In the Legislative Assembly on February 3rd, 1998. See this topic in context.
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The Chair Vince Steen
I would like to call the committee to order. For consideration by the committee today, we have Bill 8, Appropriation Act, 1998-99; Committee Report 02-13(5); Committee Report 03-13(5); Committee Report 04-13(5); Committee Report 05-13(5) and Tabled Document 15-13(5); 1998-99 Budget Address and Tabled Document 19-13(5), Guidelines for Implementing Public/Private Partnerships. I
would like to get some direction from Mr. Ootes on how we wish to proceed.
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Jake Ootes Yellowknife Centre
Thank you, Mr. Chairman. That we consider Bill 8, Appropriation Act along with Committee Report 02-13(5) and Committee Report 03-13(5) and that we carry on with the Department of Aboriginal Affairs, followed by the Legislative Assembly.
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Some Hon. Members
Agreed.
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The Chair Vince Steen
Thank you. We will proceed as indicated after we take a 15-minute break.
--Break
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The Chair Vince Steen
I would like to call the committee to order. Before we resume our review of the main estimates for the Aboriginal Affairs Ministry, I wish to clarify the process we will follow as the committee of the whole conducts its review of the 1998-99 Main Estimates.
I would like to begin by reminding all Members that our rules limit the amount of time that a Member may speak to a matter under discussion in committee of the whole. Rule 79 reads as follows:
79(1)No Member shall speak for more than ten minutes at any one time in committee of the whole; and
79(2)Subject to the discretion of the Chair, a Member may speak more than once to a matter under discussion, but not until every other Member wishing to speak has spoken.
As your Chair, I wish to permit meaningful input into to this review process by all honourable Members. However, as Chair, I also have the responsibility to ensure that business of committee of the whole is dealt with in an efficient and timely manner.
In an attempt to better manage the time available to us and to ensure all Members have an opportunity to provide their comments, I wish to improve the review process by adhering more stringently to our rules regarding speaking time limits in committee of the whole.
The Chairs will permit each Member to speak up to ten minutes at a time and to frame any questions they may have for a Minister within the context of their comments. After all Members wishing to speak have spoken, the Chair will ask the Minister to respond to all comments that may have been made by Members. At the Chair's discretion, Members may be recognized to make secondary comments. This approach should help to ensure more efficient use of our time.
Once again, for the record, I would ask all Members to assist us in the departmental reviews by posing their specific questions or concerns under the appropriate activity. General comments should be exactly that, general comments. It is not a question and answer period.
In summary, your committee Chairs wish to permit meaningful debate here in committee of the whole. The cooperation of all Members in this regard will be greatly appreciated. Thank you. With that, I would like to ask the Minister, Mr. Antoine, if he would like to bring in witnesses.
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Jim Antoine Nahendeh
Yes, Mr. Chairman.
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Some Hon. Members
Agreed.
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The Chair Vince Steen
Thank you. Will the Sergeant-at-Arms bring in the witnesses and seat them. For the record, Mr. Antoine, could you introduce your witnesses.
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Jim Antoine Nahendeh
Thank you, Mr. Chairman. Mr. Chairman, to my right is Mr. Fred Koe, he is the minister, and to my left is Mr. Peter Bannon.
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The Chair Vince Steen
Welcome to the committee. We were on Appropriation Act, 1998-99 Main Estimates and we were on Aboriginal Affairs, general comments. Are there any further general comments? Mr. Krutko.
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David Krutko Mackenzie Delta
Thank you, Mr. Chairman. Regarding my comments yesterday, I think that the comments that I am making are not only for myself, but, I believe, all aboriginal groups, regardless if you are Gwich'in, Inuvialuit, Inuk or basically one of the aboriginal groups from the southern part of the territory, having the concern in relation to your family ties. Regardless if you have relatives in Alaska or basically if you have relatives in Greenland, Labrador or Quebec, it affects every one of the aboriginal groups in some way or another.
The point I am trying to make with my questions Mr. Chairman, is that I do not think we should take the position, standby and leave this matter to someone else because we hope that they will take care of it. The reason I am raising it is because I feel strongly enough that we have to find a way to help improve the family ties between the different aboriginal peoples and their relatives who live in Alaska or basically Quebec or Greenland. I am not asking these questions because I want to get my face in the newspaper. I am asking it because it is an issue that has to be looked at.
I use an example in regard to the Inuvialuit who have a lot of relations in northern Alaska. A lot of people that presently live in Aklavik originated from Alaska at the turn of the century, I think, in regard to the Gwich'in who basically originated as a tribe from Alaska through the northern part of Yukon and into the northwestern part of the Northwest Territories, Mr. Chairman, I believe that those ties of those aboriginal people have to be kept in mind when we are talking about relatives here.
We are not talking about the colour of your skin or basically a line that separates, from basically Israel or Syria or wherever. There is a line there that separates based on culture. Basically, you are talking about a group of people who are related across different jurisdictions. The point I am trying to make is that there are issues that affect those aboriginal groups regardless if it is harvesting rights. In the case of the Gwich'in they have a strong argument in regard to the Alaskan government because of the Porcupine Caribou issue and the calving grounds of that caribou herd. So regardless of what happens in Alaska, it could have a bearing on what happens to the aboriginal people in the Northwest Territories.
I think the point I am trying to make is, regardless if it is a question about the environment, economics or protecting our wildlife, we have to keep in mind that at the end of any one of those issues, it is the people's concerns that we have to take care of at the end of the day. The question I ask the Minister is that there are no real answers to any of my questions because it seems like no one really knows what one department is doing or one Minister is doing to deal with this matter. I hope my other colleagues could be patient and realize where I am coming from on this matter and allow me the opportunity to continue on and ask questions to the appropriate Ministers on these particular matters because it does affect the Inuvialuit and the Gwich'in of my riding. I would like to ask the Minister, is there any possible way that his department can look at the possibility of finding resources or someone within his department to seriously take a look at the whole question of what the effects of families between the different jurisdictions are and try to find a way to bring these groups closer together rather than keeping them apart by boundaries? Thank you, Mr. Chairman.
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John Ningark Natilikmiot
Thank you, Mr. Chairman. Mr. Chairman, I think our colleague, Mr. Krutko, eloquently talked about the relationship of the aboriginal people in this country and also with another country, in this case, the United States, in Alaska. I believe that to be true. We have met with our relatives many times during many meetings in this country at a circumpolar conference, for that matter, Mr. Chairman. Quebec talks about separation many times in the past. The uncertainty of Quebec being part of Canada allows myself and the people of the Nunavut area, the eastern Arctic in this case, to think about our relatives in northern Quebec. I do not believe that northern Quebec Inuit want to be part of a separate Quebec. They have let us know about that concern, Mr. Chairman. I believe we had the opportunity at this time and in the past, a responsibility of ensuring that our brothers, our relatives in northern Quebec are accommodated in their wish to be part of Nunavut should Quebec separate or should they not have their own land recognized to be distinctly Inuit land.
Has the Minister responsible for Aboriginal Affairs had any indication from the Inuit of northern Quebec? They wish to be heard about their concern that they do not want to be part of Quebec when it separates. Has the Minister had any discussions, any correspondence with the Inuit people of northern Quebec or from the government, for that matter, about what I have just stated? Thank you, Mr. Chairman.
