Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

AND FURTHER that not withstanding rule 88(2) the Special Committee on National Unity shall consist of six Members;

AND FURTHERMORE that the following Members be appointed to the Special Committee on National Unity:

Honourable Don Morin Member for Tu Nedhe

Honourable Jim Antoine Member for Nahendeh

Honourable Stephen Kakfwi Member for Sahtu

Mr. Roy Erasmus Member for Yellowknife North

Mrs. Jane Groenewegen Member for Hay River

Mr. John Ningark Member for Natilikmiot

AND FURTHERMORE, that the terms of reference for the Special Committee on National Unity be established as follows:

1. The themes that will serve as the basis for the Special Committee's consultation with the residents of the Northwest Territories be:

a) Ensuring the principles and/or resolutions reflect the concerns of Canadians for their well-being and the future of their children, including social policy renewal, health care and youth. b) Securing a meaningful role for aboriginal leaders in the national unity process, and c) Recognition that Canada includes both

territories and provinces and the territories must be included in the national unity and reform of the federation processes.

2. Oversee and monitor a Northwest Territories consultation process during the fall/early winter of 1997 which will include consultation by Members with their constituents through constituency meetings, questionnaires and toll free, electronic mail or web site communications.

3. Provide strategic advice on the range of consultative mechanisms which Members can use to obtain reaction from their constituents, recognizing that the NWT constitutional development agenda is already overloaded in terms of creation of two new territories and self-goverment issues.

4. Ensure that Members and NWT residents are provided with regular updates and analysis on the national consultation process with particular reference to how aboriginal and Northwest Territories' issues are being addressed.

5. Prepare a report based on consultations and including recommendations for the Assembly to consider at a special session which may be convened in December 1997.

AND FURTHERMORE, the Special Committee on National Unity shall:

a) conduct its business in a manner approved by the Committee and in accordance with the Rules of the

Legislative Assembly;

b) be provided with the necessary administrative and professional support by the Legislative Assembly and the Government of the Northwest Territories;

c) be empowered to retain the services of such professional staff and advisers as deemed advisable by the Committee; and

d) be provided the necessary funds to carry out its responsibilities from the appropriations of the Legislative Assembly.

The motion is in order. To the motion, Mr. Arlooktoo. Question has been called. All those in favour? All those opposed? Motion is carried. Motions. Item 17, first reading of bills. Item 18, second reading of bills. Item 19, consideration in committee of the whole of bills and other matters. Tabled Document 93-13(4), Family Law 3, 4, 5 and 6 and Bill 19, Municipal Statutes Amending Act, No. 2. With Mr. Steen in the Chair.

Thank you, Mr. Chairman. Mr. Chairman, to the motion. I do not support the motion. I will tell you the reason why. Mr. Chairman, the motion proposed in amendment by placing the community of Whale Cove in the proposed electoral district of Arviat. I will tell you the reason why I do not support that part of the motion. According to Section 23 of the Electoral Boundary Commission Act, it requires the Commission to take into consideration the powering factor in preparation of its report, this is on page 1, part of the introduction. A) Geographic and demographic consideration including scarcity, density or rate of growth of population of any part of Nunavut. I understand that the fastest growing community in the Northwest Territories is Arviat, perhaps also Gjoa Haven. Mr. Chairman, because the Section 23 clearly states that you have to take into account the rate of growth of population, that is why I do not support that portion of the motion. Mr. Chairman, Section A also talks about accessibility, geographic and by that sense, I do see that Mr. Arlooktoo has a point of not wanting to have Arviat part of the Sanikiluaq.

The distance between Arviat, the distance between Whale Cove and Sanikiluaq does not go inside with the Section 23 which talks about the geography and accessibility. If you look at the map of Hudson Bay, the distance between Whale Cove and Sanikiluaq is greater than any of Whale Cove and any other community in that area. So, Mr. Arlooktoo has a valid point. I support Mr. Arlooktoo in that area because the distance is too far and there are no family ties, if there are any at all, may be very few between the two communities. If you think I am contradicting myself, I am not because I am reading this section 23 in part of the introduction.

Now where do we put Whale Cove in this respect? I have no idea. That is why I asked the question on Friday, what do the people of Arviat think about this thing that we are considering, were considering Friday and today. Thank you, Mr. Chairman.

