementation of the harmonization, we see that there is in fact more equity, fairness and affordability, then I believe the positive benefits to those most in need will be welcomed.

During question period, I will be asking questions related to the positive results we can expect to see under harmonization. Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

-- Applause

Thank you, Mrs. Groenewegen. Item 3, Members' statements. The honourable Member for Mackenzie Delta, Mr. Krutko.

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, I would like to call attention to some of the problems I see in my constituency because of the shortage of suitable, adequate and affordable housing. Mr. Speaker, because there is a shortage of housing, I see low-income families sharing houses that are too small to begin with, leading to overcrowded...in some situations, the facilities cannot accommodate the number of people by the use of running water. Regarding the effect it has on those families with regard to the public safety, health and well being of these families.

What choice do these people have regarding large families and supporting their families and trying to realize that the lack of housing accommodation does have an effect on the family, especially in our traditional, aboriginal communities? There is a custom that continues on of sharing, caring and ensuring family support is there, right from the grandparents down to the children.

Mr. Speaker, it is very visible that homeless populations are increasing in our communities, where people are living in tent frames because they have been kicked out of housing units by this government.

The housing shortage does have a very important impact, not only on the lives of the people, but it is more visible in low-income families. Lack of affordable housing accommodation also has an impact on the community to devour programs and services by employing people from outside of the community and not having staff housing available for those people.

For example, professional people such as nurses and teachers find accommodation in our communities. In most cases, they have to share that accommodation with either each other or a few of the teachers and nurses to pay the cost of acquiring these houses in our communities.

Mr. Speaker, I believe this government has to add to the amount of affordable housing in our communities and not be in a position of selling off the remaining government-owned housing units in our small communities. If anything, they should be enhancing the program.

Mr. Speaker, the government has to address this important issue of housing problems. The people in the smaller communities face this challenge day in and day out. Mr. Speaker, I will be asking the Minister questions on this matter later. Thank you.

-- Applause

Thank you, Mr. Krutko. Item 3, Members' statements. The honourable Member for Frame Lake, Mr. Dent.

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, we have significant housing issues in Yellowknife. There are very few houses for sale and very few new ones being built, largely because of the high price of land. There are not many mobile homes on the market, although I understand we may soon see some development in this area. There are hardly any apartments or rental accommodations available. It is obvious that the market is tough for all income levels.

Mr. Speaker, you can imagine if people with resources are having trouble finding accommodation just what those who have the least are going through.

People who are single and homeless can go to either the Salvation Army shelter or the Women's Centre for overnight shelter. A year ago, their chances of being reasonably accommodated were pretty good. This winter, both shelters are full every night. In fact, Mr. Speaker, both shelters are filled over their capacity pretty well all the time.

For instance, at the Women's Centre, there are 24 to 30 people every night. This is in a place with nine beds that is funded for 16 people. Mr. Speaker, overcrowding, as we all know, can lead to violent situations. On occasion, the Salvation Army and Women's Centre may have to evict residents as a result, just to protect the others.

Mr. Speaker, we could end up with people who have no options for shelter during the coldest time of the year.

This is made worse, Mr. Speaker, by the RCMP shortage and their recent announcement that they will not have the personnel to respond to situations involving an intoxicated person. We are in danger of having someone freeze to death.

Mr. Speaker, Education, Culture and Employment, through their income support program, provides funding to these shelters. They will have to respond. They must fund more bed space and increased staff.

Mr. Speaker, I will be following up with the Minister of Education, Culture and Employment on this issue later today. Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

-- Applause

Thank you, Mr. Dent. Item 3, Members' statements. The honourable Member for Inuvik Boot Lake, Mr. Roland.

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. The harmonization initiative was originally conceived to resolve the differences between the way two departments of this government assessed income and thereby setting rents for people in public housing.

The harmonization initiative has been underway for two years now, Mr. Speaker. Every person who receives income assistance or is living in public housing will be affected by changes that are to be implemented under the harmonization strategy.

People who live in public housing include low-income working people and seniors on fixed incomes.

Mr. Speaker, this government has announced that those changes will take place on April 1st of this year. The problem is that we do not seem to know what the changes will be.

Yes, Mr. Speaker, we know that some people will see rent decreases and some will see increases, but even the people who will be affected by these changes are telling us that they do not know what this means. How much will their rent be?