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The Chair Vince Steen
Thank you, Mr. Ningark. Any further general comments on Aboriginal Affairs? Mr. Erasmus.
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Roy Erasmus Yellowknife North
Thank you, Mr. Chairman. Part of the responsibility of Aboriginal Affairs is to deal with land claims and self-government negotiations. The First Nations living within my constituency are the Yellowknives Dene First Nation. They, of course, were included in the Dene/Metis discussions for many, many years which finally fell apart somewhere around 1991, or something. Following that, a year or so later, they began discussions with the federal government. Later on it began to include the territorial government representatives as well. Mr. Speaker, the Yellowknives First Nations have been trying to resolve their land disputes with the federal government for many, many years. I suppose you could say decades. They are now involved in the First Nations in Akaitcho territory, as they call it.
Mr. Chairman, there are other aboriginal governments that have finalized their claims and these First Nations are now able to move ahead with economic development. They have a lot more to say on the lands within their traditional areas. They have a lot more influence on what occurs in their traditional area as well as on their selected lands. They are able to concentrate on other things rather than trying to settle their outstanding claims. That is not so with the Yellowknives Dene First Nation. They are still struggling to settle their outstanding claims which, for the last while, they have been trying to do through the treaty entitlement process. I understand that they are trying to do some sort of an amalgamated claim which includes comprehensive claim and treaty entitlement.
It has been a long, drawn-out process, Mr. Chairman, and it does take a lot of time and energy of the leadership so that they are not totally able to concentrate on other economic and social ventures that they would otherwise be able to for the betterment of their membership. Mr. Chairman, what I am trying to lead up to is that this government, part of its responsibilities is to participate in these discussions with the Akaitcho First Nations. I am trying to urge the department to assist the Akaitcho First Nations, not only the Akaitcho First Nations but the Deh Cho and the Dogrib First Nations, so that they can complete their respective land negotiations so that all three of these groups can get past this hurdle and on to the next stage which is to start getting into economic ventures and concentrate on other problems that their memberships have such as social problems. We all know that we have horrendous social problems as well as a burgeoning birth rate. Those types of things we have to tackle. When the leadership is taking a lot of their time in trying to finalize land claim negotiations which seem to have the rules of the game changed periodically by whichever government happens to be in power in Ottawa, it takes a lot out of the leadership. I would like to urge the Minister and his staff to do everything within their power and abilities to help the groups that have not finalized their land claims negotiations and treaty entitlement negotiations to finalize or at least come very, very close within the lifetime of this government. Thank you, Mr. Chairman.
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The Chair Vince Steen
Thank you, Mr. Erasmus. Are there any further general comments on the department's budget? I would then like to ask the Minister if he would like to respond to the general comments and questions that have been posed by the Members.
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Jim Antoine Nahendeh
Thank you, Mr. Chairman. Mr. Chairman, with regard to the honourable Member, Mr. Krutko's comments on the concerns of finding resources and finding someone in the department to bring groups together, we have not really received anything formal from the Inuvialuit and the Gwich'in to do this work. These groups are strong-minded First Nations on their own, wanting to handle their internal affairs and their relationship with their relatives in Alaska with the Inuvialuit and the Gwich'in. I have attended the Fort MacPherson Gwich'in gathering two years ago where the Gwich'in of Yukon and Alaska got together. There is a strong sense of community where they wanted to handle this internally. If there is a formal request from these First Nations then certainly, we will take a look at it. Thank you.
With regard to the honourable Member, Mr. Ningark, if there were any requests from the Inuit in Quebec, we have not heard anything officially from them requesting closer ties between the Inuit of northern Quebec and of Nunavut. We have not discussed this. There is a circumpolar initiative which is this government's initiative as well. There is a certain polar initiative that deals with all the northern parts of this continent as well as Europe, Greenland, Alaska and Russia that have met occasionally. We encourage that. Thank you.
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The Chair Vince Steen
If there are no more general comments, does the committee agree that we proceed to the detail of the estimates?
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Some Hon. Members
Agreed.
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Tommy Enuaraq Baffin Central
Thank you, Mr. Chairman. Do we have a quorum?
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The Chair Vince Steen
I do not recognize a quorum. I will ring the bell. Thank you, Mr. Enuaraq.
I recognize a quorum. We will proceed on. I believe I had consensus to proceed to the activity summary, the detail of the estimates. If we would then move to page 2-40, activity summary, Aboriginal Affairs, operations and maintenance, total operations and maintenance, $2.765 million. Mr. Roland.
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Floyd Roland Inuvik
Thank you, Mr. Chairman. Yesterday during general statements, the Minister spoke on an issue of funding that came to this government from the federal government. Maybe the Minister could correct me if I am wrong, but my understanding is that he stated the funding comes to general revenue and through that process is not specifically identified to any aboriginal group, but it is to all the people of the territories. Is that correct?
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Jim Antoine Nahendeh
In the Formula Financing Agreement, that is true. Thank you.
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Floyd Roland Inuvik
Thank you, Mr. Chairman. Can the Minister inform us then, with all the negotiations that are happening throughout the Northwest Territories, a lot of that will entail some funding. Where will this funding come from? For example in the Beaufort Delta region, where I come from, there are some negotiations going on that will entail quite a bit of delivery of the programs now existing through the GNWT. Is the funding for that included in those discussions?
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Jim Antoine Nahendeh
Thank you, Mr. Chairman. Mr. Chairman, in the negotiations it is true the negotiations that we arrive with costs for the programs and services. The GNWT will be paying our share for the programs and services. Part of the negotiation is the incremental cost which this ministry has been working with the federal government to try to determine what this is going to be. We are pretty close to an arrangement with them to determine what this incremental cost is going to be. Yes, the funding for the programs and services has been negotiated. Some of it will be coming from the Formula Financing Agreement.
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Floyd Roland Inuvik
Thank you, Mr. Chairman. Can the Minister inform us how that funding is broken down when they discuss the different delivery of programs? Is it per capita? Is it based on historic amounts funded through past government expenditures?
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Jim Antoine Nahendeh
Thank you, Mr. Chairman. Mr. Chairman, the Beaufort Delta self-government are negotiations the first of its kind. It has not been done in any other place before. It is a historic process. We are breaking new ground in this area here. That is what the negotiations are all about is trying to determine how to come out with a figure to provide the programs and services that the Beaufort Delta First Nations have put on the table for negotiations. Thank you.
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Floyd Roland Inuvik
Thank you, Mr. Chairman. Could the Minister inform us then, as these discussions are going, he mentioned yesterday some of the process involved in the negotiations, some of the different steps taken into achieving signing some of these agreements or sub-agreements. When would this Assembly as we know it look at some of these agreements or how would that process be done?
