Thank you, Mr. Blake. To the motion. Ms. Bisaro.

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. I guess at the outset I should say that maybe I ought to declare a conflict of interest with this motion. However, I’m not going to.

I’d like to thank Mr. Bromley and Mrs. Groenewegen for bringing this motion to the floor. I think it’s a very necessary motion. The whereases in the motion capture pretty much everything that needs to be said, and there are a few things that bear repeating.

I’ve spoken twice to this issue as we’ve gone through the capital budget. I spoke once when we talked about housing; I spoke again when we talked through the Health and Social Services capital budget. As I stated then, I am concerned that the government seems to be placing the emphasis on an Aging in Place Policy and not placing an emphasis on infrastructure and on either enabling someone to build infrastructure or us planning for

the government planning for infrastructure which is desperately needed.

Somebody, just in the last little while, stated that the crisis is going to occur in 2030 or 2031. The crisis is now. There are no spaces available at the Avens Centre. The Aven Manor is full. The Dementia Centre is full. As is mentioned in the motion, it’s a four-year wait to get into the Dementia Centre. It’s an eight-month wait to get into the manor. Unfortunately, pretty much the only way you get into the manor or the way you get into one of the other facilities up there is if somebody passes away and that opens up a space and somebody can move in off the list. That’s pretty tough. That’s not what we want for our residents.

With the two facilities that are being built in Norman Wells and Behchoko, it’s going to take a bit of the pressure off, but those two facilities are going to be full pretty much when they’re finished, and it’s not going to make a big dent in the 200 beds, three times what we need. We need 200 beds come another 10 or 15 years.

When we talked about health, I said that I was dismayed about the lack of planning. We’ve just gone through the Health and Social Services capital budget and there was nothing in that budget that plans for long-term care facilities for our seniors, and at that time I said we know we need the beds, we know the spaces are required, we know we don’t have spaces right now, and yet I just don’t hear the words coming out of the Minister’s or the government’s mouth that says, yes, we’re going to get on that and we’re going to get on that not today but yesterday because we know it’s an urgent need, and by that, I was referring to infrastructure.

We have someone who is willing to take on a project for us, and they are not asking for capital dollars necessarily. I’ve heard concerns from two Members that this is asking for capital dollars. There’s nothing in this motion which speaks to a need for capital dollars. It asks for support, and the project can go ahead with support from this government that basically says in the future we will use your facility. That’s all that they want. They want a guarantee that the GNWT will use the facility.

We’ve got somebody who is willing to take on the project who is innovative. They will use partners from within the community, from outside of the community. They will, as has been pointed out already, be able to build a facility cheaper than what the government can, and that, in my mind, is something that’s a very positive thing.

The motion itself has two parts, and the first part I want to speak to is, as I’ve already talked about, the support. It’s asking for the support. The construction next spring is a very ambitious project on the part of Avens. They want to start next spring because they know that the need is there for the

beds and they want to be able to say we’re going to have beds in a two-year time frame, not a five or a six-year time frame. So, the support that is needed can be varied, and I want to state again it does not have to be capital support. I know that Avens is not asking for capital projects from other communities to be put back so that Avens can build their project.

The second part of the motion, it’s actually the first part, but that the government develop a long-term action plan for the provision of the necessary long-term care beds. That’s part of a lot of my concern, is I don’t see, I don’t hear that the department has a plan. It wasn’t in the capital budget which we just reviewed. I haven’t heard from the Minister that they have a long-term plan for long-term care beds, and it’s known that we need it. It’s known that it’s needed in Hay River where they’ve just built a new hospital without extended care. It’s known that we’re going to need it at Stanton which is going to be built without extended care, and it’s known that we need it in our regional centres, absolutely, and in many of our small communities. We need to get the Minister, the Health and Social Services department, the government to develop a plan for long-term care beds, and that’s what this motion is asking.

I can’t say much else that hasn’t already been said. I am totally in support of this motion, and I would ask my colleagues who can’t support the motion to reconsider, and if they can’t support the motion maybe they will abstain and let this important motion go forward.

Thank you, Ms. Bisaro. To the motion. Mr. Hawkins.

Thank you for the opportunity to speak to this important motion, Mr. Speaker. Often I find myself at Avens talking to people who don’t necessarily live there but they see one day that they may be there. But quite often what I hear from them is they just don’t see the room available for them to retire in a particular place like Avens. This story or narrative could be applied anywhere really, I mean whether you live in Inuvik or Hay River or Fort Simpson, and even in places like Fort Providence or McPherson. I agree with the MLA for Mackenzie Delta that people in his communities probably want to retire or spend their final years around their family, their food, their language, and certainly their friends and loved ones.