Mr. Speaker, the Minister has stated that the corporation is looking at asking for a deferral on the implementation date. The department responsible for implementation of the harmonization changes is still working to orientate their employees on how rent will be set for housing units and how income will be assessed for those tenants.

Apparently, this is not a simple process, Mr. Speaker. The people who are employed to calculate how much rent is going to be charged are struggling with the details. How then, Mr. Speaker, is a tenant supposed to get any information about the proposed changes?

Mr. Speaker, I do not believe that the harmonization strategy is ready for implementation in its current state. Until this government knows what the implications are going to be and until the details are known, and until the tenants know exactly where they are going to stand, I urge the Minister to reconsider this initiative and how it is being rolled out. Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

-- Applause

Thank you, Mr. Roland. Item 3, Members' statements. The honourable Member for Range Lake, Ms. Lee.

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, I would like to take this opportunity to highlight the issue of housing shortages in Yellowknife. We are well aware that we are experiencing critical shortages in every area but today, I would like to speak on the need for housing for senior citizens in Yellowknife. I would like to do this by telling you a story of a woman in my riding who is a single woman and who was, until recently, on disability assistance. She is an ex-government employee.

She called me because she received a letter in January saying that when she turned 65 in February, she would not be eligible for the disability pension that she had been receiving. This was not a very nice happy birthday message for her. She tried to see if she could get into some other sort of housing, public housing, or in the Aven Seniors Centre. She was told that there was no room available and that the line-up had an indefinite list.

As well, Mr. Speaker, I would like to point out that she is an aboriginal single women, originally from Mackenzie Delta, and she had worked for government for many, many years.

I think what we have here is unless you are a senior citizen who is retiring and who is lucky enough to have made payments on your house, or unless you have double income that could support a mortgage, there is just no way for you to have a home.

I tried to get some assistance for her through the Department of Health and Social Services and Education through income support to no avail. When I last talked to her, she had to sell her house in my riding and she has decided that she will move to Grand Prairie to be with her daughter. She was very sad about that because she is from here and she wants to retire here and there is no home for her to go.

I believe that this is just one of the stories around the city. I know there is a lot of need for housing for senior citizens. They are just not able to afford the kind of prices that are being asked in the private market. The government has to look at the shortage of housing in Yellowknife. I have not heard anything that is positive. I will be pursuing this issue with the responsible Ministers. Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

-- Applause

Thank you, Ms. Lee. Item 3, Members' statements. The honourable Member for Tu Nedhe, Mr. Nitah.

Thank you, Mr. Nitah. Item 3, Members' statements. The honourable Member for Deh Cho, Mr. McLeod.

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, in keeping in line with today's theme, I would like to speak about the harmonization initiative. I think I have made it clear that I have great reservations about the implementation of the harmonization strategy.

Like my colleague, the Member for Inuvik Boot Lake, it was my understanding that the harmonization initiative was undertaken because there was a need to make changes on how to assess income and set the rental rates for public housing and income support clients.

Mr. Speaker, the way this program has been rolled out is causing real problems in communities that I represent. Some people are hearing for the first time that they may or may not have a rent increase in the next three months.

For example, can you imagine getting a letter from your landlord stating that your rent may go up in three months, but it may not go up either? At any rate, the letter should be considered as formal notice that something is going to happen in three months.

In addition, Mr. Speaker, when you go to local housing authorities and you ask if your rent is going to increase and by how much, no one can really tell you because they have not been trained, nor have they been informed of how to calculate the rent until sometime in March of this year, yet the family is told to be prepared for something to happen.

Can you imagine the stress that it is causing my constituents? Many of the seniors are wondering if their rent is going to go up. They are wondering if they are going to have enough money left over from their cheques to make payments on items they purchased a year prior to this initiative. Many are wondering if they will still have enough money to adequately support their families.

Mr. Speaker, in my mind, when you give someone three months notice of change in their rent, the notice must contain enough detail to all the family to make decisions and plan. I submit to you, Mr. Speaker, that if a private apartment owner in Yellowknife tried to claim three months notice of a rent increase without telling the tenant how much that increase would be and that it constituted a proper notice, the MLA for that riding would be snowed under with complaints.

Mr. Speaker, this strategy I understand was inherited from the 13th Assembly. I am not satisfied that the details of the harmonization strategy have been fully debated in this Assembly. I believe the residents need to be informed of the ramifications of the new harmonization policies that will be applied.