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Jim Antoine Nahendeh
Thank you, Mr. Chairman. Mr. Chairman, as the sub-agreements are being reached by the Northwest Territories negotiators at the table, these sub-agreements will be coming to me, as the ministry, and I will have to have it go by Cabinet for approval. Once it is approved by Cabinet, then we will inform the Members about their arrangements in the sub-agreement. As the sub-agreements come forward, they become part of the agreement-in-principle so there are about 32 different items that are on the table for the Beaufort Delta. If I am correct, there are about six areas of sub-agreements that have been worked on and been developed at the present time. So we have a long ways to go before we reach an agreement-in -principle. Once that is done, that is the total package, and it will be moved forward so that the public will be aware of the contents. It is some ways down the line. Yesterday we talked about the timing. It is hard to estimate that. There are Members in this House who have been involved in negotiations so it is hard to tell exactly, pinpoint, when this is going to be done. We mentioned somewhere between six months to about a year or 12 months timeframe before this is concluded. Thank you.
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Floyd Roland Inuvik
Thank you, Mr. Chairman. My final question, using the formula financing negotiations that happened in the past, when formula financing between this government and federal government took place, that happened within, for example, FMBS or Finance possibly, but those discussion swent on and an agreement was signed. For example, we saw just recently the old Formula Financing Agreement put on the table quite a bit later, but we were already operating under it. I am just wondering if that is the process that is going to be followed or because this is a new process, there will be a new process developed as well in recognizing the changes that have to occur. Thank you.
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Jim Antoine Nahendeh
Thank you. The honourable Member is asking for a process on how this is going to get done. Again, it is something that is new that we are attempting to do. There is going to be a new financial arrangement that will be negotiated as part of the self-government agreement. I do not know what else to say except that it is going to be something we are working with. We do not know for sure exactly how that is going to eventually happen. Thank you.
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The Chair Vince Steen
Thank you, Mr. Antoine. For the record, I am on page 2-40, activity summary, Aboriginal Affairs, operations and maintenance, total operations and maintenance, $2.765 million. I recognize Mr. Krutko.
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David Krutko Mackenzie Delta
Thank you, Mr. Chairman. Just following up on discussion of Mr. Roland, the Minister said that all the funds are put into one pot, and basically it is there for everyone. Is it not true there are funds that flow from Ottawa which are earmarked aboriginal funds in regard to insured health benefits where those funds can only be used for aboriginal people for certain events? I will use an example where when Tl'oondih Healing Program was running, the only monies they were able to allocate or receive was those classified as insured health benefits which were basically earmarked for aboriginal people. On one hand you are telling us that the money is all put into one pot for everybody, but on the other hand, there are certain funds that are only earmarked for aboriginal peoples. Which is it? It is not clear. In regard to certain housing programs that were in place in the past which were designated for aboriginal houses such as the HAP Program, such as that, which flowed from a national program to this government to be delivered on behalf of the aboriginal people by this government. I think it is not clear in regard to the version that everything is put into one pot. We cannot account for it. There is no way of knowing exactly where these monies come from. I think there is a way of monitoring. There are transfer agreements which take place between ourselves and the federal government which clearly states exactly how those funds are supposed to be spent. I would like to ask the Minister, has there been an attempt to break down these funds and to identify those dollars which are classified as national aboriginal programs which this government administers at the present time?
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Jim Antoine Nahendeh
Thank you, Mr. Chairman. Mr. Chairman, it is true that there are two different approaches here. There is the Formula Financing Agreement which is a complicated formula that determines on an annual basis how much the Government of the Northwest Territories receives as a grant from the federal government. This is a general amount that does not really specify whether it is for treaty people or Inuit people. There are other arrangements separate from that, which are transfer agreements or charge back agreements which I am not totally familiar with. I think the host departments, for example Health and Social Services, would have more hands on than we do here in the Ministry of Aboriginal Affairs. Yes, there have been attempts in the past to try to determine if these funds are for aboriginal people or
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David Krutko Mackenzie Delta
Thank you, Mr. Chairman. My other question to the Minister is, the aboriginal organizations who are presently in negotiations in regard to self-government, have they been given the opportunity to have access to these agreements that presently exist? Has your department made an attempt to ensure that all this information is available to the aboriginal self-government groups? Are they aware the information is there so when they do establish regimes to look at health, housing or whatever, they are aware these program dollars are there, and they can take that into account when they negotiate their agreements?
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Jim Antoine Nahendeh
Thank you, Mr. Chairman. Mr. Chairman, the budget is a public document and it lays out what has been determined department by department to be spent in a given year. Part of it is general information available to the public. There have been requests by the aboriginal organizations which are negotiating to come out with a costing of different programs and services. We have requested this costing from the government system. We are still waiting for information in regard to this request for the costing that has been requested by ourselves for the aboriginal organizations. Thank you.
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David Krutko Mackenzie Delta
Thank you, Mr. Chairman. Yes, I was referring to the different national programs that presently exist and the Formula Financing Agreement that is in place and the chargeback arrangements that are presently in place between Indian Affairs in regard to health care and other programs such as that. In regard to the different transfer agreements that are in place, have those agreements been given to the aboriginal groups who are presently negotiating self-government at the present time?
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Jim Antoine Nahendeh
Thank you, Mr. Chairman. Mr. Chairman, I am not aware that organizations have requested these specific transfer agreements, like the health transfer for example, for aboriginal people. I am not familiar whether there was a request or not. Thank you.
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David Krutko Mackenzie Delta
Thank you, Mr. Chairman. Yes. The reason I ask the question is because I have spoken to the chief negotiator dealing with the Beaufort/Delta self-government negotiations who has stated to me that they have not had access to all the documents that the government presently has in relation to the different arrangements between themselves and the federal government. That is why I raised the question. That is where my question is coming from.
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The Chair Vince Steen
Thank you, Mr. Krutko. I take that as a general comment. Are there any further questions or comments? Total operations and maintenance, $2.765 million. Agreed?
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Some Hon. Members
Agreed.
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The Chair Vince Steen
Thank you. Grants and contributions. Page 2-41, details of grants and contributions. Total grants, $225,000. Agreed?
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Some Hon. Members
Agreed.
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David Krutko Mackenzie Delta
Thank you, Mr. Chairman. My question to the Minister is in regard to the grants and contributions. Are there any other funds that may be available to aboriginal groups in regard to the different contributions that may be out there? Could other aboriginal groups be made aware of them so they can also have access to them or is this it? Is there another section where people can look to see exactly where the different grants are for different aboriginal organizations?
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Jim Antoine Nahendeh
Thank you, Mr. Chairman. Mr. Chairman, these are all the grants and contributions we have in this department which are available to aboriginal organizations. The question was that if we are aware of any other grants and contributions that are out there that may be available to aboriginal peoples? I take it, am I aware that there are other funds within the total government? I think there are funds in the other departments that are perhaps accessible to aboriginal organizations, but I am not too familiar with each one of the departments. This is all we have in this department that is available. Thank you.
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David Krutko Mackenzie Delta
In regard to the different contributions, is there a contribution policy in place that different groups can go to because it seems there is always a need for money, especially in the aboriginal community? It seems there is always a real effort to try to get funds. A lot of times there are certain petty cash set aside somewhere where it is used to contribute to different things, such as assisting aboriginal groups with meetings or helping pay rent or those types of programs. Is there any sort of a contribution policy or some way of helping to subsidize the rent of different aboriginal organizations presently in place?
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Jim Antoine Nahendeh
Thank you, Mr. Chairman. Mr. Chairman, I am only familiar with this department and with this department for grants and contributions. We do have a policy within this ministry specifically for what we have here. There is no overall policy covering the total GNWT for grants and contributions. There are departments which have their own programs and their own policies. Specifically, there is no overall policy for grants and contributions.