Thank you Mr. Chairman. Mr. Chairman, for obvious reasons I also will not be supporting the amendment to the motion. Mr. Chairman, there are a number of points I believe that need clarification and background as relates to the

discussion that took place in the committee of the whole on Friday.

Mr. Speaker, for the most part I do not think the real issue is whether Sanikiluaq gets its own seat, whether Whale Cove should remain in the riding of Rankin Inlet or should go with Arviat. Mr. Speaker, I think the issue is the process that was put in place to get to this point. Mr. Speaker, last Wednesday, I agreed with my colleagues that I would accept Option C of the Boundaries Report which indicated that Arviat and Baker Lake would each have their own seat as it pertains to my riding. There are also other changes to the boundaries throughout the Eastern Arctic. Mr. Speaker, when I left that meeting, it was my understanding and my impression, I agreed to Option C and that is what was going to be delivered to this House.

Mr. Speaker, I speak of the process that was used to get to this point, I refer to the fact that it was my understanding after I agreed to Option C that is what was going to be presented. I also indicated to my colleagues that I would not be in the House on Friday, as I would be attending a funeral in Arviat. Due to my work schedule, my plans changed and I did come to the House to be shocked and surprised to find this amendment in front of me indicating that what I agreed to was no longer in place. It was radically changed to have Whale Cove join up with Arviat. Mr. Speaker, that is one issue. To me that is not acceptable.

The other issue, Mr. Chairman, is I could live with the fact that there was an amendment. This is politics and it happens. I do not have to like it. I can tell you very clearly that I did not like it and I still do not, but I will live with it. The other issue, Mr. Speaker, that compounded this decision was when I brought forward in this Chamber on Friday a request to delay, just to delay the vote on this issue until the people of Whale Cove and my community of Arviat were properly, honestly and openly consulted. Mr. Speaker it is one thing for my colleagues, some of the Ordinary Members to abstain from a vote, I can understand that. Mr. Speaker, I have great difficulty when I see some Members of this Cabinet vote against allowing a delay in this issue so that consultation could take place in both communities. Mr. Speaker, we hear for the last two years from the Premier and other Ministers about openness, about consultation, about empowerment and so on and so forth.

Mr. Speaker, this flies directly in the face of what is being preached. I think the people of Arviat and Baker Lake, Rankin, Whale Cove, they should all be given their democratic right to be heard, to be consulted, especially when it is in reference to major changes to their area. Mr. Speaker, I speak for my home community of Arviat. Their wish as it was very clearly pointed out in discussions during the Boundaries Commission tour that they felt due to their size and their rapid growth they should have their own seat as should Baker. Mr. Speaker, we have, as most people in the south know, severe unemployment problems in my community. There is not a whole lot to go around. To me, to put another community with similar problems to join that up with my home community of Arviat, I think is somewhat unfair. Not only unfair to Arviat but also unfair to the other community, Whale Cove.

Mr. Speaker, to me that would be like having ten kids, no job, no money, little food and somebody saying, "Here, here is ten more" when it is very possible that somebody else, another neighbouring community could accept this community as part of their riding such as Rankin, where things are somewhat more positive and booming with the possibilities of the mining industry going to, I think, beyond the verge of exploding which, therefore, would provide opportunities for jobs and a better quality of life for all concerned. Mr. Speaker, we do not have that in my home community. We are struggling to get by and out of nowhere this amendment comes in to here, also take this community and not only that, take it but we are not going to consult with you nor with Whale Cove. Think about it. Is that fair? Is that what this government is all about? Is this a sign of what is going to happen with the upcoming division? While Members of this House sit around and listen to me speak to this issue and refrain from voting or vote against it as some Members of Cabinet did. That is shocking. Unacceptable, Mr. Arlooktoo. Democracy in its worst shape.

