All those abstaining from the motion, please stand.

Results of the motion: nine for, one opposed, seven abstaining. The motion is carried.

---Carried

Item 18, first reading of bills. Item 19, second reading of bills. Item 20, consideration in Committee of the Whole of bills and other matters: Tabled Document 7-16(3), Ministerial Benefits Policy; Tabled Document 11-16(3), NWT Main Estimates 2009-2010; Committee Report 2-16(3), Standing Committee on Rules and Procedures Report on Matters Referred to the Committee; Bill 1, An Act to Amend the Historical Resources Act; Bill 3, International Interest in Mobile Aircraft Equipment Act; Bill 4, Public Library Act; Bill 5, Professional Corporations Act; and Bill 7, An Act to Amend the Student Financial Assistance Act. By the authority given me as Speaker by Motion 10-16(3), I hereby authorize the House to sit beyond the daily hour of adjournment to consider the business before the House, with Mr. Krutko in the chair.

Thank you, Mr. Chairman. We would like to get into the Department of Education, Culture and Employment budget deliberations.

Is committee agreed?

Okay. With that, Minister of ECE, do you have opening comments or general comments?

Yes, Mr. Chairman. I am pleased to present the 2009-2010 Main Estimates for the Department of Education, Culture and Employment.

Our vision of northern people leading fulfilled lives and contributing to a strong and prosperous society is the driving force for where we are going as a

department. The Department of Education, Culture and Employment strategic plan, Building on Our Success, along with the government’s strategic plan and initiatives provide the direction for our 2009-2010 Main Estimates.

The proposed 2009-2010 Main Estimates for Education, Culture and Employment totals $299.631 million, an increase of 3.3 percent over the previous year’s main estimates. The main estimates incorporate funding for ongoing programs and for strategic initiatives for each of the department’s key activities. It includes $4.6 million for proposed new initiatives in language and culture, in the arts, in labour market literacy, in immigration support, in client services and in the trades.

Early Childhood Development

Overall, in 2009-2010, we propose to spend approximately $6.069 million on early childhood development activities. These activities help provide children with a healthy start in life and give them the learning tools they need to succeed in school and beyond. The department plans to conduct a review of the Early Childhood and Family Literacy training programs in 2009-2010 and to bring forward plans to further improve early childhood programs for 2010-2011.

School System

This government knows that addressing the needs of students is paramount to ensure that children have the best possible start to their learning journey. The proposed 2009-2010 budget for school programs totals $160.910 million. Most of this money will go directly to education authorities at the regional and community level.

In 2009-2010 the department will work with Northwest Territories education authorities on a strategy to eliminate the education achievement gap between aboriginal and non-aboriginal students. A proposed investment of $225,000 will enable high school students from small communities to access the programs they need to fulfill their individual career and education plans.

We will also work with education authorities to develop a framework that supports high school trades initiatives. An additional $145,000 is being proposed to establish a curriculum coordinator position responsible for apprenticeship math and accountability for new “trades in schools” programming.

On a broader level, the department will work with the Northwest Territories Teachers’ Association to complete recommendations on how to promote a safe school environment for students and teachers across the Northwest Territories.

A total of $6.864 million is being included in the proposed 2009-2010 budget to cover negotiated Collective Agreement increases for teacher salaries and benefits. School funding reductions in line with lower enrolments are offset by increases required to maintain the level of student support funding and the pupil-teacher ratio for the remainder of the 2008-2009 school year, covering the period from April to June.

Library Services

In the area of library services we propose to spend $1.044 million for 2009-2010. A proposed $150,000 investment will increase the hours of operation for 11 small community libraries. A proposed additional $137,000 will be contributed to community libraries to offset operational costs.

Culture And Heritage

In 2009-2010 the department proposes to invest an additional $700,000 in the arts to increase supports for individuals, projects and organizations that showcase Northwest Territories arts and cultures. This is in addition to the $500,000 added in 2008-2009 and will bring the annual budget for arts and cultural contributions to $2 million in 2009-2010.

The department also proposes to invest $300,000 for the collection of museum and archival materials for the development of exhibit storylines with elders and other community experts, and for the design and production of museum and on-line exhibits representing the culture and heritage of the Northwest Territories.

Official Languages

We propose to spend $6.146 million on official languages activities during the fiscal year. Education, Culture and Employment is working with the language communities, other Government of the Northwest Territories departments and the federal government to support service in and the acquisition, maintenance and revitalization of our 11 Northwest Territories official languages.