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John Ningark Natilikmiot
Thank you, Mr. Chairman. Mr. Chairman, I believe a good portion of this page, the money is slated for the western aboriginal organizations. However, the budget for $75,000 is for aboriginal organizations for special events. What special events are we talking about here, Mr. Chairman?
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Jim Antoine Nahendeh
Thank you, Mr. Chairman. Mr. Chairman, the $75,000 is available for annual assemblies of the aboriginal organizations and for the celebration of National Aboriginal Day. Thank you.
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John Ningark Natilikmiot
Thank you. This particular budget for $75,000 is for both eastern and western groups? Thank you.
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Jim Antoine Nahendeh
Yes. There is a request from both the east and the west for these funds. Thank you.
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Some Hon. Members
Agreed.
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Some Hon. Members
Agreed.
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Roy Erasmus Yellowknife North
Thank you, Mr. Chairman. I see we have 21 active positions. Could the Minister elaborate on the number of people that have affirmative action status?
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Jim Antoine Nahendeh
Thank you, Mr. Chairman. Mr. Chairman, there are 21 positions that have been approved. We have 18 of the 21 positions filled. We also have an implementation staff of seven, which is at vote 4/5, which is a federal contribution. Of that 18, five are aboriginal.
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The Chair Vince Steen
Mr. Antoine, I believe the question was not how many were aboriginal, but how many were eligible under affirmative action? Mr. Antoine.
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Jim Antoine Nahendeh
Mr. Chairman, there were five aboriginal people and six are indigenous, non-aboriginal, long-term which are under affirmative action, so a total of 11.
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Roy Erasmus Yellowknife North
No. Thank you, Mr. Chairman.
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David Krutko Mackenzie Delta
Thank you, Mr. Chairman. In regard to the issue I raised regarding affirmative action, the Minister stated that he has some plan in place that he is presently looking at implementing. Is there a possibility of the Minister elaborating on that plan that he presently is looking at to ensure we increase the affirmative action numbers especially at this time, where this department deals with the aboriginal area which seems to be lacking in regard to the numbers of aboriginal people within this department?
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Jim Antoine Nahendeh
Thank you, Mr. Chairman. Mr. Chairman, the affirmative action policy has been with this government for a long time and with this ministry. However, we are very active in very key areas. We have 40 percent of senior management who are aboriginal, which is quite high compared to the other larger departments. We have looked at the ministry and there has been a review done and a report on the review. We are looking at ways on how to improve this ministry in regard to applying the affirmative action policy. Thank you.
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David Krutko Mackenzie Delta
Thank you, Mr. Chairman. In regard to the efforts that the department is doing, is there any sort of training efforts made to entice the aboriginal employees who are in the lower ranks of the structure to allow them to develop their skills by taking different courses or programs to move up the ladder sooner? I speak more in line of what is going on in the east where there is a lot of effort made to train aboriginal people with division around the corner to ensure there are a lot of aboriginal people in the senior management area. What attempts are being made to develop these types of training programs within your department to entice the aboriginal people to continue on with your department but also allow them to move up the ladder a lot faster by taking different training programs?
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Jim Antoine Nahendeh
Thank you, Mr. Chairman. Mr. Chairman, we just received the review and the report about two weeks ago and as we go through the report to determine what needs to get done in this ministry, part of the overall strategy is to look at ways we could have aboriginal people come into this ministry here and if it requires training then that is what we have to do so that they become part of the ministry staff with the kind of knowledge that is required. Again, I must emphasize that even though we are a small department we are involved in a lot of real key land claims and self-government negotiations. It would be very useful if we had aboriginal people in some of these positions. Thank you.
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David Krutko Mackenzie Delta
Thank you, Mr. Chairman. I believe yesterday I asked for a copy of the breakdown on the stats that the Minister mentioned with regard to the employees, different status of the different employees. He said he was going to get that to me and I was wondering how soon can that be made available? Also, he mentioned that the report has been concluded with regard to looking at the overall department and trying to find ways to improve that. Is there a possibility of getting that report also?
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Jim Antoine Nahendeh
Thank you, Mr. Chairman. Mr. Chairman, the request by the honourable Member for the status of the number of positions that we have, we will get that information to him tomorrow. As for the report, it is a confidential report for use addressed to myself and it is an internal document at this point in time because there are a lot of, perhaps you could say, very sensitive, confidential things in that report. It is not for the general public. It is an internal management tool. Thank you.
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David Krutko Mackenzie Delta
Thank you, Mr. Chairman. The report the Minister mentioned, will the management tool become a public document at some time so we can take a look at it?
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Jim Antoine Nahendeh
Thank you, Mr. Chairman. Mr. Chairman, the purpose of this internal review is for the ministry to see how we have been operating and see where there are areas to be improved. We still have to go through the report, analyze it and implement some of the directions that are in the report. There is no plan at this time to make it a public document in the future. Thank you.
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The Chair Vince Steen
Thank you, Mr. Antoine. I am on active positions, page 2-42. I recognize Mr. Ningark.
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John Ningark Natilikmiot
Thank you, Mr. Chairman. Recognizing the 21 positions here in this particular area are indeterminate full-time, that may carry us through division. Mr. Chairman, the transfer of PY from headquarters to the Nunavut area is imminent. If Mr. Minister has any information, how many of those 21 positions are looking after the operation of Nunavut? Thank you.
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Jim Antoine Nahendeh
Thank you, Mr. Chairman. Mr. Chairman, with regard to the question, most of the present people in this ministry are working in the western area on the different claims that are there. With regard to Nunavut, the Division Secretariat has been taking the lead in that area in dealing with Nunavut and none of the employees except one in the vote 5 area in dealing with Nunavut implementation will be transferred to Nunavut upon division. Thank you.
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Some Hon. Members
Agreed.
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The Chair Vince Steen
Thank you. Detail of work performed on behalf of third parties, page 2-43 and 2-44. Total department on page 2-44 is $747,000. Agreed?
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Some Hon. Members
Agreed.
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The Chair Vince Steen
Thank you. Could I have the Members revert back to page 2-39 where it says program summary at the top, Aboriginal Affairs, program summary, operations and maintenance, total operations and maintenance, $2.765 million. Agreed?
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Some Hon. Members
Agreed.
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David Krutko Mackenzie Delta
Thank you, Mr. Chairman. Before concluding this department I would be putting a motion forth later on with regard to the item which I raised about formulating some coordination between Intergovernmental Affairs and this department to look at the issues, especially in conjunction of the different bilateral arrangements between aboriginal peoples from the different jurisdictions if there is a way that they can consider looking at that topic and try to find a way of developing some sort of a mechanism or policy within house to deal with that matter. I would for the record, state that I will be putting something forth on this matter at this time.
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The Chair Vince Steen
Thank you, Mr. Krutko. We are on Aboriginal Affairs, program summary, operations and maintenance, total operations and maintenance, $2.765 million. Agreed?
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Some Hon. Members
Agreed.
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Some Hon. Members
Agreed.
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The Chair Vince Steen
Thank you. Does the committee agree that consideration of the department's estimates is concluded?
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Some Hon. Members
Agreed.