What happened here last week, Mr. Chairman, was to me a betrayal. I vote to accept Option C. Option C which would give a seat to Arviat and Baker Lake and to leave that room two days later and have an amendment in there that I was not consulted on, nor was my community, nor the community of Whale Cove. Who is speaking for Whale Cove? That is a good question. Where is their voice? I should not be here speaking for Whale Cove. Mr. Chairman, I have spoken to a number of people in Whale Cove on the weekend. I had numerous calls. I spoke to the Mayor of Whale Cove, the Mayor of Arviat, and a number of constituents. To say the least, they are not pleased with what transpired here on Friday. Mr. Chairman, they are asking for consultation. They are asking to be heard. The Mayor of Arviat made it very clear in his letter that I tabled a few minutes ago in this House, that stated they will not accept the amendment to this motion. Furthermore, in a letter that came from the Mayor of Whale Cove and from a number of conversations I have had with him and his counsellors over the last few days, they have stated very clearly that they have not been consulted. I will say that again. They have not been consulted. They have indicated to me that for the past four or five months, even more so in the last three months, they have been trying to get answers as to why this is being done. Not to have their phone calls returned. That is what was told to me. That is unacceptable.

Mr. Chairman, the letter that came today from the Mayor and council of Whale Cove clearly points out their dissatisfaction with the lack of consultation. They are asking further for a delay in the vote on this amendment until they are properly, honestly and openly consulted. Mr. Chairman, that is not much to ask for. Therefore, I will move that we defer this item until such times as the communities of Arviat and Whale Cove are properly consulted. Thank you, Mr. Chairman.

Thank you, Mr. Chairman. I am not about to respond to my colleague's comments, as they relate to the riding I represent. I do not think I have once said in this House since I have been elected, any disparaging comments about how well any Member represents their ridings. I would not give him the common decency of responding to his comments with respect to my representation. I believe 82 percent of the vote in the last election is an example of how well I represent my riding. We are only getting wrapped up in the emotional aspects of this issue. I just want to tell you that I do talk to my riding on a frequent basis. I do not need any lessons from my colleague from Arviat on democracy.

The Boundaries Commission put forward a Nunavut Electoral Boundaries Commission Act. There is no question that the Whale Cove-Sanikiluaq issue would be a controversial one. I have tried to deal with this issue in a very sympathetic and concise way. At some point, up until yesterday, I had intended to stay out of this debate. I have not appreciated the tone nor the manner in which my colleague from Arviat has addressed it with the Deputy Premier of this commission, and in particular a Member of this Caucus. It is an example of bad manners and inappropriate behaviour. I rest my case, Mr. Chairman. The bottom line is I asked the people of Whale Cove, whom I have known for 30 years, not the last two or three I phoned to ask them what do they wish? Do you hear an echo here? I asked the people of Whale Cove...Mr. Chairman, I wonder if you could ask my colleague from Arviat to at least give me the common decency of letting me conclude my comments, as I gave him the common decency of concluding his.

Thank you, Mr. Chairman. I appreciate that. You know when we talk about integrity in the system, of course, we understand what it means.

Anyway Mr. Chairman, I did speak to some people in Whale Cove. Probably the same people that Mr. O'Brien spoke to. There was only one issue I want to address with you. The bottom line for the people of Whale Cove, they said, whatever constituency they want to be in, they want to make sure it is a Keewatin constituency. Now, whether that is Rankin Inlet,-okay let us say that clearly--whether it is Arviat or wherever, they want to be in a Keewatin constituency. They have no historical relationship with the people from Sanikiluaq. That is no disrespect to the people of Sanikiluaq. That is all they want. I would agree, which I rarely do, with my colleague that perhaps they have not been consulted with as well as we should, but they certainly were consulted on the Nunavut Boundaries Commission. As a matter of fact, I checked with the Nunavut Boundaries Commissioners, and they did ask them three times if they want to meet on this issue. For whatever reason, Whale Cove chose not to. Rightly or wrongly, that is my right. I have spoken with my constituency at some length on this issue.

The bottom line for them, and I do not want to get into a long dissertation. I do not want to get into the sort of idle rhetoric and innuendo. I want to get into what they fundamentally feel inside. The people of Whale Cove have told me that they want to be part of the Keewatin, where they belong and we have to seek some resolve to that. They do not want to be part of, and that is no disrespect to my colleagues in Sanikiluaq or Baffin Island. They have historical connections to Rankin Inlet, families in Rankin Inlet. Good people that I know and have grown up with. They have historical connections in Arviat, et cetera. In my discussions with the Mayor, Peter Kritaqliluk, I believe. I had discussions with him as my colleague did here. I am not so sure how hard or how difficult they are with respect to Whale Cove being part of Arviat. The bottom line for me is that at the end of the day, the people of Whale Cove want to be part of the Keewatin. Somehow or other, this House has to resolve that and the Nunavut Caucus has to come to some concessions on this instead of continuing to be in this destructive mode that I have seen for a number of months now. Frankly, it disappoints me.