I don’t think that this motion is as complex as we’re making it. I think the motion really speaks to the fact that we need a strategy. We can call it a vision. We can call it a plan. I mean, we can even name it after the Minister; I don’t really care. But it talks about doing something useful and saying we need to know where we’re going. As far as I’m concerned, we need to know where we’re going because that will help define how to get there. If we don’t know what we want to do for seniors housing, what do

you think the seniors feel about this particular situation? How do you think the elders in our communities feel about this situation?

Often I get told by these people who are seniors or elders or certainly good friends, I would definitely define most of them as very, very good friends, but they always talk about affordability every single time, access to an affordable place to spend their time. As they look down the path or the journey that they’re going to be taking, they see affordability as a major hurdle. Many of them are working today. They will tell me they can’t afford to retire. That’s the reality. I mean, cost of living is no new subject line for this Legislature. It’s an unfortunate situation, but I know many seniors who continue to work into the years that they really wish they could fully retire. They dreamt of retiring. One day their turn would come up. They were loyal to the system; they paid their taxes; they did their duty; they’re good Canadians and they love their country. Now they’re wondering: does anyone love them as they struggle to find a way to spend those special years without having to go to work if you’re 60 or 65 and, in some cases, even older? There are many cases where I talk to seniors who are just simply, their health is running down and they shake their head and go, we just can’t afford to retire and this is our only option to live, is to work.

I call that an undignified way of treating our special people that we care for very much. I mean, there isn’t a day that doesn’t go by that I hear people talk about how important our elders are, how important our seniors are, how important and we should always keep them in the forefront of our mind. I was listening to Chief Joachim Bonnetrouge the other day and he talked about spending more time with elders and how important those things are. I mean, the point that I’m raising here is the fact that we always have to make sure they are foremost on our minds and we are certainly taking care of them to the best of our abilities.

At Avens in particular, but this could apply anywhere in the Northwest Territories, whether it’s Fort Smith, and soon-to-be Behchoko, it may someday be Fort Providence, a senior or an elder should not think it’s like they hit the lotto if they get in. They should know that their turn is coming, and they will wait. I know the elders in our territory are so respectful and they will wait and they will bide their time. But frankly, many cannot wait, and many will never see a list that big.

In Yellowknife in particular, there’s a waiting list of 50 people. Three are from out of town and the rest of the applicants are spread across particular units, whether it’s the Aven Court, the Aven Ridge, its subsidizer markets, even the dementia centre. Many people want this opportunity to be taken care of, but they want to be part of the solution as well. I don’t want to think of how many seniors have to

struggle just to survive day to day. They’re looking for a fair opportunity and this motion really sets that into motion, as a matter of fact. This motion says that we need a strategy or a vision and we need to find our lens. This is one particular partner, such as the Avens folks.

I mean, there could be different combinations, different ways, whether it’s with a community government. I encourage all community governments to come up with solutions for their seniors and elders. That is the way it gets done. I mean, it’s going to be a long time for us to sit here and wait for the GNWT to do everything. It’s just impossible to imagine. I could make light of that, but that is the fact; it’s going to be a long time before the government solves these problems. So, partnership is the only solution and the only way that should matter because it is the only way that does matter.

I’m going to finish by saying that there are so many people who have led the charge for us, who have blazed the path, taught us many things and they certainly deserve our support. What I’ll say is up until now, they certainly deserve better. Thank you.

Thank you, Mr. Hawkins. Mr. Abernethy.

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. We’ve had an opportunity to look at the motion and the different whereases and we agree with the intent of what the Members are trying to say here today. In fact, we know that there’s a problem coming. Our continuing care report articulated clearly the need for beds in the Northwest Territories and this is something that we’re trying to address.

To that end, we have come forward with Our Elders: Our Communities, which I acknowledge Members have made it clear that this is not an action plan, and I agree, this isn’t an action plan. It’s a strategic framework that will help us form and articulate an action plan.

During business planning the deputy minister of Health and Social Services indicated to committee that we hear them and that we are going to take those additional steps to develop the action plans necessary both on aging in place and on long-term care. This is work that is currently underway and I rearticulated it last week during Committee of the Whole. Rather than developing one single action plan to address all the elements of this strategic framework, we will focus on the different priority areas, the different pillars for aging in place and long-term care. That is work that is currently underway. It’s going to take a bit of time. It is a significant amount of work, but it is being done.

Having said that, we continue to move forward and try to address the needs of our seniors, who are obviously an incredibly important segment of the

population here in the Northwest Territories. We are moving forward to try to support our seniors living or aging in place.