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The Chair Vince Steen
Thank you. I would like to thank the witnesses and the Minister. What is the wish of the committee at this point? Mr. Krutko.
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The Chair Vince Steen
Thank you, Mr. Krutko. We have a motion on the floor to report progress. The motion is not debatable. All those in favour of the motion? All those opposed? The motion is defeated. What is the wish of the committee? Mr. Ootes.
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Jake Ootes Yellowknife Centre
That we continue with review of Bill 8 and proceed with the Legislative Assembly.
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Some Hon. Members
Agreed.
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The Chair Vince Steen
Thank you. We will then take a short five-minute break to allow the department to prepare themselves. Thank you.
--Break
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The Chair Jane Groenewegen
We will call committee of the whole back to order. We have on the agenda next the Department of the Legislative Assembly. Would the Speaker like to present his opening remarks?
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Samuel Gargan Deh Cho
Thank you, Madam Chairperson. I have with me the Clerk of the Legislative Assembly, Mr. Hamilton. Madam Chairperson, colleagues, I am pleased to present the last budget for the Legislative Assembly as we know it today. However, like the Minister of Finance, I am feeling a little nostalgic. I would like to take this opportunity through you, Madam Chairperson, to thank the Members of the 13th Assembly, individually and collectively for their support to me as Speaker. I am particularly pleased that when we were sworn in to the 13th Assembly, we had among us 15 new Members. What I have found, as the longest serving Member of the Assembly, and therefore, the Dean, is that each Assembly establishes its own mark on the history of the Northwest Territories.
The 13th and last Assembly of the Northwest Territories as we know it today is no different. We have a tremendous responsibility and obligation to the people of the future territory of Nunavut and the Western Territory that will be created from division on April 1, 1999. To paraphrase an old saying, so it is said, so shall it be written. History will judge the actions we have taken and the actions we will take in the next few months. Madam Chairperson, I think it is worth reminding ourselves of the vision we have adopted for ourselves, which is;
the Legislative Assembly provides, within a framework of accepted democratic principles, an environment in which the elected representatives of the people of the Northwest Territories can, effectively and to the best of their abilities, pursue a common agenda for the collective good while taking into consideration the demographic diversity of the north.
Madam Chairperson, as your Speaker I would not only like to thank the Cabinet and Members for their hard work and understanding, but I would be remiss if I did not express my appreciation to the staff of the Legislative Assembly. We sometimes take the people behind the scenes for granted and I would like to thank them for their efforts on our behalf.
--Applause
Madam Chairperson, the main estimates before this committee today provides the financial and human resources that will take us to April 1, 1999. The Legislative Assembly is requesting an expenditure of $12,797,000 which includes a capital allocation of $282,000. The estimates of the Legislative Assembly are expenditures that are driven again, by legislation, political direction and historical trends. As we know, Madam Chairperson, these elements carry a price tag. The estimates reflect, as accurately as we can determine, what I feel are the financial and human resources needed to meet the demands as we know them today. Changes in the political environment are not unusual, especially in our jurisdiction, where we are undergoing profound political and constitutional changes. In preparing the estimates, we did not feel we could predict with any certainty how this might change over the next 12 months of this budget.
As you know, there will be 24 MLAs throughout the year this budget covers, but we will loose ten of our colleagues on April 1, 1999 when the Nunavut Legislative Assembly will take office. As a result we cannot foresee how the Legislative Assembly, Cabinet, standing committees and particularly our Nunavut and Western Caucuses will be shaped. Changes in this regard may require us to realign our expenditure allocations throughout the 1998-99 fiscal year. However, I am confident that we will be able to ensure flexibility in reallocating the dollars from within the appropriations before you today. The Management and Services Board has deliberately taken action to ensure services are continued to be provided, without disruption, up to March 31, 1999. The board has structured our major contracts and statutory appointments to terminate on March 31, 1999. This puts no restrictions on the next Assembly and permits them to decide on the level of services they would like to provide.
There has been no significant changes in the estimates presented to the Standing Committee on Government Operations earlier this fall. I am pleased to report, however, that the estimates for the Legislative Assembly will increase in the current fiscal year by $689,000 and in 1998-99 by $1,101,000. This is the result of an agreement signed on November 10th by the Governments of Canada and the Northwest Territories for the financing of elections in Nunavut and the Western Territory.
With respect to Legislative Assembly operations, the staff here will be involved in providing assistance to the emerging Government of Nunavut, with respect to staff training and the establishment of a functioning office, in time for the elections and swearing in of the First Assembly of Nunavut. Our staff will also be of assistance as the structure of the Legislative Assembly as the Western Territory unfolds. The future structure will impact on the level of services and budget allocations that will be required after 1999 and into the new millennium.
Some of us will not be around this table for the next review of the main estimates as the election for the First Nunavut Legislative Assembly will probably be held in early February of 1999. It will be a very busy year for all of us, both Ordinary Members and the Ministers. It will be difficult, as always, to balance our day-to-day duties to our constituencies, the work of the House, committees and Caucuses, and most importantly, our families. Madam Chairperson, along with my officials, I would be pleased to address any questions as to the significance of the main estimates. Mahsi cho.
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The Chair Jane Groenewegen
Thank you, Speaker Gargan. I would like to now call on the Government Operations Committee for their report on the Legislative Assembly. Mr. Erasmus.
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Roy Erasmus Yellowknife North
Thank you, Madam Chairperson. The committee held a wide-ranging discussion of the operations of the Legislative Assembly in conjunction with its review of the Assembly's 1998-99 Main Estimates. Issues touched on included elections before and after division, building maintenance issues, fire safety issues, the Chief Electoral Officer position, pension plan administration and services provided in the Speaker's Office. The committee is generally satisfied with the 1998-99 Main Estimates as presented by the Speaker. However, the Standing Committee on Government Operations wishes to comment on the following issues:
The committee appreciates the briefing on the current situation regarding the delivery of interpreter/translator services to the Legislative Assembly. Committee Members were concerned about the impact on interpreter/translator service delivery and the associated costs resulting from the privatization of portions of the Language Bureau. The Legislative Assembly must be able to provide language services in all of the official languages of the Northwest Territories. Former employees of the Language Bureau have moved on to other opportunities within and outside government and shortages of qualified private-sector Dene language interpreters now exist. This shortage has impacted negatively on language services to Members of the Legislative Assembly and to the public.
When the privatization of the Language Bureau was first proposed, Members of the committee expressed concern that although costs would initially be reduced, interpreter/translator services would not be more effectively delivered by the private sector.
In addition, there are serious concerns that the funding transferred to the Legislative Assembly to provide for this service will not be sufficient to cover the cost of language services for this or subsequent fiscal years. Members of the committee have also heard concerns expressed that other departments and regional staff face the same dilemma. The committee intends to closely monitor issues related to the privatization of portions of the Language Bureau. Thank you, Madam Chairperson.
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The Chair Jane Groenewegen
Thank you, Mr. Erasmus. At this time are there any general comments on the Legislative Assembly? Mr. Steen.