I will be following up with the appropriate Minister during question period, Mr. Speaker.

-- Applause

Thank you, Mr. McLeod. Item 3, Members' statements. The honourable Member for Great Slave, Mr. Braden.

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Like the rest of Canada, the Northwest Territories is experiencing a shortage of affordable housing in many, if not all, of our communities. The Northwest Territories Housing Needs Survey for 2000, Mr. Speaker, highlights a greater need for renovations and repairs in the smaller communities and the need for solutions to affordability and overcrowding, particularly in our larger centres in Inuvik and Yellowknife.

In his budget address last week, the Minister of Finance offered some welcome news that will assist the private sector in developing rental accommodation by increasing the availability of reasonably priced and financed land for non-tax-based communities. I support this direction, Mr. Speaker, but I think it can go further, especially at this time of accelerated development due to mining and oil and gas.

Mr. Speaker, in our larger centres, the Northwest Territories has a capable private sector involved in constructing and owning housing. I do not believe the government has a role in doing anything of a competitive nature. This would interfere unduly in the market.

Having said that, I believe there is room for governments, both territorial and municipal, to assist in providing up-front assistance in developing the infrastructure to help make the lots and the land more affordable. Specifically, Mr. Speaker, we are looking at building the roads and the water and sewer networks that we need for modern communities.

If these up-front development costs were lowered, Mr. Speaker, this reduces the amount of financing that a developer needs to arrange and that means lower rents and cost of land for tenants and homeowners. I believe there is room for this government to be innovative and build on programs that will help municipal governments make land more affordable by reducing those high, upfront infrastructure costs.

I will be asking the Ministers responsible more about this during question period. Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

-- Applause

Thank you, Mr. Braden. Item 3, Members' statements. Item 4, reports of standing and special committees. Mr. Dent.

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, early in the life of the 14th Legislative Assembly, Members developed the vision statement, Towards a Better Tomorrow. One of the shorter term goals that this Assembly set out as one of the key goals in the document is housing that is adequate, affordable and suitable.

Members of the Standing Committee on Accountability and Oversight tabled a copy of our progress report on plans and priorities when we stated that we would continue to pursue adequate housing for Northerners. This report is intended to bring forth some discussion points and to serve as a reminder that we have not yet achieved our objective of suitable, adequate and affordable housing.

Housing problems are typically sorted into three categories: suitability, adequacy and affordability. The definitions are nationally set and are used by the Government of the Northwest Territories in assessing housing problems. Suitability refers to the problem of overcrowding, or whether a household has enough bedrooms appropriate for the number of people. Adequacy refers to the physical condition of a dwelling, or whether a household has the basic facilities to provide a safe and healthy environment. Affordability problems exist when a household pays an excessive amount for shelter. A household has an affordability problem if more than 30 percent of the household income is paid to shelter costs.

Mr. Speaker, it is not unusual to see adverse social and health impacts when any or all of these conditions are present in our communities. Overcrowding, lack of basic facilities such as hot and cold running water and indoor toilets can contribute to illness and lead to poor achievements.

If a household is paying more than 30 percent of income on shelter costs, we know that families need to cut back on other necessities, such as healthy food and necessary clothing. In addition to overcrowding because of a lack of affordable housing, larger communities are seeing a growing problem of homelessness.

Lack of affordable rental accommodation in many of our communities, especially those experiencing economic growth, is creating an additional problem in an employer's ability to staff positions. Some of these positions, such as health workers and teachers, provide basic and essential services to residents, and the inability to staff positions because there is no suitable accommodation is an issue of concern to Members.

Mr. Speaker, the 2000 Northwest Territories Housing Needs Survey was completed by the Northwest Territories Housing Corporation in partnership with the Northwest Territories Bureau of Statistics, local housing organizations and communities, and was tabled by the Minister responsible for the Northwest Territories Housing Corporation.

The Minister's message states that the survey shows that there are 2,726 households in need in the Northwest Territories, or one out of every five households. The Minister goes on to say that not all communities have the same types of housing problems and need. I quote:

In some communities the need is for renovation and repairs to existing homes rather than for new homes. In larger centres such as Yellowknife, Inuvik and Hay River, residents face problems of affordability rather than overcrowding or condition of the home.

That is from page 2 in the Minister's message.