Four of the six modules in the Aboriginal Language Interpreter Translator Pilot Training Program has been completed. The Northwest Territories French Language Single Window Service Centre opened in Yellowknife in June 2008. In 2009-2010 the department proposes to invest an additional $100,000 toward piloting single-window service centres for one or more of our aboriginal languages. These centres will provide information and services in the aboriginal languages based on needs identified through consultations with the aboriginal language communities.

College And Literacy Programs

In 2009-2010 we plan to support our college and adult basic education and literacy programs with a proposed expenditure of $35.475 million. The new Literacy Strategy targets youth who are not in school and do not participate in the labour market. Completion of college, university or trades training equips Northerners to take advantage of economic opportunities. A $600,000 literacy investment is being proposed to increase the number of adult educators in small communities and to raise literacy programs in 2009-2010.

A proposed $419,000 investment will support Aurora College trades and technology programs and an additional proposed $240,000 will be used to maintain equipment and to support the Aurora College heavy equipment operator training in Deh Cho and South Slave communities.

Apprenticeship, Trades And Occupations

In 2009-2010 the department proposes to add $150,000 to pay fees and tuition on behalf of apprentices due to increased apprenticeship registrations and $100,000 to encourage women and aboriginal people to enter and complete apprenticeship training.

Career And Employment Development

In 2009-2010 the department is proposing to invest $535,000 to support immigration. This initiative will make it possible for the Northwest Territories to actively participate in the immigration process in support of northern businesses. A proposed Nominee Program will address the concerns of Northwest Territories employers by expediting the processing of permanent residency of those immigrants who bring skills and resources that are lacking in the Northwest Territories economy.

Income Security

The department proposes to further the work on the consolidation of income security programs that began in April 2005. The department has rationalized its income security programs under a common policy framework and introduced a new benefit structure designed to encourage greater self-reliance.

The department is also moving toward the establishment of one-stop community service centres to deliver the range of income security programs. In 2009-2010 the department proposes to add $318,000 to improve service management capacity in the Deh Cho and Sahtu regions.

Concluding Comments

In conclusion, Mr. Chair, the 2009-2010 Main Estimates for Education, Culture and Employment were developed to further both the goals of the Government of the Northwest Territories’ strategic plan and the objectives of the departmental strategic plan.

I would be pleased to answer any question that Members may have at this time. Thank you, Mr. Chair.

Thank you, Mr. Minister. At this time, we’ll call a short break and we’ll begin with the Minister and his witnesses.

---SHORT RECESS

I’ll call Committee of the Whole back to order. At this time, I would like to ask the Minister of Education if he’ll be bringing in any witnesses.

Yes, Mr. Chair.

Does committee agree that the Minister bring in his witnesses?

Sergeant-at-Arms, please escort the witnesses in.

For the record, Mr. Minister, can you introduce your witnesses?

Mahsi, Mr. Chair. Mr. Chair, to my left is Dan Daniels, deputy minister of Education, Culture and Employment, and to my right is Mr. Paul Devitt, director of strategic and business services. Mahsi, Mr. Chair.

Thank you, Mr. Minister. Welcome, witnesses. General comments on the Department of Education, Culture and Employment. Mr. Bromley.

Thank you, Mr. Chair. Thanks to the Minister for his introductory comments. I would like to start by noting an increase of 3.3 percent for this department. That’s sort of on the low end, which I am appreciative of. Zero is even better. The first thing I noticed was a reduction in the early childhood development of $200,000. To me this is a real priority, which I’ve highlighted before and I know the Minister is aware of that. I also see that there is a review plan of the early childhood and family literacy training and plans to improve that the following fiscal year. I am happy to see that. So I guess I am wondering what we are cutting out of Early Childhood Development Program there or $200,000. I am concerned about that.

Just going through, there are many things I do appreciate; the $150,000 investment to increase the hours of operations for small community libraries. That seems like a good investment to me. I am hugely supportive of the additional dollars for the arts, $700,000 bringing the annual budget next fiscal year to $2 million for arts and cultural contributions. I think it’s well demonstrated the economic return that you get back from those investments, so I think we’ll see that.

I note the $300,000 for collections and museum archival materials. I wonder, I’ve had a number of constituents ask about displays related to the Residential School Program and the impacts thereof, especially aboriginal people who are concerned that their young children are unaware of the implications and import of that issue. I’m hoping there might be some thinking along that line.