I’ve had an opportunity, as I’m sure many people have, to talk to different seniors throughout the Northwest Territories and one of the common things that I hear is: I would like to stay in my home for as long as possible; if I can’t stay in my home, I’d like to stay in my community as long as possible; and if I can’t stay in my community, I’d like to stay in the region in which I am from for as long as possible; and if I can’t stay in the region, if I get to a point where I need the additional care, then I will go to a territorial facility like the Aven Dementia Cottages. So we’re working with the people to do that.

To do that, there are a number of things that happen. For a healthy individual to stay in the home, one segment, seniors living in public housing, we provide a rent cap for seniors living in housing of $90. The Housing Corp is a great partner in trying to address housing for seniors. We also have home heating subsidies for seniors to help them stay in their homes and afford to live in their homes for as long as possible. For individuals who are in public housing or even individuals who own their homes, there are other programs like the CARE program for healthy individuals to do home repair. We’ve got a visible design aspect of the CARE program which I think is innovative, which has helped individuals when they need to upgrade their homes so that they can include wheelchair ramps or other things so that they can maintain access to their homes. It’s there. The Housing Corp is a great partner. They’re doing incredible work.

We’ve also got the Housing Corp providing funding for preventable maintenance for things like furnace repairs. Right now seniors are the largest group taking advantage of this. We do know or, rather, on top of that, the Department of Health and Social Services is working with our valuable partner, the NWT Seniors’ Society, to identify things we have been doing in communities to help people stay in their homes, things like programs to help people shovel walks or get groceries or do all these different things to help them live in their homes for as long as they can.

But we know that individuals may eventually have to leave their home. We want them there as long as they can. They want to be there as long as they can. When it’s time to leave their homes, obviously people want to stay in their communities as long as they can, and we are working with the Housing Corporation to make that possible.

The Housing Corp, in the current capital and I think last year’s capital, as well, is moving forward or has already completed or is in the process of building five independent living units in the Northwest Territories: Whati, Fort Liard, Fort McPherson, Fort

Good Hope and Aklavik. The Housing Corp has worked with Health and Social Services closely because it’s going to take more than one department to address these problems. It’s going to take the partnerships that the Members are talking about. In these facilities, they have actually incorporated a room where the Department of Health and Social Services could run some programming out of and bring professionals like home support workers and others into those buildings to provide care to the residents of those independent living units so we can keep them in the communities for as long as possible. Eventually, unfortunately, it may become true that individuals do, in fact, need to leave their communities and receive a higher degree or grade of care, and those will be provided in long-term care facilities throughout the Northwest Territories.

We have long-term care facilities. Once we’re done in the Sahtu, we’ll have long-term care facilities in every region of the Northwest Territories. The last one is Sahtu. The Sahtu will bring 18 beds that don’t exist today and the Behchoko facility will bring eight beds that don’t exist today. Based on working with our colleagues across the House, we’ve been able to maintain 10 beds that we almost lost in Hay River for long-term care.

Eventually individuals are going to have to move or get a higher degree of care. That’s where Avens has been such a great partner in the development of the Aven Cottage for the dementia facility here in the Northwest Territories, an incredibly valuable service.

We want to keep moving forward. In addition to continuing to strengthen home and community care services, we obviously need to review and prepare for the increasing demand for a facility-based long-term care, including dementia care, extended care, and to improve and enhance supports for respite care, palliative care, geriatric assessment and restorative care. Long-term care facilities are designed to meet the highest level of care needs for people who cannot live independently, even where there is home care available.

We recognize that sometimes seniors will require a higher level of care than can be provided in their home or in an independent living unit. To meet this need, we’re expanding our complement of long-term care facilities so that this service is available in every region, allowing our seniors and elders to be closer to their families and their homes, which we have heard is what they want.

Over the past eight years, the GNWT has invested heavily, developing and expanding long-term care facilities to a total of approximately $86 million. Today there are a total of 173 long-term care beds. I hear the Members; it’s not enough. We know it’s not enough and we need to do more.

Recently completed and current projects include the expansion and renovation of the Northern Lights Special Care Home in Fort Smith; the Woodland Manor extension, which is maintaining the 10 beds; the construction of the Norman Wells Health Centre, which is 18 beds, which includes the long-term care facility with the 18 beds; the expansion and renovation of the Jimmy Erasmus Long-Term Care Facility in Behchoko, which is the nine beds; and the construction of the Aven Cottages and the Territorial Dementia Facility, which opened four years ago.

When current projects are completed in Behchoko and Norman Wells, the total number of beds available in the Northwest Territories will be 201.