Mr. Speaker, household size suggests that crowding issues are improving. In 1981, approximately 13.9 percent of households contained six or more residents compared to 7.8 percent of dwellings with six or more residents at the time of the 2000 NWT Housing Needs Survey. The source is the Bureau of Statistics, 2001 socio-economic scan.

However, Mr. Speaker, there is still a need to improve the conditions of the housing units in the smaller communities and to have affordable housing available, particularly in the larger centres.

The harmonization project was initiated to clear up the differences in the way income and need were assessed by the public housing and income support programs. It was intended to ensure that eligibility for government support is consistent, fair and equitable and that government resources go to the people with the greatest need.

Mr. Speaker, Members have raised questions related to the implementation of harmonized assessments and consequential adjustments to the current rent structure.

The committee welcomes the news that Canada and the Northwest Territories signed an affordable housing agreement earlier this month. The agreement is aimed at helping to increase the supply of affordable housing. According to the joint press release issued on February 5, 2002, the $7.5 million in new federal funding to be provided over a four-year period under this agreement will create an independent housing program that will enable low income families to access modest housing through home ownership and assisted rental housing, which will provide rent geared-to-income housing for low income seniors and singles.

Mr. Speaker, the Minister of Finance has also highlighted this agreement in the 2002-2003 Budget Address. In addition, he announced that the Government of the Northwest Territories intends to help the private sector to respond to the demand for affordable rental accommodation in non-tax-based communities. Details as to how this will be achieved have not yet been made public, and members of our committee look forward to hearing more on this item.

Mr. Speaker, the Northwest Territories Housing Corporation is responsible for administering several programs to help families and individuals obtain homes to meet their specific needs. These programs include assisted rental programs and home ownership programs. Many of these programs are cost-shared with the Canada Mortgage and Housing Corporation. The NWT Housing Corporation has $48.5 million budgeted for the 2002-2003 year for support to programs and subsidies targeted at low and middle income Northerners. Although the corporation has a range of programs to assist individuals, families, seniors and people with disabilities, there appear to be gaps between program thresholds and the result is that some families in need may be falling through the cracks.

Mr. Speaker, the committee acknowledges and agrees with the statements made by the Minister responsible for Housing that program criteria need to be flexible in their application. That flexibility needs to apply to eligibility criteria for rental assistance programs; it needs to apply to the types of housing units that the corporation will approve under the home ownership programs, and it needs to apply in creative ways to assist homeowners to keep their houses in good repair. For instance, in communities where there are no private sector contractors to carry out repairs for private homeowners, perhaps local housing authorities could enter into arrangements with homeowners to provide materials and labour.

In urban areas such as Inuvik, Hay River and Yellowknife, the need is more focused on assistance to developers in order to lower the initial costs for new affordable housing. Because of the high cost of land development, sewer and water, there is an increase in the amount that a developer needs to borrow. This means increased borrowing costs, which in turn leads to higher rents or mortgages to the consumer in order that the developers may recover their costs within a reasonable time frame.

Mr. Speaker, the Standing Committee on Accountability and Oversight urges the government to move forward aggressively in developing affordable housing. We have, through letters and in our response to the review of the 2002-2003 Main Estimates, already expressed concern that this government has not proposed significant new monies for new and existing programs in the 2002-2003 budget. In addition to providing much needed housing, the construction process itself affords an opportunity for jobs and for local economic opportunities. Mr. Speaker, spending money on capital projects in the communities provides job creation and a host of benefits for Northerners, not the least of which is a place to live.

Mr. Speaker, that concludes the report of the Standing Committee on Accountability and Oversight on adequate, affordable and suitable housing for residents of the Northwest Territories. You will have noticed that the housing theme ran through the Members' statements that were given earlier this afternoon. This report continues that theme of housing in the Northwest Territories.

Mr. Speaker, I move, seconded by the honourable Member for Inuvik Boot Lake, that Committee Report 4-14(5) be received and adopted. Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

Thank you, Mr. Dent. We have a motion on the floor. The motion is in order. All those in favour of the motion? Thank you. All those opposed? Thank you. The motion is carried. Committee Report 4-14(5) has been received and adopted. Item 4, reports of standing and special committees. Item 5, returns to oral questions. Item 6, recognition of visitors in the gallery. Item 7, oral questions. The honourable Member for Yellowknife South, Mr. Bell.

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. My question is directed to the Minister for Housing, Mr. Allen. What advertising or what information does the corporation make available to make the public aware that there are programs available to help them become homeowners or to repair their homes? Thank you.