I also appreciate the $600,000 investment in literacy. I’m wondering if that’s an addition to the literacy program. I also think that’s an area where dollars spent are a true investment, that give us good return both economically and otherwise, health and so on. So a good way to address a broad range of our goals and objectives.

The proposing to increase our support for apprentices and women in apprenticing and aboriginal people, I’m very supportive of those things. I notice that we have two apprenticeship training officers who I think each are trying to sort of administer 100 apprentices. I think things are starting to burst at the seams there. I note that those officers...and I can’t even tell you, are they Public Works and Services or...I’m not sure where they’re housed. There’s getting to be a rapid turnover in those positions, so hopefully there’s some broader cross-department thinking to address that end of things and make sure those dollars stay effective.

The increase for immigration support, I know we seem to have taken it away from one of our non-government organizations that works with immigrants and I’m hoping that this new interest in supporting immigration will, in fact, re-establish support to organizations such as the one in Yellowknife that does such important work that is, apparently, closing its doors or close to it.

Under the income security remarks that the Minister made, further work on consolidation of income security, the department has rationalized its income security programs under a common policy framework and are going to introduce a new benefits structure to encourage greater self-reliance. That’s something that I’m interested in but I’m not sure exactly what this means, so I’d appreciate some further explanation of what that’s all about. That’s all I have, Mr. Chair. Thank you

Thank you, Mr. Bromley. Next on my list is Mr. Krutko.

Thank you, Mr. Chair. In regard to the area of Education, Culture and Employment, I believe that this department has a very important role to play in light of the economic downturn that we’re in. I think it’s a good opportunity that we have to not only provide training and stimulus to our communities and also throughout the Northwest Territories, and get our people ready for the potential of the upkeep of the areas such as development and, more importantly, around our communities.

I note that you do have programs and services in regard to the college programs, trades, and I think that the Arctic College in Inuvik with the portable trades unit that they have going to Tuk this spring and then to McPherson next summer. I was in Aklavik last week and this is something that they’d also like to see. I think it’s the small communities piggybacking on community projects.

Right now there’s the construction of the road in Aklavik and Tuk to Site 177 and I’ve spoken with the leaders in Aklavik about looking at some sort of a training program. I noted that you had the Arctic College Heavy Equipment Operators Training Program in the Deh Cho and the South Slave communities. I think that something like that should be considered whenever the government spends money to look at these types of projects, especially in regard to the road from Aklavik to the gravel source. It’s a good opportunity to get the people trained in regard to operating equipment and the potential of getting them certified, so when the pipeline does come and the development comes behind it, that you have people ready to go, giving them their certification that they’re going to need and, more importantly, take advantage of those programs in our small communities where there’s high unemployment. In regard to Aklavik, they don’t really have much economic diversity by way of any industry of any sort, but this is an opportunity where they can possibly extend that project over a two or three-year program so that you can actually train the people, get them certified and also get the job done to build a road to the gravel source.

I think it’s something that this government should consider working with Education and the different departments, either Transportation or Public Works, so any time there’s any major capital dollars being expended, the Department of ECE should look at a training component for those capital expenditures and see how we can best drive it at getting people trained up for those jobs. The same thing should apply to the Housing Corporation, working with ECE in regard to the trades unit that I talked about in Inuvik through the Arctic College there. Getting people trained in regard to the apprenticeships by

way of carpentry, electricians, plumbers. It’s equipped to do that and I think it’s a good start in using that asset.

I think that we do have to realize that there is going to be a slowdown here. I think that in some cases there are pros and cons to slowdowns, but I think it’s a good opportunity for government and communities and the people of the Northwest Territories to just step back, take a deep breath and get some training in and, more importantly, take advantage of those capital projects that we, as government, put out there.

The other area in regard to the trades is looking at enhancing women and aboriginal people to enter the Apprenticeship Training Program, again, I think it’s those types of investments that we make that really improve the quality of life for people, especially in those different segments from women and aboriginal people to take advantage of those economic opportunities in the North and, more importantly, the programs that we try to deliver on behalf of them. Also, I think it’s very important that we start working closer with aboriginal organizations in regard to groups that are responsible for delivering programs and services on behalf of the aboriginal organizations in regard to the scholarship programs they have, the dollars they’re able to get through the federal Indian Affairs programs and services and match their programs with ours. I think by doing that it will be able to help more people out.