Mr. Chairman, I would say to my colleagues, bear in mind the desires of the people of Whale Cove. They cannot in all honesty, and I spoke to them today, expect to have their own riding. It is 250 people. I think they recognize that. They are hoping that some of us will take a common sense approach to this issue, will put the interest of the people as the priority and reach an appropriate accommodation so the people of Whale Cove remain in the Keewatin, either with Arviat or with the community of Rankin Inlet. Thank you, Mr. Chairman.

Thank you, Mr. Chairman. I spent some time on Friday going over the reasons for my motion. I appreciate the fact that the Members now agree with me on the need for Sanikiluaq, because of its remoteness, transportation links, et cetera, the need for them to have their own seat. I appreciate and thank them for that.

The other part of the motion had to do with Whale Cove and a decision needed to be made on the constituency issue, which constituency Whale Cove would belong to. As Mr. Todd pointed out, there is no chance for the community to have its own seat, even though the Mayor has suggested that is their wish. There is no chance of that. The next question would be where do you put Whale Cove? Who do you pair Whale Cove with? I spent some time on Friday trying to explain that Arviat was the most logical choice; population wise, distance wise, family ties, culturally, demographically, the whole works. I did make some effort in talking to the people in Whale Cove and Arviat recently. I was on the phone this morning with Mr. Stanley Arjook, the Mayor of Whale Cove, and explained to him what my motion was and why. I wanted to make it very clear to him that I was as concerned as he was in making sure that Whale Cove gets its due consideration or attention from the MLAs in the Nunavut Legislature, as it always has. I also spent some time on the phone this morning with my old friend Peter Kritaqliluk, the Mayor of Arviat. I have known Peter for many years and developed a fairly close personal relationship with him. I have watched for many years his involvement in the regional and Nunavut wide politics, and I have respect for him. Again, I spent some time with him explaining what my motion was and received some reaction from him. I will not go into a lot of detail but to reiterate the fact that we do need to make a decision today. We need to vote on this motion, which deals with the question of the electoral boundary for Whale Cove and Arviat.

I know there are people in Arviat who desire to have only one MLA for their own community and the same concerns are coming out of one of my own communities, Cape Dorset. In fact, I believe that one of my constituents called up another MLA this morning and expressed that thought. The Mayor of Cape Dorset called me to say that he has also received three calls from Cape Dorset residents that they too would like their own seat. We have to make a decision.

I realize that Cape Dorset may deserve its own seat. We have a similar population as Arviat. We have as many unemployment problems. Our population growth is very high. Then again, you have to think about the community next door, Kimmirut, it is a similar situation. However, there is a couple hundred more people than Whale Cove. It is even a further distance than it is between Whale Cove and Arviat. In fact, Cape Dorset and Kimmirut have no direct transportation links. I, as the MLA from that area and being given the responsibility of making a decision, will go against some of the wishes of the people of Cape Dorset and say this is the most logical way to do it. Cape Dorset and Kimmirut have to stay together. That is the opinion of the majority of the people I spoke to over the summer.

With that, I believe the MLAs need to make a logical choice and make a decision now. What would more consultation result in? You would still have the problem of not being able to give Whale Cove its own seat. It does not make any sense for Whale Cove and Rankin Inlet to be together, so Arviat is the next logical choice.

With that, I thank Members that have expressed support on this issue and hope they will be around for the vote. Thank you.