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Vince Steen Nunakput
Thank you, Madam Chairperson. Madam Chairperson, I will direct my general comments to a couple of items that I will expand on when we reach the program summary of the particular activities. Specifically, I would like to address the question of interpreters provided by the Legislative Assembly in this building and the service they provide us as Members. Madam Chairperson, I am not sure whether the government has really addressed the situation on the question of if, in fact, we are benefiting from contracting out our requirement for interpreters. To some degree the question is going to have to be answered as to what happens to some of these interpreters, in particular those Inuktitut interpreters when division comes. Are they going to have an opportunity to move on to Nunavut? I do not see the west being in a situation where we would require them although, there is going to be a need for interpreters for the different languages that are left in the west. In particular, I am talking about the interpreters that translate for the Nunavut MLAs at this time.
The other question I will be addressing is constituency assistants' salaries. Madam Chairperson, as we attempted to point out in the past to the Management and Services Board, as a Member who has four separate communities to administer and represent, it is very hard. I do not think it is realistic to expect the Member to divide this particular one into four separate pieces so that every community has a representative that I could contact. I do not think there would be enough money left after dividing it into four. In fact, five is what is required because of the time spent in Yellowknife, that there is enough funding there to actually allow a Member to act and to operate efficiently. By comparison, Madam Chairperson, communities that have or Members that have only one specific community to represent, it is very easy to, from my perspective anyway, be able to attend meetings and functions within that particular community which is, in fact, your overall responsibility right there in one particular community of the riding. Therefore, there is an advantage to some degree where Members represent only one community. Mind you, the communities are larger but in a sense you can be available to attend meetings or have your assistant attend the meetings in your absence. By comparison, it would seem that you could use the whole salary for one constituency assistant. I do not think we have been very successful in the past in addressing this particular issue and it does not just apply to my ridings. There are many ridings that represent more than one community. I feel this particular shortage should have been addressed at some point. Even if you take constituency assistants' salaries as a whole and apply it to one individual, they are not paid very much in comparison to the amount of services that are required of them. I will be bringing up those particular concerns, Madam Chairperson, when we reach the activity summary of the Office of the Clerk. Thank you.
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The Chair Jane Groenewegen
Thank you, Mr. Steen. In keeping with the process, move on to the next person who wants to speak and we will ask the Speaker to respond to these all at once. Next on the list I have Mr. Erasmus.
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Roy Erasmus Yellowknife North
Thank you, Madam Chairperson. The first thing I wanted to do was to congratulate the Speaker and the Clerk on being able to pave the driveway for the Legislative Assembly in one year when it was supposed to be done over the course of two years. They were able to save a considerable amount of money in doing this. Madam Chairperson, I think with all the visiting dignitaries that we have to the Legislative Assembly here, it was incumbent upon us to do this. I am glad we were able to do it in one year, as well save a considerable amount of money in doing so.
The other thing I wanted to touch on is something that Mr. Steen has already mentioned, the constituency assistants' salaries. I had an opportunity to look into it earlier and I know secretaries make more than the constituency assistants. I believe that at the time when people set the salaries for assistants, it may have been a part-time job and perhaps it still is a part-time job in some constituencies. However, Madam Chairperson, at the last election there were over 2,500 voters in my constituency and it is very, very difficult to serve that many people with a part-time assistant as well as having the person do research and helping to initiate new projects that a Member might want to do. In addition to that, when you have low pay for a good worker, good workers often will not stick around very long because there is an awful pile of better paying jobs out there. If you have a good person working then they will likely move onto another job unless they have another good paying part-time job. As I have indicated, I too, would certainly like to see something done to assist the constituency assistants get a better salary to live on so that we can do a better job and to ensure MLAs can retain good workers to maintain consistent service for their constituents. Thank you.
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John Ningark Natilikmiot
Thank you, Madam Chairperson. Madam Chairperson, communication is very important in this particular forum. One area that I would like to speak to in general, if I may, is interpreting and translating. We provide interpreting and translating because we have seven or eight official languages. I think I can say on behalf of my Nunavut colleagues, Madame Thompson, Mr. Evaloarjuk, Mr. Barnabas, Mr. Enuaraq and myself, I think we are very lucky in this Assembly to have travelled throughout the Nunavut area to the three different regions during the educational process, other training and job-related travel. In essence, we were able to pick up the different dialects from different regions. A person who is confined to a community or to a region from the Kitikmeot, it would be really hard for an elder, even for the middle-aged to go to another region and be able to debate without any problem. What I am trying to say is, we have three different regions and the three different regions have different dialects. Perhaps it was partly our fault from the Nunavut area that we have not, Madam Chairperson, requested we get three different translators from Nunavut. I can almost see when Nunavut becomes a reality, there may be a need to have three interpreters even within Nunavut, one from Baffin, one from Keewatin and one from the Kitikmeot region in order to respect the different dialects.
Speaking about translating, interpreting, communication; I do not believe the people of Nunavut would want to have one unified dialect. We do understand each other because we are fortunate to have travelled throughout the Nunavut area. When the Speaker talks about division and the operation of two governments, in that respect, I hope that we will keep that in mind. You know communication is very important. Thank you, Madam Chairperson.
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The Chair Jane Groenewegen
Thank you, Mr. Ningark. Would the Speaker like to respond to some of these general comments that have been made and then we will continue on with some of the other Members I have on the list? Mr. Speaker.
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Samuel Gargan Deh Cho
Thank you, Madam Chairperson. Recently, we have written a letter to Cabinet regarding the translation services and we may have a shortfall on the amount of money necessary to continue with this service. The other question asked, the response is that the translation services are now privatized. All services that were received under that are contracted. We may require an increase in order to continue providing those services. Madam Chairperson, the problem is we have not operated a year with this arrangement and we were unsure about how much money we required. That is the reason why we may be short and will probably need to request an increase.
The other concern that was expressed regarding constituency assistants is, in our budget there is $660,000 for constituency assistants for 24 Members. The Management and Services Board discussed the salary issue already and the best we can offer is in the area of holiday pay for $1,600 which we have included as part of that salary. The other observation, Madam Chairperson, is that some Members use their constituency assistant to hire a full-time position, others use part-time. Still further, others are using contracts. Other Members can use it to do projects, and also other Members can still hire constituency assistants on a seasonal basis, too. There are different ways Members are using it. Madam Chairperson, the constituency assistant dollars can also be complemented by using their constituency budget. There are a variety of ways of doing it, but if there is a directive from this Assembly to increase or to review, we can do that. Thank you.
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David Krutko Mackenzie Delta
Thank you, Madam Chairperson. With regard to the whole question about the constituency assistants, I think the points which have been made are good in order to attract good employees and to keep these employees for a number of years so that you have consistency. We have to look at the
Page 530 overall area of exactly what is the fair price on the market for attracting assistants in different areas, especially in trying to find someone for $28,000 or $29,000 and to keep them for four years. I believe it is going to be awfully attractive in regard to the ability to serve not only the communities you represent, but to assist the Member while the House is sitting. Something has to be done to look at the whole issue to try to find a compromise so that when we do find good people, we are able to keep them.