Thank you, Mr. Bell. The honourable Minister responsible for the NWT Housing Corporation, Mr. Allen.

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. We use a number of methodologies. We use the local newspapers in some instances. We use the local TV stations in other instances. We also have flyers and brochures that are often circulated throughout the communities. Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

Thank you, Mr. Minister. Supplementary, Mr. Bell.

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Much of the information that is disseminated through the news media, TV, flyers, websites, these types of medium, is very general in nature, Mr. Speaker. I am wondering where members of the public can get more detailed information on these programs. Thank you.

Thank you, Mr. Bell. The honourable Minister responsible for the NWT Housing Corporation, Mr. Allen.

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Besides the normal process of distributing information, we do have five district offices across the Northwest Territories. For the record, Mr. Speaker, we have the Mackenzie Delta/Beaufort district office in Inuvik. We have the Sahtu office in Norman Wells. We have an office in Fort Simpson, Hay River and we have the North Slave office here in Yellowknife, and also the headquarters in Yellowknife. Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

We will now take a short break.

-- Break

Thank you. The House will come back to order after a short break. We were on oral questions. The honourable Member for Yellowknife South was on his second supplementary. Mr. Bell.

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. As we broke, the Minister was telling us they do have regional offices that disseminate information. I guess what I would like to ask is if the corporation has someone in every community where a resident can go to get advice on what kinds of programs might be suitable for their needs and also to know what they might qualify for. Thank you.

Thank you, Mr. Bell. The honourable Minister responsible for the NWT Housing Corporation, Mr. Allen.

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. We do have program officers in each region that are attached to each community. They are responsible for providing the detailed information on every element of our programs. If there needs to be more, I am prepared to advocate the need for greater promotion of our programs in those communities. Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

Thank you, Mr. Minister. Final supplementary, Mr. Bell.

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. I am wondering what kinds of efforts the corporation can make to help clients repair their homes if they do not qualify or do not quite meet the criteria. What does the corporation do? Thank you.

Thank you, Mr. Bell. The honourable Minister responsible for the NWT Housing Corporation, Mr. Allen.

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. We impose upon our staff to advise the clients of their eligibility. We try to assist them through understanding the prerequisites to qualify for each individual program. Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

Thank you, Mr. Minister. Item 7, oral questions. The honourable Member for North Slave, Mr. Lafferty.

Thank you, Mr. Lafferty. The honourable Minister responsible for the NWT Housing Corporation, Mr. Allen.

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Quarterly, the NWT Housing Corporation, through its agents, does a reconciliation of the local housing authorities operations. There have been some discrepancies that are pointed out to LHOs, and they in turn take corrective action. Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

Thank you, Mr. Minister. Supplementary, Mr. Lafferty.

Thank you, Mr. Lafferty. The honourable Minister responsible for the NWT Housing Corporation, Mr. Allen.

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. I am going to speak in the context of some of the initiatives we are undertaking as a corporation, trying to give the communities more responsibility to deliver our services at the local level. Sometimes, Mr. Speaker, it is not always the most equitable way of doing it, but the intent is to work with the context of the proposed self-government agreements. Plus, we are still trying to work out some of the small errors that occur from time to time. Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

Thank you, Mr. Minister. Supplementary, Mr. Lafferty.

Thank you, Mr. Lafferty. The honourable Minister responsible for the NWT Housing Corporation, Mr. Allen.

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. We are attempting to enter into a new agreement with the Dogrib Rae Band Housing Division. That agreement is to be signed on April 1st of this year. This will allow us a little time to look at some of the previous problems that may have been in that agreement. We will correct that as we continue to communicate with the MLA and also with the community. Thank you.

Thank you, Mr. Minister. Final supplementary, Mr. Lafferty.

Thank you, Mr. Lafferty. The honourable Minister responsible for the NWT Housing Corporation, Mr. Allen.

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. The intention of this agreement is to have the clients go directly to the Dogrib Rae Band Housing Division first. If it does require additional attention, then I would propose they come to the NWT Housing Corporation. We will continue to work with the Dogrib Rae Band Housing Division. Thank you.

Thank you, Mr. Minister. Item 7, oral questions. The honourable Member for Hay River South, Mrs. Groenewegen.