As I mentioned previously, we completed a continuing care review in November 2013. The review identified a number of priority areas for action to provide equity of access to services and address the needs of our aging population. To guide those actions, we developed Our Elders: Our Communities, which is the strategic framework. Based on the recommendations from Members during business planning, we will use the recommendations of the continuing care review to plan for the enhancement and improvement of home and community care services so we can better support seniors as they age. As I indicated and confirmed last week, part of that is a long-term care review and a long-term care action plan. That action plan will be a longer term action plan for the provision of necessary long-term care beds. It will highlight the areas of resources, facilities and timing in order to meet the oncoming needs, the needs for facilities for seniors. It will identify possible partnerships to serve those seniors who have some financial independence in both large and small communities. To that end, Mr. Speaker, there is nothing today stopping somebody from building an independent, non-government funded long-term care facility to meet the needs of the residents of the Northwest Territories.

The plan we are working on is a plan that will take us to 2031 and beyond. It is exactly what the Members are asking for, and regardless of how the vote goes today, it is something we are committed to doing, it is something we are doing and we will continue to move forward with the development of that plan.

I look forward to working with Members, our important partners like the Housing Corp, seniors’ societies from across the Northwest Territories and Avens. We know it needs to be done and we are going to do it.

Where we have a problem with this motion is that it recommends or suggests that we need to enable construction of the proposed 60-bed territorial facility, the Avens facility, by next spring. We are working closely with Avens. We are their partner

and they are our partner. We are partnering with Avens on the pavilion expansion, which is the construction of 29 to 30 new beds and the refurbishing and upgrade of the additional beds that are currently in the facility, which is 29 or 30. It is not 60 new beds in the Northwest Territories. It is 29 new beds and the refurbishing of the existing, to take us to a total of 69 beds in the Avens complex.

We have given Avens $25,000 to participate on a steering committee to help quantify what their ask is. I heard Ms. Bisaro mention that all they want us to do is confirm that we are going to use the beds. We have been working with Avens for a while on this project and they have come to us with a number of different asks. One of them was to guarantee beds. We are certainly exploring that, but right now, the last conversation I had with Avens was, they want us to build it, they want us to pay for the construction of this building and they also want us to pay for the O and M. If this building is built, regardless of whether or not we participate in the construction and capital costs, we are going to be paying the O and M, which we know is about $3.6 million a year.

So we need to do the planning. We need to understand what we are getting ourselves into as we move forward with our important partners, Avens. But to suggest that we will be ready and they will be ready to begin construction in the spring is jumping the queue. We need to work with our partner. We need to identify clearly what their ask is. We are doing that, we are working with them. The first step is to retain and consult and review the data that they have come forward with and that we have as well. We know the end of life of the existing facility is coming; we know there is an urgency. I as Minister of Health and Social Services and a resident of Yellowknife, am committed to making this happen, but we cannot commit to doing it in the timeline specified by this motion.

We have a capital process and we will continue to follow the capital process. I will continue to work with Avens; the staff of the department will continue to work with Avens; we all want the same thing and we will get there, but it would be impossible for us to begin construction or work with them to begin construction in April without actually knowing what their plan is. They have come to us with a large number of plans. We will work with them. We will find a solution. This facility will get built. Thank you.

Thank you, Mr. Abernethy. Mr. Miltenberger. To the motion.

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Just quickly to the process. We have a rigorous capital planning process that has been refined over the decades to where it is today, and we all know that it is fully subscribed to and that we have probably a $3 billion infrastructure deficit that we are working hard to try to address.

We are well through this upcoming year’s capital planning process. Every penny has been accounted for. When I look at this motion, be it 60 beds, 30 beds and a full-scale renovation, I would suggest that we are looking at well over $50 million, a motion that is put on our table as we are probably two-thirds of the way through our capital planning process for this year to start this spring, six months hence. It’s not a realistic motion. It does pose a big problem of queue jumping and they need to do more thorough planning.

In terms of protecting this process and respecting this process, I would suggest that this motion, at least the last part where they want to build within six months, is not doable. Thank you.

Thank you, Mr. Miltenberger. To the motion. I will allow Mr. Bromley to have closing remarks.

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Thank you to all of my colleagues for your comments on this motion. I think it has attracted a lot of thoughtful consideration.

I would like to start by mentioning, of course, that when you look at the capital plans, we are finishing up a couple of facilities in the regions, but that’s it. Where are they? It’s not that we’ve just started talking about our capital facilities, our facilities for seniors.

What this motion is, it’s a call for a plan. It’s a call for a plan because there is no plan right now. We had government report after government report; no plan is in place. I know the Minister has heard the Members’ call for getting ahead of this looming deficit with a plan that shows, in fact, what steps will be taken, what resources are required. Let’s see that capital plan, let’s see a timeline, one that clearly lays out all of those things and, in particular, the partnerships.