Thank you, Mr. Chairman. I will be supporting the motion. Before I was an MLA, I was a cultural consultant for the Keewatin region and I know for a fact there are more traditional roots between Arviat and Whale Cove than any other community in the Keewatin. Their languages are similar. They have more people in Whale Cove. A large percent of people are from Arviat. There is a very strong traditional tie between Arviat and Whale Cove. I was talking to an elder this past weekend. This person told me a majority of the people in Whale Cove are originally from Arviat. For people that are from the West, it is hard to understand this. For example, Rae-Edzo would be Arviat and Yellowknife would be Yellowknife and Wha Ti is Whale Cove. It would be hard for Wha Ti to belong to Yellowknife because the people in Yellowknife would be just talking about the Aurora Fund, when Wha Ti is talking about traditional cultural community grassroots issues.

For that reason, Rae Edzo and Wha Ti belong together more than Yellowknife and Wha Ti. It is the same similarity in Rankin Inlet. We have a large percentage of aboriginals and half of that population is now white people. We have a problem in Arviat with birth rates. In Rankin there is a problem with the influx of different cultures coming into the community, I can give you another example. In Iqaluit, the same as Rankin Inlet and Lake Harbour, and the same as Whale Cove where Iqaluit MLAs are just talking about contracts and the Lake Harbour MLA is talking about community empowerment or economic development officer being transferred to the hamlet. There are differences.

If you go back to the traditional roots, Arviat is more related to Whale Cove. For that reason, I support this motion. I have been in the region all of my life. I have not been there just for the last two years. I speak from the elders' perspective. Thank you.

Thank you, Mr. Chairman. I understand, and therefore, respect Sanikiluaq asking for its own seat. I do believe that when Whale Cove said they do not have any family ties with Sanikiluaq people and I believe that. I am not saying that I am willing to interfere with somebody else's riding. I think the person who is representing Whale Cove at the present time is doing his best according to his constituents. I respect all of them, therefore, when residents from Whale Cove said that they wanted to belong to the Keewatin. I think they have that right to do so. Thank you.

Thank you, Mr. Chairman. Mr. Chairman, following the debate since last weekend, I think some areas are getting a bit convoluted. I think we have to keep the debate at an appropriate level. We are being watched by the public. After saying that, Mr. Chairman, I do not think anyone here disputes the fact that Sanikiluaq should get its own seat, I think we have agreed to that. The question before us is what happens to Whale Cove? After listening to the honourable colleague from Arviat and my honourable colleague from Rankin Inlet, which represents Whale Cove, I understand now that over the past few days they have had an opportunity to discuss the issue with the residents of Whale Cove. I believe the people of Whale Cove have the right to request which riding they would like to be with. I have not heard that outlined very well today saying that they want to go one way or the other. It leaves us with the difficulty that we have as to what or where or which constituency does Whale Cove fit under?

Under the Electoral Boundaries Commission Report that was tabled in this house, I think Option B and Option C, as presented by the Electoral Boundaries Commission, puts Whale Cove with Sanikiluaq, which was unacceptable because there are no family ties with that community. There is no logistical transportation routes connecting those two communities. It would be a nightmare to service. That is why Mr. Arlooktoo tried to bring in an amendment that facilitates Sanikiluaq having its own seat and it would also allow Whale Cove to stay with the Keewatin region, where its family and common ties are. We would have to agree with that. The concern is, Mr. Chairman, what does Whale Cove want?

I have a letter from the Mayor of Whale Cove requesting they have their own riding, dated October 6, 1997, Stanley Arjuk, the Mayor of Whale Cove. I do not think it is feasible based on the population amounts in the community because earlier in the debates we discussed representation by population and so on. I would be in favour of the motion put forward by Mr. Arlooktoo because it would seem to be the only logistical thing to do at this time. After saying that, I can understand how the people of Whale Cove feel, wanting their own riding. I appreciate what Mr. O'Brien has said. It has to go somewhere. Perhaps they would prefer to stay with Rankin Inlet. The honourable Member that has been representing them has done very well for the last six years. I do not know but we have to make a decision today. That is why we are charged as legislators to pass legislation. It is sometimes difficult and is sometimes not going to please everyone.

I think that the consultation which has occurred over the past four days should be sufficient based on the statements read by the Member that represents the community. I cannot contravene what the Member that represents the community says unless I would be voting in favour of the motion and supporting Sanikiluaq having its own seat because of the reasons outlined in the motion and because of the debate that we heard here today. Thank you, Mr. Chairman.

Mr. Chairman, I have a motion to present.