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, my question is directed to the Minister for Housing. In my Member's statement earlier, I said I expected to see positive benefits arising from the harmonization initiatives. There are approximately 113 public housing units in Hay River. I would like to ask the Minister if he can tell me approximately how many of these families in these units will see a rent decrease? Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

Thank you, Mrs. Groenewegen. The honourable Minister responsible for the NWT Housing Corporation, Mr. Allen.

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Yes, I am pleased to inform the Member that we will see 77 of the 113 getting a decrease, or approximately 68 percent of the tenants. Thank you.

Thank you, Mr. Minister. Supplementary, Mrs. Groenewegen.

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. That will indeed be welcome news for those tenants. That is two-thirds of the unit, so I assume the remaining one-third would see rent increases. Can the Minister give us some indication of how much rent increase that one-third will receive? Thank you.

Thank you, Mrs. Groenewegen. The honourable Minister responsible for the NWT Housing Corporation, Mr. Allen.

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Based on the formula, I am pleased to advise that approximately 25, or 22 percent of those tenants, will receive rent increases anywhere between zero and 100 on average. Thank you.

Thank you, Mr. Minister. Supplementary, Mrs. Groenewegen.

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, that only leaves a few people who will actually be seeing an increase in rent of more than 100 dollars per month. Will the Minister give us some assurance that tenants in public housing who will not be facing significant rent increases will not be caused to face undue hardship as a result of these increases? Are there any plans to consider phasing in increases for tenants who will be experiencing larger increases? Thank you.

Thank you, Mrs. Groenewegen. The honourable Minister responsible for the NWT Housing Corporation, Mr. Allen.

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. We have deliberately gone out and tried to identify those who would be adversely affected. We will be working with them on an individual basis to see what type of programs may fit. Some may be eligible under the Expanded Down Payment Assistance Program or the Independent Housing Program. It may vary throughout our existing home ownership programs.

We are pleased to advise the Members that we are going to be discussing this with them more thoroughly on a one-on-one basis. Thank you.

Thank you, Mr. Minister. Item 7, oral questions. The honourable Member for Mackenzie Delta, Mr. Krutko.

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, my question is for the Minister responsible for Housing. Mr. Speaker, I understand that core need is a key measurement the Housing Corporation uses to describe a household that has a housing problem, and that has a total income below the community core need income threshold.

According to the 2000 Housing Needs Survey, Aklavik had 33 percent of all households in core need. Fort McPherson is at 36 percent and Tsiigehtchic has 62 percent of the households described as being in core need.

Mr. Speaker, I would like to ask the Minister, how do you consider actions to be taken for communities where 62 percent of all households are described as being in core need?

Thank you, Mr. Krutko. The honourable Minister responsible for the NWT Housing Corporation, Mr. Allen.

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. If I hear the question correctly, I do not have the specific outline of how they determine those who are in core need outside of floor space, that being the basic information I have at this moment. Thank you.

Thank you, Mr. Minister. Supplementary, Mr. Krutko.

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, Can the Minister tell me what action his department is taking to address the housing problems in our small communities where there is such a large percentage of core need?

Thank you, Mr. Krutko. The honourable Minister responsible for the NWT Housing Corporation, Mr. Allen.

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. I am pleased to advise the Members of this House that we are trying to develop several new initiatives to help alleviate the number of housing shortages and also overcrowding.

In the longer term, we are looking at some new senior housing initiatives as well as singles. We understand that is one of the major impacts we need to address. We also need to look at establishing other more affordable housing type programs, as well as market development in those communities that can afford to support a market.

We are also trying to work more in the context of research and development. That again is another initiative that we will be developing in the very near future. Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

Thank you, Mr. Minister. Supplementary, Mr. Krutko.

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, I would like to ask the Minister, will there be any new housing construction to replace some of these units that have very serious problems, where the cost to renovate is higher than building a new unit? Will there be new construction in our communities?

Thank you, Mr. Krutko. The honourable Minister responsible for the NWT Housing Corporation, Mr. Allen.

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Yes, definitely. We will replace those units that are beyond economic repair. We have allocated again a certain percentage of dollars to each community in our normal business process. That should help alleviate some of the problems.

Another positive area, Mr. Speaker, is we are now entering into a universal partnership agreement that allows, under the Corporations Act, for communities to determine their needs, rather than us determining their needs for them.