I think Avens is profiled here because it has demonstrated what can be achieved. As the Minister and others have said, when there are incredible partnerships, when the community plays a role and when business plays a role, when everybody gets together, non-government organizations and so on, and discusses there is a real urgent need, let’s move forward, and they have done that with government participation and on a timeline that recognized the need and not government’s continual delaying and lack of planning to get things on the capital plan.

I think that what we’re really talking about is respectful treatment of our elders, recognizing that, as some have said, it goes beyond just beds. It goes into the areas of addressing elder abuse and the desire of our seniors to participate in the benefits of the facilities wherever they can, wherever those facilities may be, be they territorial facilities in Yellowknife or locally.

I think three of my colleagues have mentioned concerns that this is a Yellowknife project and doesn’t recognize the community needs. If that’s the case, then I take that as my fault, because I read this as territorial. The elements here describe the territorial situation and it calls for a territorial action plan in both small and large communities.

It does indeed address Avens, which is, again, a project that has had amazing community participation and partnerships with business and so on and, because of that, is actually doing some site preparation, again with support of this government, at least philosophically, to get that work started.

We can spin this every way we want, but the thing is, there is great need. There is an amazing bunch of people who are ready to move, committed to seniors. Their focus is seniors. Their respect is for seniors, and they are going to come up with a process to get it done. They see the need. They are serving seniors from all over the Northwest Territories.

But this motion is not meant to just call for that. This motion is to address long-term care. Everybody, every Member in this House wants their constituents who are seniors to have the ability to access facilities to the extent possible as close as they can to home. That is a given. I don’t operate on any other basis and I know the Minister doesn’t either. So let’s put a plan in place, let’s get this addressed.

The Minister mentioned seniors housing. I am not aware of seniors housing in Yellowknife, other than Avens of course. I think there is essentially none here, despite the fact that we have so many seniors and they are rising at triple the rate of the NWT. We’ve called for this motion to address those sorts of things.

I appreciate the Minister’s recognition of the need for this plan and I would say a commitment to get it done already. I appreciated his recognition that we can’t rely on Aging in Place to get what we need done. We need to recognize that, in fact, even if we are wildly successful with that, there will be huge needs for these facilities.

The Minister mentioned there’s nothing stopping anybody from providing for seniors facilities, private enterprise. Obviously, something must be because it hasn’t happened yet and this motion calls for the Minister to assist society in whatever measure is needed to get that done. I agree that private industry should be playing an important role in this area, but we aren’t down south. The Minister knows the cost of living, the cost of operation and so on. So there are some real issues that the Minister could play an important role in.

Again, this was not meant to be a Yellowknife-centric motion. The Avens facility is a territorial facility. This motion is meant to get a plan in place

for throughout the Northwest Territories to address the needs our seniors in terms of long-term care beds in a very respectful way.

I, again, thank my colleagues for all of their comments and I look forward to a recorded vote. Mahsi.

Thank you, Mr. Bromley. The Member has requested a recorded vote. All those in favour, please rise.

Thank you. All those opposed, please rise.

Thank you. All those abstaining, please rise. Results are seven in favour, 10 against. The motion is defeated.

---Defeated

Item 18, first reading of bills Mr. Moses.

The motion is on the floor. The motion is in order. To the motion.

Bill 33, An Act to Amend the Elections and Plebiscites Act, No. 2, has had first reading.

---Carried

Item 19, second reading of bills. Item 20, consideration in Committee of the Whole of bills and other matters: Bill 25, An Act to Amend the Education Act; Bill 27, Miscellaneous Statute Law Amendment Act, 2014; Bill 29, Human Tissue Donation Act; Bill 30, An Act to Amend the Public Service Act; Bill 32, An Act to Amend the Pharmacy Act; Committee Report 7-17(5), Report on the Development of the Economic Opportunities and

Mineral Development Strategies; and Tabled Document 115-17(5), Northwest Territories Capital Estimates 2015-2016, with Mrs. Groenewegen in the chair.

I’d like to call Committee of the Whole to order today. There are a number of items as listed by the Speaker that are before Committee of the Whole. What is the wish of committee? Ms. Bisaro.

Thank you, Madam Chair. We would like to continue consideration of Tabled Document 115-17(5), Northwest Territories Capital Estimates 2015-2016, with the Department of Natural Resources and the Legislative Assembly. Thank you.

Thank you, Ms. Bisaro. Does committee agree?

Thank you, committee. We’ll commence with that after a brief break.

---SHORT RECESS