The other areas in regard to income support, I know we had a long discussion about it today but I think that...I mentioned, you know, trying to find ways to make people make positive choices and being self-reliant. I think income support has to find a way of not making people feel like they’re going to get penalized if they go to work. If anything, through income support you should be supporting the local entrepreneurs either saving money by way of you pay a portion of their salary, they pay a portion of the salary, get the people on income support to work three days a week, or a week, every two weeks, but I think at least get them back into the workforce. But don’t find a way that basically people are not stimulated to do that because they feel that they’re going to get penalized if they basically...I thought that was the whole intent of income support when we first rolled it out, is that people will make positive choices, either go to Arctic College or take upgrading or take a trade or take a course or get part-time work. I think we’re not seeing that here and I think that this government has to do more to find ways of working around that.

The other thing that I feel that we have to do a better job on income support is the seniors’ support programs we have. It very much alarms me when we hear people speaking at the Beaufort leaders

meeting talking about an 80-year-old grandmother being refused income support because she has one of her family members taking care of her in her own home and because of that, she wasn’t able to get the fuel subsidy from the Housing Corporation. The person was just so frustrated that they just gave up and she continues to pay for her own fuel. I think that the whole idea of the seniors’ programs and support program is to keep them in their homes, keep them in their home communities and keep them out of institutions and save this government money. The cost of putting someone into a health care system or even through the corrections system is somewhere in the range of $80,000 a year. Keeping someone in their home, we are probably looking at $8,000 to $18,000 a year for the cost to operate and maintain that home. Those are the things we have to look at when we look at income support.

I know there was an attempt to increase the threshold by way of the fuel subsidy, so you could try to get more people involved. Surprisingly or not, it did the opposite. We increased the threshold and people went to apply for the fuel subsidy program and they found out that they were only getting 400 litres or something for a whole year, which didn’t work out. Because of the way our thresholds are scheduled and the way we allocate the program, it should be universal right across the board. I think that is something we have to look at too, especially with the high cost of maintaining their home and especially seniors. We have to find a way of how we determine those thresholds. How do we do the assessments of how much of a subsidy program you are going to receive? Get away from the thresholds and how we do the assessments. Find ways to get these programs and services to these people. While people are up into their 70s and they have to go back to work or get a second job because they just can’t make it on their pensions, but they still can’t be eligible for the income support programs, for me, that’s something that has to be considered by ECE regarding how those programs are delivered and administered. Those are the areas that I wanted to raise questions on.

On the issues regarding official languages, I know you are looking at spending over $6 million. The issues I hear from my communities are they can only hire people on a short-term basis. In most cases, they cannot operate and maintain their language and cultural centres in our communities and regions because there is inadequate funding. I think we have to find a way for those languages that are in distress and that need assistance from this government, especially the Gwich’in language and Inuktitut language in my region, I think we have to be able to look at that. Again, that’s something we have to seriously consider looking at in light of the challenges that we face. We do have to find

ways to keep those organizations functional but keep them fighting the uphill challenges of trying to retain and enhance the languages in the different cultures.

Thank you for the opportunity to ask you questions in general comments. I look forward to the rest of the presentation. Thank you.

Thank you, Mr. Krutko. I have nobody else on my list. Mr. Bromley.

Thank you, Mr. Chair. I wanted to add a couple of more comments very briefly. I would like to see the department reinstate the $80,000 for Skills Canada support. This is something that is not costly, but I think it’s an effective program. The department had some conditions there which they would support. Committee was in touch with Skills Canada and provided the department with a copy of their response. Obviously they are doing exactly what the department would like to see happen. So I will be bringing a motion forward on that later.

I also want to mention the Aurora College programs in the area of renewable energy, energy efficiency, energy planning that’s completely missing in action still, despite the fact that we have been moving strongly towards spending tens of millions of dollars in this area as our people themselves in every community. We are saddled with the unfortunate situation where we know it should be done, but we just don’t know how to do it. The opportunities are huge for both employment and savings, reducing costs to people, if we have a skilled workforce here. So I am hoping the Minister will tell us some good things are going to be happening very soon on that front.

Again, highlighting with Aurora College, the loss of the diploma program for translators. I know there are programs happening in communities and stuff, but it’s not a certification diploma program and that’s what is needed for the sorts of jobs that are available such as in this very Legislative Assembly. I still encounter through your examples and situations, we hear about on the news where programs are dropped because of low subscription in Fort Smith, whereas the evidence is when those things are moved to another campus, the attendance goes up, the number of students goes up. I hope there will continue to be some tune-ups to Aurora College to address some of these issues. Thank you.

Thank you, Mr. Bromley. General comments. I have nobody else on my list. Is committee agreed that we have concluded general comments?