We are trying to open up and offer more flexibility to deliver those programs. Hopefully, the municipalities and other communities will work in partnership with the Northwest Territories Housing Corporation to fulfill those obligations. Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

Thank you, Mr. Minister. Final supplementary, Mr. Krutko.

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, I would like to ask the Minister, given that he sees this as a definite need, how soon can a community be able to see physical construction and renovations on these units in our communities? When will we see construction?

Thank you, Mr. Krutko. The honourable Minister responsible for the NWT Housing Corporation, Mr. Allen.

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, it is an ongoing process. Each new fiscal year the communities receive monies for new construction or modernization and improvement. Those monies are available each new fiscal year. It is just a matter of how the communities want to allocate that money to new construction or rehabilitation of existing units. Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

Thank you, Mr. Minister. Item 7, oral questions. The honourable Member for Frame Lake, Mr. Dent.

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, my question is for the Minister of Education, Culture and Employment. Mr. Speaker, we are approaching, if we are not there already, a crisis with the two shelters for single people in Yellowknife. The homeless numbers continue to grow. I know that Education, Culture and Employment has responded in part by covering more staff for one of these shelters, but it will not be enough.

Mr. Speaker, I know the Minister, so I am sure he will be prepared to meet with the operators to hear their issues, but will he commit to examining the funding contracts in light of the numbers of people seeking emergency shelter every night?

Thank you, Mr. Dent. The honourable Minister responsible for the Department of Education, Culture and Employment, Mr. Ootes.

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Yes, there is a concern out there, and it has been there for some time, about the number of homeless people and where they are sheltered in the evenings.

Yesterday, the Premier announced that we would have a Minister to lead the issue of homelessness. Certainly I will do that and will be pleased to meet with the organizations. I will then in turn brief the lead Minister for homelessness, Mr. Speaker. Thank you.

Thank you, Mr. Minister. Supplementary, Mr. Dent.

Mr. Speaker, in the long term, we need to give hope to homeless people that there is light at the end of the tunnel, that they will not be stuck in shelters with no hope. That means we need more healthy choices to help people get out of shelters.

Will the Minister work with the operators to expand on healthy choices available to the people who use the overnight shelters?

Thank you, Mr. Dent. The honourable Minister responsible for the Department of Education, Culture and Employment, Mr. Ootes.

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, yes. On income support issues, we have a productive choice. I think we need to work towards that for those who are homeless, so there is an opportunity for those people as well to improve their lives.

First of all, shelter is the primary issue, of course, but secondly, it becomes the case of can we find some means for them to find a productive way to move back into society on a working basis, if that is what they are capable of doing?

Thank you, Mr. Minister. Supplementary, Mr. Dent.

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. I thank the Minister for that response, because productive choices need to be broader, there is no question. Mr. Speaker, income support is also being delivered through the Women's Centre. Will the Minister reaffirm his commitment to this type of community-based delivery for income support programs?

Thank you, Mr. Dent. The honourable Minister responsible for the Department of Education, Culture and Employment, Mr. Ootes.

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. There is no question that community delivery of income support can have a tremendous beneficial effect. There have been some challenges in order to do that. So far, we understand the delivery by the Women's Centre has proved very beneficial. I would like to certainly see that continue. Thank you.

Thank you, Mr. Minister. Item 7, oral questions. The honourable Member for Inuvik Boot Lake, Mr. Roland.

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. My question is directed to the Minister responsible for the Housing Corporation. Early on in this harmonization process, seniors were consulted on their views. I am aware in Inuvik that approximately 60 senior citizens will be affected by the proposed changes. Almost 45 of those will see an increase in their rent.

I would like to ask the Minister if he would consider reviewing the harmonization strategy as it impacts on seniors in the Northwest Territories? Thank you.

Thank you, Mr. Roland. The honourable Minister responsible for the NWT Housing Corporation, Mr. Allen.

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Since we have taken a sincere approach and became sensitive to the points raised by the Member here, and which we have heard from the committee, that is why we are proposing a deferral of the implementation until October 2002, so it gives us the chance to begin more community consultations with those that originally felt it. Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

Thank you, Mr. Minister. Supplementary, Mr. Roland.

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Did the Minister say that it is suggested that the deferral will happen until October?

Thank you, Mr. Roland. The honourable Minister responsible for the NWT Housing Corporation, Mr. Allen.

Yes, Mr. Speaker, I would like to confirm that. We are proposing that it be deferred until October 1, 2002. Thank you.