Madam Chairperson, on another matter, in regard to the whole question of official languages in this House. We have cutbacks in regard to the different aboriginal languages that are presently being offered, especially TVNC when we are broadcasting in different official languages. We have to keep in mind that a lot of the people we represent are illiterate and they feel more comfortable hearing an item being discussed in their aboriginal language and being able to grasp what is being said than to hear it in English where it is a foreign language in which a lot of items are discussed. They do not really understand the topics, but I believe that it is one of the fundamental items we have in regard to the Official Languages Act, which has been passed by this government to ensure that the public is offered the opportunity to not only speak their language in different public places, but also to be able to hear procedures that do go on within the government in their official languages. In light of that, we should consider to take another look at that matter, along with implementing some of the initiatives or ideas that have been put forth to this Assembly in regard to the Language Commissioner's Annual Reports to this Assembly identifying certain items to be carried out so that we are aware of the concerns.
We have to take the time to get a feel for what the public is thinking in regard to the way that procedures in the House are being presently conducted in regard to the television time where a lot of items are being said up front, but there are a lot of other issues which we deal with at other times, such as in committee of the whole or through motions and petitions, in which a lot of these items are missed. We should also take a look at that item.
The other concern I have is in relation to the turnover of the staff of the Legislature, especially in regard to the research people we have and attracting people that we have had in the past. We have seen a lot of people leave in that particular area where they have put a lot of effort and hard work into their jobs to keep us informed on the different issues or researching different matters on behalf of the Members. I would like to thank those individuals who have assisted us in the past and who are no longer here. Also, keep in mind, in that area too, we have to be able to attract good people and keep them. The Legislature should look at that matter. Overall, in conclusion, I would like to thank the Speaker, along with Mr. Hamilton and his staff for assisting myself in this House. Thank you, very much.
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Edward Picco Iqaluit
Thank you, Madam Chairperson. Just some opening general comments on the Legislative Assembly on the vision, goals and mission. Over the last couple of years, having been the rookie MLA and now having had an opportunity to reflect on the last two years of how this Legislative Assembly functions, I have found some very good things logistically as to how the Legislative Assembly works, the management structure and style.
I also note in the overview on page 1-3, that one of the mandates of this business plan we are about to look at, is to allow for the establishment of a fully functioning Legislative Assembly for Nunavut by April 1, 1999. That would be my major concern here.
About a month ago, when I was home in Iqaluit, I had an opportunity to look at the plans that were made initially for the temporary Legislative Assembly building. I understand that our Legislative staff have actually been working in concert with the architects designing that building. There were some flaws, for example, the library in the new building is 150 square feet, where this one is 1,500 square feet. Our Legislative Assembly staff actually picked up on that so I was very pleased to see that. I have some general questions later on, of the operations of the Legislative Assembly itself, the financial implications of the Legislative Assembly, the person-years at the Legislative Assembly and the hiring practices of the Legislative Assembly here in Yellowknife.
I would also like to compliment the Clerk, Mr. David Hamilton, on his recent appointment as the Chief Electoral Officer for all of the Northwest Territories, which was an Order-in-Council of the federal government, I believe. I would also like to say that the Assembly itself, the way it acts and reacts within its budget, has been very progressive. I would also note in my opening comments that the Legislative Assembly has tried to initiate some new ways of getting information out to the public. In this respect, the Legislative Assembly has put up a web page, which I understand is getting a lot of hits on the Internet. It is well done and very professional. I believe Mr. Sorensen is the Web Master. I have had some comments from my constituents on the web page. On that web page, they have actually put up new pictures of all the gallery, where you have people like Mr. Ningark, and yourself, Madam Chairperson, the Speaker and so on. Some of the pictures are very flattering, some have to be adjusted as I noted this morning when reviewing my own. Thank you, your honourable Member, Mr. Miltenberger. Those are just my general comments. I will have some good questions later for the staff, for the Speaker, Mr. Gargan, and his associate, Mr. Hamilton. I would also like to say, that sometimes in the Legislative Assembly, we get wrapped up in our own self-importance.
--Laughter
Madam Chairperson, that was demonstrated during the unity debate when we had this huge flag over the backdrop of the Speaker's chair when we were going to go live on TVNC, that C-PAC was going to pick us up, and everything was going to stop on Bay Street, and President Clinton was going to be tuning in, of course, none of that happened. Sometimes we get overly dramatic at the Legislative Assembly, and maybe that is something we could all take a lesson from. With that, those are my opening comments on the Legislative Assembly and I will have further questions on the fully functional Nunavut Legislative Assembly, staffing for Nunavut and other general questions on the operations and maintenance budgets of this Assembly. Thank you, Madam Chairperson.
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Item 19: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters
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The Chair Jane Groenewegen
Thank you, Mr. Picco.
--Applause
General comments on the Legislative Assembly. Mr. Ningark is calling line by line. I am sorry. Mr. Gargan.
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Item 19: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters
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Samuel Gargan Deh Cho
Thank you, Madam Chairperson. With regard to the concerns expressed by Mr. Krutko regarding the reporting of our session, we have the reporting done twice a day. One at 10:00 a.m. and one during the evening at 10:30 p.m., of either Members' statements or question period or both just to remind the Member it is being done and in all the languages. The other problem you mentioned with regard to the Languages Commissioner is that this department is under the overall operations of the government. Thank you, Madam Chairperson.
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Item 19: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters
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Jane Groenewegen Hay River
Thank you, Mr. Gargan. Are we ready to proceed with line by line? If I could refer you to page 1-6 of your main estimates book. Legislative Assembly, activity summary, office of the Clerk, operations and maintenance, total operations and maintenance, $7,472,000. Agreed. Mr. Picco.
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Item 19: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters
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Edward Picco Iqaluit
Thank you, Madam Chairperson. Madam Chairperson, I would like to know at this time, under the main estimates on page 1-6, how many positions are dedicated to Nunavut at the present time, how many we are training for the new Nunavut Legislature? How many positions are identified right now in that business plan for 1998-99? Thank you, Madam Chairperson.
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Clerk Of The House Mr. David Hamilton
Thank you, Madam Chairperson. There are no positions being funded from the current amount of money which are directly related to Nunavut. We do have positions, but they are being funded by other mechanisms outside the Legislative Assembly budget for positions that will eventually move to Nunavut.
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Edward Picco Iqaluit
Thank you, Madam Chairperson. Madam Chairperson, if those positions are not funded by the Legislative Assembly budget itself, it also means that, indeed, the Mentoring Program with our own staff here must be taking place with those students. I would assume those people are under NUHRDS funding. If that is the case, could that be clarified right now?
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Clerk Of The House Mr. David Hamilton
Yes, Madam Chairperson. It is under the Mentoring Program and we have two people currently. One is the clerk assistant of committees for Nunavut and the other one is a policy officer that was under the Department of Public Works who is working on a three-month attachment from Public Works in our research division.
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Edward Picco Iqaluit
Thank you, Madam Chairperson. I understand that the new clerk for the Legislative Assembly for Nunavut has either been hired or will be hired very shortly. Will that position be coming here to Yellowknife to work with Mr. Hamilton under a mentoring program and would that be funded out of this budget or would that again be out of the nearest funding or out of the office of the OIC?
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Samuel Gargan Deh Cho
I will ask David to respond.
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Clerk Of The House Mr. David Hamilton
Thank you, Madam Chairperson. The final details have not been worked out yet, but we understand it will be a combination of both working with the other deputy ministers in Iqaluit and also there will be times that the individual and other deputies in that area will be coming to Yellowknife and working with deputies and the Clerk, in my case, in Yellowknife.
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Item 19: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters
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Item 19: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters
Item 19: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters
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Edward Picco Iqaluit
Thank you, Madam Chairperson. Madam Chairperson, there was some concern last year when I was going through the main estimates and the numbers granted Therefore on 1-6, on O and M, concerning the pavement of the parking lot of this Legislative Assembly, I wonder if there is any contingency money that has been carried over to complete that work this year. Was that job done on time or, indeed, is there more work that had to be done with the landscaping or the area surrounding the Legislative Assembly itself? Thank you, Madam Chairperson.
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Item 19: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters
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Samuel Gargan Deh Cho
Yes, Madam Chairperson, I do not know what it is by way of process but it is under capital. We are under O and M so I am wondering if the Member might want to wait until we get to that.
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Item 19: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters
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The Chair Jane Groenewegen
Thank you, Mr. Gargan. Obviously you are a more experienced Chair than I am. Further, Mr. Picco.
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Item 19: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters
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Edward Picco Iqaluit
Thank you, Madam Chairperson. Yes, thank you, Mr. Speaker. I will defer that question on capital until later on that line item. I would like now to ask about the Office of the Clerk, on 1-6, which I think we are dealing with, which also
provides for the Members' amenities, allowances, salaries, their constituency office rent, the standing and special committees and, yes, the support services of research and library. I wonder if, at this time, the Speaker or the Clerk could update us on what type of logistic preparations have been put in place for the new library for Nunavut. Thank you, Madam Chairperson.
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Item 19: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters
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Clerk Of The House Mr. David Hamilton
Thank you, Madam Chairperson. As the Member had indicated, we have had some discussions with the programming for the facility, the actual facility that will house the legislative library for Nunavut. He is correct that we did find that they had not properly programmed the space that would house the library. We have managed to convince them that they need to increase that space. We have provided to the Office of the Interim Commissioner and it will be up to the Office of the Interim Commissioner and the Clerk-designate for Nunavut to hire one of the key people that we have indicated as the legislative librarian who would have the responsibility of pulling together all the collection and starting to establish and catalogue the legislative library and reference material for the Nunavut Legislative Assembly. It is now in the hands of the Office of the Interim Commissioner and of the Clerk, once he or she is officially appointed, to hire the legislative librarian who will begin to catalogue all the collection for the legislative library.
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Edward Picco Iqaluit
Thank you, Madam Chairperson. Under the library, that is good information. I am glad to see that, indeed, the Clerk's office is following up. I wonder, are we still continuing to make duplicate copies of all items, records, Hansards and so on, information material that could be transferred over to Nunavut and are those materials being transferred or are they held in storage here? Thank you, Madam Chairperson.
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Samuel Gargan Deh Cho
Yes, Madam Chairperson, all the material that will be in the library is being duplicated and it is in storage here in Yellowknife.
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Edward Picco Iqaluit
Thank you, Madam Chairperson. Under the communication services, which also falls under the Office of the Clerk, I am wondering if there are any new processes put in place by the Legislative Assembly for communication services, specifically the Internet services and/or an update on Mr. Erasmus' earlier concerns on switchboards and that. Am I correct in assuming there has actually been additional staff put in communication services, the PR or Internet web masters or something like that? Have you hired additional staff? Thank you, Madam Chairperson.
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Clerk Of The House Mr. David Hamilton
Madam Chairperson, I am a bit unclear on the question. We have not hired any additional staff nor have the financial resources to hire any staff directly related to Nunavut and the whole issue of switchboard operators and communications does not fall within the Legislative Assembly. The word communication is for public relations type functions.
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Edward Picco Iqaluit
No, thank you, Madam Chairperson. I will defer to the honourable Mr. Erasmus.
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Item 19: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters
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The Chair Jane Groenewegen
Thank you, for that Mr. Picco but, in fact Mr. Steen is next on the list. Mr. Steen.
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Item 19: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters
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Vince Steen Nunakput
Thank you, Madam Chairperson and Mr. Picco. Madam Chairperson, my question, as I indicated earlier, is what is the plan that we have in place here for the existing Nunavut interpreters? I realize they are on contract but does the government have a plan in place where they will have an opportunity to be employed in Nunavut?
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Item 19: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters
Item 19: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters
February 2nd, 1998
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Samuel Gargan Deh Cho
Madam Chairperson, in my opening statement I mentioned that we deliberately did all our contracts and our statutory appointments to end on March 31, 1999. The translation services provided to this Assembly is done by private contracts. Again, we will not put ourselves in the position of influencing what Nunavut will be provided. If there is a market there, then the people who are providing who service will have the opportunity to provide that service.
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Vince Steen Nunakput
Thank you, Madam Chairperson. Madam Chairperson, I think we all realize that interpreter service to an Assembly of this nature requires quite well-trained and educated interpreters. Therefore it might be said that, in fact, it is going to be hard for Nunavut to find interpreters of this quality. I was wondering, do we have any program in place where we would be training interpreters for the Legislative Assembly in Nunavut?
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Clerk Of The House Mr. David Hamilton
Madam Chairperson, there are a lot of very well-qualified interpreters throughout the north, not just based in Yellowknife and, in fact, we do bring in Inuktitut interpreter/translators from communities outside Yellowknife. They have to go where the
market demand is. When the services of interpreter/translators were privatized one of the responsibilities of the Department of Education, Culture and Employment was to establish a register of interpreter/translators so that clients, no matter who they were, could be assured they were getting qualified and experienced interpreter/translators by being placed on this register of interpreter/translators. I am not quite sure whether there still is a program in Nunatta Campus Arctic College for interpreter/translators, I am not sure if that is still going on. There are programs in the colleges that would train interpreter/translators where they can get experience. We have no program in place that would train interpreter/translators. The market is there and we are able to attract and have to pay to bring people in for that function.
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Item 19: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters
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Vince Steen Nunakput
Thank you, Madam Chairperson. Madam Chairperson, my other question is with regard to the obvious fair amount of empty office space upstairs, in particular, once the Nunavut MLAs leave there will be ten empty Nunavut offices. What is the government's plan to do with those offices? Do I have opportunity to use them for the constituency assistants that I cannot afford?
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Item 19: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters
Item 19: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters
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Samuel Gargan Deh Cho
Thank you, Madam Chairperson. The constitutional process is still ongoing right now. We cannot make any determinations on how many Members we will have. We might have two chambers. Also, under the NWT Act we still can have up to 25 Members but that still has to be determined. We do not know what the numbers are going to be yet and we are not going to know until maybe 1999. That is the best answer we can provide right now.
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Item 19: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters
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John Ningark Natilikmiot
Madam Chairperson, I move that we report progress.
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Item 19: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters
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The Chair Jane Groenewegen
There is a motion on the floor. The motion is in order. The motion is not debatable. All those in favour? All those opposed? The motion is carried. I will now rise and report progress. Thank you, Mr. Gargan. Thank you, Mr. Hamilton.
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Item 19: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters
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The Speaker Samuel Gargan
Good evening. The House will come back to order. We are on Item 20, report of committee of the whole. Mrs. Groenewegen.
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